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Unread 03-31-2005, 01:13 PM   #1
JamesAvery22
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Default This a weird setup?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...504858983&rd=1

Seen these things go on ebay a few times. Think its the same seller. Previous auctions went for like 200$+ and no one bid, for obivious reasons. I keep seeing them because Im searching for an iwaki pump and its in the description of these things.


Anyways, what I find weird is it uses a md-70rz. Which sucks like 400watts. Close to all of which will be dumped in the loop, right? And it only uses some 6" x 6" radiator. Im guessing the 6" fan on there is a screamer. The box is rated to suck 5amps, the pump sucks 3, so the fan sucks 2? Nice 200watt+ fan. But still, even with a giant fan like that, can any heatercore/radiator with those dimensions shed 400watts with ease? A 120.2 probably has more surface area and with two VHE deltas it cant do 400watts. My numbers just completely off? I dont understand how this thing can cool the pump, let alone cool the pump and some other heat source.
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Unread 03-31-2005, 03:39 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesAvery22
... Which sucks like 400watts. Close to all of which will be dumped in the loop, right?
is it right?
how much is getting dumped into the loop exactly?
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Unread 03-31-2005, 08:43 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesAvery22
A 120.2 probably has more surface area and with two VHE deltas it cant do 400watts. My numbers just completely off? I dont understand how this thing can cool the pump, let alone cool the pump and some other heat source.
Can't do 400 watts?
I disagree.
It all depends on what delta T you find acceptable.
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Unread 03-31-2005, 08:54 PM   #4
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thats pretty interesting. i would buy it and sell the pump. the pump will go for more way than the 100 dollars he is asking for teh buy it now
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Unread 04-01-2005, 07:19 AM   #5
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Ever since I stumbled upon your post yesterday, I've had the "Monkey Bites" to buy that thing since I've been looking for a new pump. Perhaps this'll be my jump to an external heat exchanger since I just grabbed it. Thanks for the tip. Anyone want the radiator, cause that'll be the first thing to go.

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Unread 04-01-2005, 10:22 AM   #6
JamesAvery22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoot
Ever since I stumbled upon your post yesterday, I've had the "Monkey Bites" to buy that thing since I've been looking for a new pump. Perhaps this'll be my jump to an external heat exchanger since I just grabbed it. Thanks for the tip. Anyone want the radiator, cause that'll be the first thing to go.

Hoot
So what kind of setup is that pump good for?
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Unread 04-01-2005, 10:36 PM   #7
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I'm betting it'll deal with flow restrictive blocks fairly well. As far as how much heat it adds to the water, I imaging a lot depends upon how cool the the pump itself is kept. In my current setup, my 1250 sits right in front of the exhaust fan for the radiator, catching quite a lot of airflow. Doing a similar approach with the MD-70RZ should help. Heck, I have a substantial amount of 24ga copper sheet that I could fashion fins from and affix them to the pump casing as far as that goes. Realistically speaking, I realize a lot of the heat generated in the pump doesn't get conducted to the housing for easy removal. It will be easy to measure how much heat it contributes to the water once I get it and I'll proceed from there. I got a notice already that it shipped. I was non-plussed at the $27US for shipping until I saw the shipping notice say it weighs 25kg! It should be here on Tuesday and I'll report in then. Hope my tubing and heater core can take the pressure. In pursuit of an externally located heat exchanger, I probably should order some more tubing. Wish I had thought of that earlier today. Oh well, I can play with it mounted internally for a few days until the tubing arrives. I've got all kinds of experiments planned for this acquisition. Finally, I'll dust off the water chiller that's been sitting on my to-do shelf for the past year and a half, as well as a whoopass TEC waterblock I want to try in a two stage setup. My electronics room is situated such that my PC sits about .3m from the wall that separates that room from my workshop. My intention is to place the external cooling solution, whatever it winds up being on the other side of that (cinderblock) wall and piping through it into the electronics room. Good sound isolation that way. Also, the workshop is unheated and for about 7 months out of the year, it's around 10C in there. I have to run a small radiant heater to work in there so that my fingers don't go numb. 2 months it's about 20C and the remaining 3 it's about 30C. Total run distance from the external heat exchanger to the PC will be about 1.5-2m and fairly level.

Hoot
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Unread 04-05-2005, 05:15 PM   #8
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WHOA!

It's a lot bigger than I imagined, especially the pump, but it's built like a "brick shithouse". Talk about ruggedized. The radiator is extremely well made and has my favorite Patriot fan on it. It breaks my heart that is had to be made from aluminum. Oh well, perhaps I'll sell it to someone enamored with an all aluminum system. Here's some pictures:

Overview:


Nalgene Reservoir and inline filter:


Radiator and fan:


Here's some perspective on the size of this beast!


I'm itching to adapt those 20mm OD pump barbs down to 13mm ID tubing. I'm wary of how my system will behave with such a high pressure pump. What is watertight with an Eheim 1250 may not be watertight with this MD70-RZ pushing it. Gotta go buy get some supper and pick up a new garage door opener. Hopefully, I'll have some time later this evening to play with things.

All I can say is this device is a remote heat exchangers dream come true. Looks like my Camaro Radiator will fit darned near perfectly in place of the aluminum one, assuming it can handle the pressure. New Tygon should arrive tomorrow.

Tim the Toolman would be proud!

Hoot

P.S. That wire enforced tubing was harder to get off than skinning a cold deer
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Unread 04-05-2005, 05:18 PM   #9
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Binford would cower in the presence of a 70RZ. that thing is absolutely huge.. I wonder what the head dump is on it though. it has to be astronomical considering how much eneryg it sucks up.
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Unread 04-05-2005, 05:31 PM   #10
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Hoot have you tried firing the thing up yet? I got one off e-bay a couple of years ago, everything looked almost new but they must have ran it dry because the pump was hosed. It made an awful noise and wouldn't pump much of anything. Took it apart and sure enough the impeller and housing were melted in spots. Just be careful. Don't change the input barb, it needs tubing that big so that it does not cavitate. Make sure it stays flooded.

Others: It will dump around 200 watts into the water. (more than most WC systems are trying to cool)
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Unread 04-05-2005, 06:00 PM   #11
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Here are the specs for the 70RZ.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg MD_WMD_CURVES.jpg (97.5 KB, 37 views)
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Unread 04-05-2005, 11:55 PM   #12
JamesAvery22
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Just a heads up to anyone else who wants one of those giant pumps :shrug:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...371455800&rd=1
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Unread 04-06-2005, 12:52 AM   #13
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Ask Bill about the 70z he had (or still has) one. That thing consumes 216W of power, likely will dump in the realm of 175w or so in the loop. These pumps run hot.
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Unread 04-06-2005, 07:01 AM   #14
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We wound up looking at carpet and linoleum and by the time we got home, I was brain dead, so no time to play with it last night. There was however a little bit of water (not skanky) still in the pump and radiator that would suggest that the seller, as claimed, ran it to verify it worked. I bought a new commode also last night, so I'll probably be setting it this evening. It's maddening when "Honeydo's" get in the way, but "if momma ain't happy, ain't nobody happy." The pump motor says 115VAC @ 3A. Iwaki claims that the pump does not dump that entire heat loss into the water, so time will tell. I plan on doing a rise from ambient measurement and graph with just the pump running through the system. I'f you look at the picture you will see that Lytron was smart in placing the pump right in front od the exhaust from that big Patriot fan. That's got to help shed some heat. Off to work...

Hoot


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Unread 04-06-2005, 09:52 AM   #15
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66ft head??? Mother of god... Thats about 30 psi, right?
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Unread 04-06-2005, 11:30 PM   #16
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Some times an education costs some money. I finally got a little time to hook up the pump in place of my Eheim 1250. Up til tonight, I did not realize the relationship between how restrictive a block is and what constitutes too much front-end pressure for that degree of restriction. But then, I've never seen 1/8" walled Tygon 3603 sucked almost flat like a soda straw in a too-cold milk shake. On the supply side, that same 1/8" walled Tygon ballooned to about 1/3 again its original diameter. Blew the rubber stopper out of my tee tube and across the room. Boy you sure couldn't sell Water Wetter as a bath product, believe-you-me! The dog woudn't come out from under the bed for 10 minutes. Thankfully, my system was not running at the time.

After changing clothes, blotting up all the water I could, recharging the loop with fresh coolant and putting a hoseclamp around that stopper, I had another go at it. By not allowing the pressure in the loop to equalize, the suction side hose did not collapse as bad but the air particles in the water took on such diffuse suspension that it looked the consistancy of skim milk. They would not rise up the tee tubevery far before being observed getting sucked back down from what appeared to be an atomizing effect due to the water velocity. I'm sure the high system pressure didn't help them expand much either. No leaks though in the heater core or blocks.

It kind of reaffirms one of my early intentions of using the system to build a two stage cooling solution. on the MD70 side will be the reservoir, camaro heater core and a Swiftech MCW462-UT. It will be coupled to an MCW6002 on the other side and the chilled water will be pumped to my actual CPU block with my trusty Eheim 1250 or whatever DC pump I might end up going with. That's my initial plan anyway.

And yes, the MD70 does dump some serious heat into the loop. More I'd estimate than my CPU and GPU blocks combined. The camaro core and undervolted Patriot fan almost kept the water ther same temperature as with the Eheim, it ending up about 3C warmer before I grew weary of the MD70 pump noise and called it a night. You sure could hear those jets in my G5 clone squirting. They'd probably erode the copper in the bottom of the cups given enough time. The microscopic air bubbles no-doubt exagerated the jet noise as they went through. Good way to scrub out your system.

Hoot
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Unread 04-07-2005, 12:31 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoot
...Blew the rubber stopper out of my tee tube and across the room. Boy you sure couldn't sell Water Wetter as a bath product, believe-you-me! The dog woudn't come out from under the bed for 10 minutes. Thankfully, my system was not running at the time...
Hoot
HAHAHAH awesome, wish you randomly had video footage of that


Quote:
Originally Posted by nikhsub1
Ask Bill about the 70z he had (or still has) one. That thing consumes 216W of power, likely will dump in the realm of 175w or so in the loop. These pumps run hot.
Is the actual measured input of the pump a lot lower than the rated? Guess the rated is startup draw? 70RZ is rated to suck close to 400w at 60hz.
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Unread 04-07-2005, 02:04 PM   #18
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Welcome to the Extreme club, where hose clamps are now a requirement!
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Unread 04-11-2005, 09:53 PM   #19
Hoot
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Well, the wife turned up the clock on reflooring, new carpet, wallpaper removal, prep and painting all the rooms on the main floor as well as the sun room. So much for late winter projects like the external water cooler. I'll probably sell the pump and/or entire assembly to someone with more time on their hands as opposed to blisters. Curse that Home Improvement Network on cable TV.

Add to that, the fact that this mega-pump, after running all evening appears to have blown a pinhole leak in my GPU block, at a weak solder point and being mounted on the underside of my card went unnoticed. When I powered my system up, I was greeted by four black bars on my screen where image should have been. After soaking in anhydrous isopropyl alcohol and baking it, the bars persist. Close scrutiny under the Bausch & Lomb stereo microscope revealed nothing, so I must accept the fact that this "green devil" killed my $400 video card. For that, it deserves banishment (at cost) to some new home.

I'm limping along on my TI4200 for the time being.

Hoot

Gray skies are gonna clear up, put on a happy face...
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Unread 04-11-2005, 10:25 PM   #20
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...and another one leaves the Extreme club.

Sorry to hear that Hoot. I have a feeling that my wife is going to pull the same thing, and I don't even have cable!
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