Damn Barton Heat

[maverick]

Geeez...after browsing a different thread i came across Cathar's temps...those are some amazing temps!!!

I know that the Iwaki Pump is one hell of a pump, but i'm also running a barton 2500 and my Load temps are about 63C (stable)!! I'm running a water cooling setup that my friend (maxim-who posts on this board) and i created. I'm running my barton at 2370 @ 2.1 volts. Cathar, how the hell are you gettin a load of only 32.5? I see that your ambient is only 21C but seeing as how mine is about 28C i can't imagine that even with all those parts in your system that those are enough to have a 30 degree difference...i may be underestimating the efficiency of that pump and block and radiator setup...am i?

My main question/comment is that after calculating my C/W of about 0.25 (which isn't awful) is it just that the Bartons are huge heat producers or do i have some serious flaws somewhere in my setup? Do the steppings on the barton have any issues w/ regards to heat produced? Next time i take the block off, i will get my stepping ( i keep forgetting! ) and the rest of my setup is below in the sig.

By no means am i even remotely saying that mine SHOULD be close to Cathar's, obviously he has superior compnents and whatnot, but i think 30C is a very large gap between the two setups considering we are both running Bartons and he is about 400 mhz faster than me (which should slightly even the playing field since he would/should be producing more heat?)

Design of system below:

Pump -> Heater Core (cooled by high flow fan) -> Block -> Fish Tank -> Pump -> etc, etc

[Cathar]

Well, I was being a little silly in that other thread, but just to point out how silly some motherboards thermal sensors are. You can't really make comparisons.

I also report actual voltages, not BIOS settings. My CPU is actually set to 2.15v in the BIOS, and a 450MHz (~20%) higher frequency. All up, my CPU is probably putting off around 25% more heat than yours. If you're CPU was putting out the same heat as mine, the difference would probably be more like 38C.

Let's run with that 38C difference and try to account for it shall we?

The BIOS I was using was Ver 1.4, which reports CPU temperatures at about 10C lower than any other NF7-S Rev 2.0 BIOS.

So we have 28C left to explain.

The Iwaki pump isn't doing an awful lot with respect to the final temperature. Maybe gaining me ~1C over using something like an Eheim 1250.

27C left to explain.

The dual-radiators with car heater-core blower, now there's the trick. Radiator based water-cooling, much like regular air-cooling, is all about surface area and air-flow. I have around 3x the radiator surface area of a DTek Pro core setup, and probably around 3x the air-flow of a regular 12cm fan setup as well. My fans/radiators keeps my water very cool, down to near on 3C above radiator air-intake temperature. I'd estimate that this gives me about 4-6C on most other setups. Let's call it 5C.

So 22C left to account for.

My radiator air-intakes on right near the floor-level. Despite room temperature typically being ~22C the air-intake temperature is down around 18-19C. Let's call it a 4C difference.

So 18C left to account for.

You're at 28C ambient too, I'm at 22C ambient.

So, 12C left to account for.

This CPU does seem to be quite cool running by itself, giving about 3C lower temps than my other Barton XP2800+. I guess it's part of the reason why it is able to hit >2.8GHz due to lower internal resistances for whatever inexplicable reason that is.

So that's about 9C left to account for.

That 9C then is probably what the Cascade SS is offering. I don't know what block you have, but that 9C includes stuff like proper mounting of the block on the CPU, good thermal paste, good lapping of the block, and just the efficiency of the block itself.

So you see, it can all be a big sum of many small factors that can easily add up to ~30-40C differences.

[maxim]

i put a Cnurse probe under his CPU, so the temps are legit, not BIOS reported. after having discovered the Barton's crazy heat output, i didnt think his temps are that high. he does have a nasty AC fan that powered an air hockey table, but no shroud (yet). the block he made is pretty much what i did with my first attempt at #Rotor's design. when i was using mine i would estimate my system's C/W to about 0.26 (using 88% of calculated wattage when CPUburn'ing). assuming his current setup is close to that and plus the insane heat outputs of Bartons, his temps are about where they should be. and btw, he doesnt know his air temp, all he can do is guess. and a few degrees either way will give very different results.

and SS cascade on an Iwaki pump is what? like C/W=0.17?:cool: :drool:

[maverick]

max,

Yo i got a shroud now! :D

I can easily tell me air temp...i just use the thermometer on my fish tank ( i just let the water go below the thermometer and wait a few minutes so as not to let the evaporation cause inaccurate numbers)

i'm right at 28C and since the air is being pulled from inside the case, i figure another 1-2 degrees higher...so i'm somewhere between 27-30 depending on accuracy...

Either way, it is the rediculous heat output of the barton that amazes me and baffles my mind how Cathar hits WAY above me, lol...

Cathar...what is your fsb and mult and voltage settings? :)

[maverick]

Originally posted by Cathar
Well, I was being a little silly in that other thread, but just to point out how silly some motherboards thermal sensors are. You can't really make comparisons...

So were you measuring YOUR temps thru the BIOS or do you also have some type of probe under the CPU? If you were going by the bios temp, that is definitely way off, lol...but this is nothing that you prob. don't already know...i was using bios 18 and it reported temps about 12 C too low...so when i thought i was running 51C full load, i was actually hitting in the mid 60's...

so if you were going by the bios, then there is more like a 20 degree difference in our setups, which can be easier to explain (but still amazes me - obviously i should get a 2nd Heater core and lower ambient temps...that MIGHT help)

I'll prob. end up getting the refrigerant system from a refrigerator and just chill this stupid thing, lol.

Peace,

J

[Cathar]

Yeah, but I have insulated foam around my thermal sensor under my CPU socket, and the thermal sensor is coated with thermal grease and is bent to push hard up against the bottom of the CPU. The CPU, when inserted, actually compacts the foam and sensor somewhat, and seals the thermal sensor in pretty well.

No, I'm not saying that it's accurate, but the temperatures that it now reports are warmer than without the insulation & paste. This, of course, seems to be a scaling effect. Without the insulation & paste, then the warmer the CPU, the further "out" it appears to get.