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-   -   Another #Rotor style block... (http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=5036)

Puzzdre 11-24-2002 02:23 PM

Another #Rotor style block...
 
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here:

Puzzdre 11-24-2002 02:25 PM

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Just kidding...:D

That's my old, first timer block...

Here's the new one:

Puzzdre 11-24-2002 02:26 PM

here's another view:

Puzzdre 11-24-2002 02:27 PM

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hands faster than mind...(not such a problem though...:shrug: )

Puzzdre 11-24-2002 02:33 PM

And here are my temps: Idle 36, full load 39, room 25 deg Celsius.

What puzzles me is, with that old block (z style, 6 mm dia channels), I was getting idle 34, full load 39 - 40. It was restrictive, the new block flows muuuch better, but the temps are pointing to problem. I posted this in another thread, to explain things a little...
"So, found one crappy Y garden hose piece, re-drilled it to 10 mm ID. Changed crappy inlet barb on my rad from 8 mm ID to 10 mm ID (best I could do today afternoon). Problem is that Y piece is too wide so my 12 mm ID PVC tubes kinked a lot, so I replaced them with 8 mm ID silicone (only ones I got). Till later this evening I was pissed off enough with my small case and that Y piece, so I didn't have the nerve to take out and redrill another Y also in system, using it like a fill point/air trap. So that's another restriction (that Y is 8 mm ID).
The good thing is that my flow indicator spins like mad, which wasn't the case with my old block.
Now I'm idling on 36, with old block was 34. Full load with the new block is 39, with old block was 39 - 40 deg. Room temp are pretty steady these days, 25 deg. Two 120 mm Adda fans at 7 V."

The rad is Lancia prisma hcore, big enough for those two fans...

I also reinstalled block four times, with springs, without them...

Dunno...

Help?

/edit/ that 8 mm ID silicone tubes go from two outlets to the Y piece, about 12 cm in length (2 x 12 cm). All other tubing is 12 mm ID...

2nd/edit/ pump is Maxijet 1000, AMD XP 1800+ @ 1667 Mhz...

LiquidRulez 11-24-2002 02:59 PM

Man I tell ya.........you've got some serious patience to sit and drill all of those holes in that thing.
How long did it take you??

Puzzdre 11-24-2002 03:13 PM

Thx man,

It didn't take too long, maybe an hour or so, just for drilling the small ones...

Arcturius 11-24-2002 03:36 PM

It's hard to tell from the pictures, but I'm assuming the bottom plate is recessed, and then there are holes drilled in that to increase surface area? Or are you only getting flow through the connections between holes?

Code:

+---|##|---|##|---|##|---+
|__M|##|MMM|##|MMM|##|M__|
+--\                  /--+
|  \WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW/  |
+------------------------+




Side note: Does anyone know how to prevent multiple spaces being condensed into one?

g.l.amour 11-24-2002 04:01 PM

the total idea of this method is that one needs no mill. so actually there are only the drilled holes with connections made with a dremel.

@puzzdre; i had almost the same feeling when i first fired my block. u invest money, time, sweat, blood so it is normal to expect some sort of small miracle. but, the freaks we all are, gaining 1 °C is already quite an accomplishment. thats because most of the systems we got here are already exploring the boundaries of WC. i think we both got carried away too much at making our blocks high flow. remember that brain design?

what might be a good idea is maybe to start a thread (if rotor doesn't mind) where we open-source minded discuss what can be done through rotor's method. as it seems to have been established by rotor that noone should use his method comercially (and right he is), then everyone using the method can help further refine it.

BillA has already given me some food for though,... anyway, the rotor style blox might not be the prettiest on the inside , but it must be possible to make them as performant as any milled out block. if we try to copy the best known waterblock for what is wanted to achieve; and compile it into a rotor design, then any maze/spiral/atlantis design should be possible.

Puzzdre 11-24-2002 04:11 PM

Yeah, recessed bottom with holes connected into the channels.

I have read what BillA suggested, think I'm gonna try 1.5-2 mm base in one chunk 10 mm thick, and I have some 5 mm thick 5 cm wide copper here for the flat top.

I don't want to sound dissapointed, it is just that I thought that I made my first setup 'from the hip', and considered it somewhat crappy and ghetto, but had some nice temps with crappy block. Guess I expected more to happen on the temp side, not to idle on 2 C higher...

Yup, live and learn, let's make some blocks!

g.l.: if you need some 5 mm copper, I can send you some. I have one chunk 50 cm long. Wanna share?;)

g.l.amour 11-24-2002 04:25 PM

i was thinking more in the line of making some sort of plexi top. saves me alot of sawing + some weight.

and again, thx for offering. but sending one of the heaviest metals around by mail sounds a bit extravagant, no?

i thk i don't have the balls to make it 1.5 - 2mm. lets say i drill to depth 4 - 3.5 with the tip of the drill, that would mean that there are pits in extremis of 2.5 depth. given the crappy bench drill, and the error margin...

i think i will try to make something with a clearance(no pins) where the water enters the WB with very low BP thickness. and then have the surroundings a little more flow resisting.

anyway, what could be tested (since we didn't epoxy) is to disassemble, and put a flat top half. and watch...

Puzzdre 11-24-2002 04:33 PM

The problem will be dremel it to the depth of say 8 mm. At least with emery discs I have.
That's what I thought, 1.5 - 2 mm in the drill pits. A 'varialble base thickness' :rolleyes: ...

NP for copper, if u change your mind, half of that slab is free for ya!

I can try to make the flat top on bottom half, but the base is still thick, and the passages cutted to half. Think I'll just drill another one...

g.l.amour 11-25-2002 07:02 AM

never happy are we. think i'm first going to clean up the mess made in the living room, and afer that, start all over again...

Puzzdre 11-25-2002 07:17 AM

Seems that we are happy while in process/progress...:)

I just printed out and sticked the pattern on chunk of copper...
First lunch, than drill press!

Good thing though, we know the drill...been there, done that...it's time for some new mistakes!:p

g.l.amour 11-25-2002 07:44 AM

lool

Volenti 11-25-2002 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Arcturius


Side note: Does anyone know how to prevent multiple spaces being condensed into one?

use [code]

Arcturius 11-25-2002 08:57 PM

Thanks Volenti, that was really starting to irk me... ;)

Puzzdre: how are things working out? I'm interested to see your results, as I'm currently working on a new direct-die system, and I'm wondering if it's really worth it (besides the HOLY SH!T look people give when they see you have water _actually_contacting_ your CPU) ;)

Volenti 11-25-2002 09:10 PM

I've got a p4 with direct die water cooling, details here ,I'm quite happy with it.

Arcturius 11-25-2002 09:42 PM

I hope Puzzdre doesn't mind me hijacking his thread...

My first voyage into direct-die cooling was a K6-2 with the top two inches of a plastic pop bottle siliconed onto it. I added 14ml of water, and ran it for about 20m before I started getting air bubbles on the core. I didn't have a waterpump yet (and still don't have a decent one...) so I was basically just playing around.

I have since chipped the core, and it only works as a 166@3.5V (was originally a 350). Oh well. >:)

Brad 11-26-2002 01:00 AM

that block looks freaking amazing! Apart from the one hour to drill all the holes, how long did it take you in total?

The only thing you're missing is peltier support :)

Puzzdre 11-26-2002 03:33 AM

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Quote:

I hope Puzzdre doesn't mind me hijacking his thread...
NP

The results are satisfactional, at 25 C room temp, idle 35, full load 39 C. After changing the inlet barb to 10 mm ID, I got 35 idle, with 12 mm ID inlet idle was 36 according to MBM (if this is accurate at all). The pump is working quieter and smoother, this #Rotor's design really flows. I would say very low restrictive block. Seems the temps are little high due bp thickness of 5 - 6 mm (cannot say accurately cos of drill press being a cheap one, not so accurate on depth). Measuring the depth of the holes with vernier, seems like I got 4 mm hole plus drill point pit. It's little too thick.

Thanx Brad!
I really cannot say how long it took me to buil it, cos' I didn't have all the tools needed, went short on dremelling discs, short on tapping experience etc...It's all here in this thread (it started with a two pumps question, but evolved into blocks making):

http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...5&pagenumber=2

I can assume that whole block can be made in three afternoons or less with no hurry. I'm making another one, and with experience in this first one, it goes much faster. I'll post the results here as it advance. This is what I've done for now, in about 2 and a half hours of work:

Punched the starting holes, cutted the top half to size (bottom half was pre-cut), drilled mounting holes, drilled and tapped tightening bolts holes, all sanded on the sides to fit nicely.

PS, thx for the idea on pelt mount!!! Are the 4 bolts enough for the 5 mm coldplate? If not, I should do some rearranging in drilling the holes...:)

Puzzdre 11-26-2002 03:34 AM

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Here's preliminary assembly:

g.l.amour 11-26-2002 04:29 AM

have u sawed those pieces yourself???

nice work, i thk now those designs will go alot faster.

when changing the middle barb to 10mm, u got better idle temp; but what about load temps?

Puzzdre 11-26-2002 05:28 AM

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The load temp is still 39 C, it didn't change in any way...

The thicker (10 mm) piece is cut and flattened in machine shop, thinner piece I cutted with hacksaw, filed and sanded to fit. Man I wish to have a mill at least for this purposes!:rolleyes:

Yup, when you know the way, it all goes much faster...It took me about 30 - 35 mins for this (variable depth hehe, big THX again #Rotor!!!):cool:

g.l.amour 11-26-2002 05:57 AM

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wouldnt it be better creating some cavity in the middle with lets say a 10mm drill?

something like this.


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