[feathers]

BillA may have valid points but he also jumped to some wrong conclusions about me. I guess he's a 'shoot first kind of a guy'. I'm not too concerned about his background when his foreground attitude sucks.

Ok.. 130 W on an 80-90 watt heat-source works very well thank you (highest temp=ambient)

The 130W gives great performance for a 60W heat-source (ie P4 2.4ghz HT 800 and even when O/Cd to 3.2ghz) = 19c after 10 x CPU burn-in cycles on Sisoft Sandra.

The 130W gives good results on an 80W core and acceptable (sub-ambient to ambient) on a 90W core.

Where I concur with Bill & Ben is that beyond 90W the peltier struggles.

I have taken measurments for the 130W from a core power range of 60W to 120W.

I use Sisoft Sandra's CPU+Multimedia Burn-In test to establish the effectiveness of the peltier. I run the Burn-in for at least 10 cycles generally.

What's important to understand is that the Sisoft Sandra Burn-in for CPU puts the CPU through a much tougher assault course than your average 3d computer game.

I have loads of Burn-in tests on my system extending back over the past 12 months. All tests conducted on the 130W peltier with the CPU overclocked to 3.2 or higher and with core voltages from default upto 1.9 volts.

I have more recent tests recorded by a CPU logging program.. Tests which show the CPU temps during some of the latest 3d games (Chaser, UT2003 etc). CPU= 3ghz P4 800 HT O/Cd to 3.5ghz. If memory serves me correct then it's core will generate approx 70w at the default voltage? The highest temp recorded during gameplay was 14.xx celsius. Not bad for a 130W pelt, right?

If anyone would like to see all of these performance tests then I can upload them or send them out in zipped archives?

"These theories you dismiss so readily were not simply pulled out of some engineer's ass. "Well, I got different results testing so you must be mistaken" is just not a convincing argument without a very clear and detailed writeup of the (sound) testing methodology that produced them. You will learn a lot if you try to understand the tech docs and do the math.." - Agreed.. I think the wording on my site needs to be changed. Also the comments about "Watercooling being a waste of time without peltier" - was too extreme.

It's ironic that while some of you interpret my site simply as a sales site from someone with no regard for facts and figures.. I actually do follow theory, data and rules to some extent.

My wording (icetec site) suggests that I don't place any value on rules or guidelines. What you should understand is that the site isn't just a means to sell products.. It was born out of a genuine determination to cut through some of the bullshit out there.. But as you can clearly see.. I have taken this desire to break free - too far in many ways!

Your comments (the genuinely helpful, positive ones) will certainly be listened to and used to make the website more accurate in some areas.

What I won't be doing is feeding others with endless warnings about the dangers of peltier cooling (or any form of extreme cooling!).

The point about the 130 w peltier is certainly a priority issue for me (it was an issue even before I came to the forum.. Why? Because I actually DO research the latest CPUs in order to learn about their O/C capability and their wattage!).

I value constructive criticism and your words will have an impact on my website (and on my own approach as well).

If anyone wants to see the test data? Just ask.

EDIT: I do have some of last year's Sandra data on my website. The charts and CPU temps are clearly shown (there are two links on my site which show that data!)

EDIT x 2: "I use Sisoft Sandra's CPU+Multimedia Burn-In test to establish the effectiveness of the peltier. I run the Burn-in for at least 10 cycles generally." - This is the point I try to make on my site about "wishy-washy theory" (It seems
that you now have the impression that I regard all testing/data as useless).

What I actually meant was that if all you do is theorise.. You're not likely to get very far (and certainly the negativity surrounding peltier cooling would suggest that this is so). What I DIDN'T MEAN TO SUGGEST is that testing and performance data are useless. I spend MANY HOURS TESTING and recording the data. You will find some of that data on my website (I have much more on my Hdisk!).

The bottom line is that the icetec site is now too extreme and too anti-establishment (too many personal feelings and bitter resentment directed at those peltier scaremongers (they used to scare the crap out of me).

The performance fiqures I quote in this reply are not theory or make believe. They are measurements I have taken myself over a long period of time.

EDIT x 3: I have looked into Phase-Change cooling in the past. I would love to try it at some stage. Also interested in those cascade waterblocks (purely for their clever design and beautiful workpersonship).