Troll Alert: Beware of LiquidRulez - Page 3

MichaelMuck · 08-23-2003, 01:34 PM

hmm, I dont have anything else to add, I said my piece. I guess I can take a pic of my rig so people can see the blocks I have. You can check my heat and see that I havent sold any custom blocks. For awhile I thought he had forgotten because of the death in the family, but when he never ONCE replied to any of my email's or pm's?

jaydee · 08-23-2003, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pHaestus
The justice system (small claims court) DOES work just like this jaydee. No judges like Ben in the real world (or small claims court would have a backlog of millennia). Here's how it would go in court (no lawyers most likely)

Michael Muck vs. Liquidrulez...you may be seated

judge: plaintiff could you tell me what happened quickly?

MM: I made arrangements to buy an item online. It was agreed that I would pay $45 up front and the remaning $45 when it was delivered. I never got my stuff after several months and I want my money back.

Judge: OK LR what's your side?

LR: I have composed a summary that I am going to pass to you in private summarizing my dealings with this guy, judge. It isn't for public consumption though.

Judge: Unacceptable. Did you ship the item?

LR: Of course I did

Judge: Where's the receipt and tracking info and proof?

LR: umm I don't have any

Judge: Judgement for the plaintiff for $45 next case.

LOL, whatever.

I would have to recommend everyone from this point not even think about buying/selling/trading on the internet from an individual. Not worth the BS that might come down on you.

As for Joe's comments that was more out of line than why I got banned! Interesting.

Blackeagle · 08-23-2003, 02:37 PM

MichaelMuck,

You posted that you have retained e-mails that LiquidRulez sent you regarding this manner.

Could you please post those? That should PROVE where the truth is in this issue.

JayDee & Ben,

Does it not seem strange that what you regard as the best reasons to believe LiquidRulez are sent only to the two of you?

If his e-mails to you are so strongly compelling he would want them posted here to clear his name. On the other hand if he sees the chance to manipulate you to his advantage, would this not be best done in private?

Conmen, which is really what trolls are, are extremely talanted in persuading others to believe in them. And thier storys seem to be the truth, except they can never be proven. The cons best story is often equally hard to DISPROVE, they are that way by design. Last a good conman is quick to defend himself by attacking his victom. This often wins them support.

I can only repeat, MichealMuck, PLEASE POST THOSE SAVED E-MAILS! ! Those e-mails may prove your case.

BillA & pH

Very good job regarding the troll issue.

pH,

Your babe page needs some work, those wouldn't compell very many for very long. You'll need at least Playboy level material if this forum is to work. But a good first effort.

pHaestus · 08-23-2003, 02:37 PM

that's bs jaydee. How about:

If dealing with someone you do not know or trust (trust to me comes from heatware.com and ebay resellerratings) then:

(a) demand payment before shipping
(b) pay the extra dollar for delivery confirmation if shipping USPS or ship it UPS or fedex where there is tracking.

Not rocket science. I have been trading for years online and the only times I have been burned are when I neglected these rules.

Blackeagle · 08-23-2003, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaydee116

I would have to recommend everyone from this point not even think about buying/selling/trading on the internet from an individual. Not worth the BS that might come down on you.

A valid point JayDee, anyone trading on line should use eXtreme care when dealing with individuals instead of companys.

And if shipping a item to a individual always keep proof and pay for tracking on those goods.

jaydee · 08-23-2003, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pHaestus
that's bs jaydee. How about:

If dealing with someone you do not know or trust (trust to me comes from heatware.com and ebay resellerratings) then:

(a) demand payment before shipping
(b) pay the extra dollar for delivery confirmation if shipping USPS or ship it UPS or fedex where there is tracking.

Not rocket science. I have been trading for years online and the only times I have been burned are when I neglected these rules.

This is how I have always done it aswell. Still suggest not bothering dealing with anyone. People have to much power, obviously, to just say "I got trolled by so and so" and everyone immediately jump on the bandwagon slamming away. That is BS pH.
First it should go through other channels before it gets publicly dumped on the forum. If the guy is going to claim someone is a troll then they should submit the evidence to the admin or mod or whomever. Then an attempt to contact the other half of the story should be made. If it doesn't get resolved then it should be allowed to go public where other members may have some info that could be useful such as BillA's e-mail and name. Otherwise your just opening up an avenue for anyone disgruntled with someone to say they are a troll and got ripped off even if no such event ever took place.

BillA · 08-23-2003, 03:19 PM

jd
do re-read the first page of this thread

the buyer was unable to elicit a response from the seller
I believe that had the seller's name and e-mail not have been posted, this thread would be just another lament

"people have too much power" ?
as in the right to complain about a non-delivering vendor ?
get a grip, cheat someone -> expect heat

now you think this is a total fabrication by the buyer ?
jeez, this thing is sprouting new heads

again:
jd - do you remember Una ?

pHaestus · 08-23-2003, 03:26 PM

Had liquidrulez responded with a tracking number or a receipt or slip from delivery confirmation then certainly I would have apologized. Instead we get a bunch of private statements to Jaydee and Ben and public chest beating (sue Procooling? haha).

Joe · 08-23-2003, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaydee116

As for Joe's comments that was more out of line than why I got banned! Interesting.

was just replying to a slam on the readers of my site. on your site you can do the same

jaydee · 08-23-2003, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by unregistered
jd
do re-read the first page of this thread

the buyer was unable to elicit a response from the seller
I believe that had the seller's name and e-mail not have been posted, this thread would be just another lament

"people have too much power" ?
as in the right to complain about a non-delivering vendor ?
get a grip, cheat someone -> expect heat

now you think this is a total fabrication by the buyer ?
jeez, this thing is sprouting new heads

again:
jd - do you remember Una ?

Do I think the guy just made it up? How the hell do I know with what is said here. I see this shit all the time, sometimes they do just make it up!!!! Thats why I sent an e-mail to LiquidRulez asking what the deal is because I have found him good on his word in the past. Did something really go wrong from what I read in the e-mail? Yes. Did LiquidRulez make and ship the original blocks? IMO yes. Did the guy get them? IMO No. So now LiquidRulez is out the cost of time and materials for the block and his rep tarnished. Michaeal got his $45 back even though it was more than used with the materials. Should there have been dilivery confirmation and a tracking # applied by Liquid with the information filed for future reference? Yes. Did it happen? no.

Did Michael really send all these e-mails and PM's? Well we havn't seen any evidence to support that as Liquid says he got nothing.

This whole situation is suggestion there is a lot left out of what has been presented. Oh well. Mike got his money back. Liquid learned to keep better information. We all learned what to and not to do.

Actually I do not know what went on with Una unregistered.

Now let's see if I can squeez $45 out of someone, for no reason this time, because we see what can be done here with this public "pressure" tactic and no one questions my post because we just assume I didn't make it up just because.....Even being I didn't show a shread of evidence to back myself up.

MichaelMuck · 08-23-2003, 04:14 PM

do the mod's of this forum have a history of pm's sent? This would put a end to this disscussion

jaydee · 08-23-2003, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Joe
was just replying to a slam on the readers of my site. on your site you can do the same

Yes, I got the point. It was how it was presented that got my attention. I got banned for making similar points and presenting them badly with harse words. Just making sure the double standard is known so people know what to expect in the future for expressing their opinion.

jaydee · 08-23-2003, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MichaelMuck
do the mod's of this forum have a history of pm's sent? This would put a end to this disscussion

Did you delete them? if not go into your PM center and select sent messages. They should be there. Surely you didn't delete it though. Making Liquid responsible for loosing the shipping slip kinds sounds hypocritical.

Joe · 08-23-2003, 04:17 PM

Double standard is always known. Theres stuff staff can get away with and readers can get away with... both are not the same though. Also it was one single comment not 3 pages of them like you

pHaestus · 08-23-2003, 04:17 PM

Yup Double standards and slander served fresh daily!

Joe · 08-23-2003, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MichaelMuck
do the mod's of this forum have a history of pm's sent? This would put a end to this disscussion

THis is a VERY delicate issue. In short NO. we have no archive of PM's. you delete em, and they are gone forever. And under no reason will the staff/mods or anyone be able to gain access to anyones PM's. so really sorta SOL in this case.

jaydee · 08-23-2003, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Joe
Double standard is always known. Theres stuff staff can get away with and readers can get away with... both are not the same though. Also it was one single comment not 3 pages of them like you

3 pages? I thought it was more than that.

pHaestus · 08-23-2003, 04:20 PM

If they are old though they may just be archived. Switch to "from the beginning" or something rather than last 30 days

Blackeagle · 08-23-2003, 04:29 PM

E-mails or PM's would both/each be helpfull in puting this to rest.

If the PM's are gone, post the e-mails alone.

MichaelMuck · 08-23-2003, 05:36 PM

ok, here's the oldest pm I have, sent 7/1/03

MichaelMuck
Pro/Noob

Registered: Jan 2003
Posts: 46
block?
I think you should send me back my money

__________________
Epox 8RDA+
XP 2400+ 2.401g (11.5x208)
9700 pro (385/355)
antex 550w truepower ps
2 256mg Corsair DDR 3200 C2
Techcool 2200 Unit (W/C)
White Water CPU block
3 WD 120g 7200 8mg hd raid 0
HP CDRW
Promise TX2000 PCI Raid

My Heat

07-01-2003 11:03 PM

pHaestus · 08-23-2003, 05:49 PM

well in all fairness, Liquidrulez has a gap in his post history from 6/24 to 7/30. But he had to log in to post on 7/30, and so he must have gotten a pop up at that time that told him he had PMs. I dunno why he didnt take care of this privately then instead of ignoring it for another 3 weeks and letting it turn into this mess.

I would post a similar thread to this one if I saw someone posting on a forum who had my money and wasnt sending me my waterblock and wouldnt respond to PMs. What else can you do?

MichaelMuck · 08-23-2003, 05:52 PM

ok, here's part of the last email LR sent 2 days ago.

You know damn well that I sent you 2 blocks...a chipset block and the 9700 PRO GPU block. And you know why I didnt want the extra $45 dollars ......because I didnt send you all the products in the original deal, as I sent you a note included explaining this fact....
And furthermore, I never received any emails from you after I shipped them out to you and I no longer have any of my previous emails to check to see if it was deleted by my spam filter, as that virus wiped out my system and I had to reinstall everything.

ANd even if I did recieve an email, I dont have to explain myself to you or anyone why I dont reply

I am going to contact USPS and see if I cant get a copy of the shipment details and who accepted it because it was delivered, as delivery conformation confirmed. It was shipped to the address that was listed in the transaction details. I know it was shipped to you because I wrote the address down as soon as you sent me the paypal:

XXX XXX
304 Iwestess Ave
XXX XXX XXX

Ok, this might be a prob:

xxx xxx
3041 w tess ave
xxx xxxxxxx

He still should have responded to my email's, pm's

jaydee · 08-23-2003, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pHaestus
well in all fairness, Liquidrulez has a gap in his post history from 6/24 to 7/30. But he had to log in to post on 7/30, and so he must have gotten a pop up at that time that told him he had PMs. I dunno why he didnt take care of this privately then instead of ignoring it for another 3 weeks and letting it turn into this mess.

I would post a similar thread to this one if I saw someone posting on a forum who had my money and wasnt sending me my waterblock and wouldnt respond to PMs. What else can you do?

I don't get popups when I have new PM's.

Mike just confirmed the wrong shipping address aswell which includes why Liquid may have just ignored further e-mails. I would have to if I sent the blocks with the explaination.

BillA · 08-23-2003, 06:47 PM

jd
it would seem that neither you or lr are much concerned with customer relations/satisfaction
if so - you are both 1st class fools

- when you learn how business works, you WILL realize that your customers ARE your business

ignore them at your peril

BTW, paypal does send the correct address, so the responsibility was the sellers

it is curious that no one has asked how I came to have that name and e-mail . . . .
he wanted something from me, the biggest a-hole
lol

what a pair of clowns

Blackeagle · 08-23-2003, 06:51 PM

well it is possible to shut off/block the pop ups in your edit options listing. But your PM's are also shown at the bottom of the forums list page.

08-23-2003, 01:34 PM	#51
MichaelMuck Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: SLC, Utah Posts: 54	hmm, I dont have anything else to add, I said my piece. I guess I can take a pic of my rig so people can see the blocks I have. You can check my heat and see that I havent sold any custom blocks. For awhile I thought he had forgotten because of the death in the family, but when he never ONCE replied to any of my email's or pm's? __________________ Epox 8RDA+ XP 2500+ 2.472g (12x206) @ 1.85v 9700 pro (385/355) antex 550w truepower ps Thermotek t-252 chiller White Water Block Neo GPU & CS Blk 2 256mg Corsair DDR 3200 C2 3 WD 120g 7200 8mg hd raid 0 HP CDRW Promise TX2000 PCI Raid My Heat

08-23-2003, 04:14 PM	#61
MichaelMuck Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: SLC, Utah Posts: 54	do the mod's of this forum have a history of pm's sent? This would put a end to this disscussion __________________ Epox 8RDA+ XP 2500+ 2.472g (12x206) @ 1.85v 9700 pro (385/355) antex 550w truepower ps Thermotek t-252 chiller White Water Block Neo GPU & CS Blk 2 256mg Corsair DDR 3200 C2 3 WD 120g 7200 8mg hd raid 0 HP CDRW Promise TX2000 PCI Raid My Heat

08-23-2003, 04:17 PM	#64
Joe The Pro/Life Support System Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,041	Double standard is always known. Theres stuff staff can get away with and readers can get away with... both are not the same though. Also it was one single comment not 3 pages of them like you __________________ Joe - I only take this hat off for one thing... ProCooling archive curator and dusty skeleton.

08-23-2003, 05:36 PM	#70
MichaelMuck Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: SLC, Utah Posts: 54	ok, here's the oldest pm I have, sent 7/1/03 MichaelMuck Pro/Noob Registered: Jan 2003 Posts: 46 block? I think you should send me back my money __________________ Epox 8RDA+ XP 2400+ 2.401g (11.5x208) 9700 pro (385/355) antex 550w truepower ps 2 256mg Corsair DDR 3200 C2 Techcool 2200 Unit (W/C) White Water CPU block 3 WD 120g 7200 8mg hd raid 0 HP CDRW Promise TX2000 PCI Raid My Heat 07-01-2003 11:03 PM __________________ Epox 8RDA+ XP 2500+ 2.472g (12x206) @ 1.85v 9700 pro (385/355) antex 550w truepower ps Thermotek t-252 chiller White Water Block Neo GPU & CS Blk 2 256mg Corsair DDR 3200 C2 3 WD 120g 7200 8mg hd raid 0 HP CDRW Promise TX2000 PCI Raid My Heat

08-23-2003, 05:52 PM	#72
MichaelMuck Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: SLC, Utah Posts: 54	ok, here's part of the last email LR sent 2 days ago. You know damn well that I sent you 2 blocks...a chipset block and the 9700 PRO GPU block. And you know why I didnt want the extra $45 dollars ......because I didnt send you all the products in the original deal, as I sent you a note included explaining this fact.... And furthermore, I never received any emails from you after I shipped them out to you and I no longer have any of my previous emails to check to see if it was deleted by my spam filter, as that virus wiped out my system and I had to reinstall everything. ANd even if I did recieve an email, I dont have to explain myself to you or anyone why I dont reply I am going to contact USPS and see if I cant get a copy of the shipment details and who accepted it because it was delivered, as delivery conformation confirmed. It was shipped to the address that was listed in the transaction details. I know it was shipped to you because I wrote the address down as soon as you sent me the paypal: XXX XXX 304 Iwestess Ave XXX XXX XXX Ok, this might be a prob: xxx xxx 3041 w tess ave xxx xxxxxxx He still should have responded to my email's, pm's __________________ Epox 8RDA+ XP 2500+ 2.472g (12x206) @ 1.85v 9700 pro (385/355) antex 550w truepower ps Thermotek t-252 chiller White Water Block Neo GPU & CS Blk 2 256mg Corsair DDR 3200 C2 3 WD 120g 7200 8mg hd raid 0 HP CDRW Promise TX2000 PCI Raid My Heat

08-23-2003, 02:37 PM	#53
Blackeagle Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: U.S.A = Michigan Posts: 1,243	MichaelMuck, You posted that you have retained e-mails that LiquidRulez sent you regarding this manner. Could you please post those? That should PROVE where the truth is in this issue. JayDee & Ben, Does it not seem strange that what you regard as the best reasons to believe LiquidRulez are sent only to the two of you? If his e-mails to you are so strongly compelling he would want them posted here to clear his name. On the other hand if he sees the chance to manipulate you to his advantage, would this not be best done in private? Conmen, which is really what trolls are, are extremely talanted in persuading others to believe in them. And thier storys seem to be the truth, except they can never be proven. The cons best story is often equally hard to DISPROVE, they are that way by design. Last a good conman is quick to defend himself by attacking his victom. This often wins them support. I can only repeat, MichealMuck, PLEASE POST THOSE SAVED E-MAILS! ! Those e-mails may prove your case. BillA & pH Very good job regarding the troll issue. pH, Your babe page needs some work, those wouldn't compell very many for very long. You'll need at least Playboy level material if this forum is to work. But a good first effort.

08-23-2003, 02:37 PM	#54
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	that's bs jaydee. How about: If dealing with someone you do not know or trust (trust to me comes from heatware.com and ebay resellerratings) then: (a) demand payment before shipping (b) pay the extra dollar for delivery confirmation if shipping USPS or ship it UPS or fedex where there is tracking. Not rocket science. I have been trading for years online and the only times I have been burned are when I neglected these rules.

08-23-2003, 03:19 PM	#57
BillA CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered" Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Posts: 2,371.493,106 Posts: 4,440	jd do re-read the first page of this thread the buyer was unable to elicit a response from the seller I believe that had the seller's name and e-mail not have been posted, this thread would be just another lament "people have too much power" ? as in the right to complain about a non-delivering vendor ? get a grip, cheat someone -> expect heat now you think this is a total fabrication by the buyer ? jeez, this thing is sprouting new heads again: jd - do you remember Una ?

08-23-2003, 03:26 PM	#58
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	Had liquidrulez responded with a tracking number or a receipt or slip from delivery confirmation then certainly I would have apologized. Instead we get a bunch of private statements to Jaydee and Ben and public chest beating (sue Procooling? haha).

08-23-2003, 04:20 PM	#68
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	If they are old though they may just be archived. Switch to "from the beginning" or something rather than last 30 days

08-23-2003, 04:29 PM	#69
Blackeagle Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: U.S.A = Michigan Posts: 1,243	E-mails or PM's would both/each be helpfull in puting this to rest. If the PM's are gone, post the e-mails alone.

08-23-2003, 05:49 PM	#71
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	well in all fairness, Liquidrulez has a gap in his post history from 6/24 to 7/30. But he had to log in to post on 7/30, and so he must have gotten a pop up at that time that told him he had PMs. I dunno why he didnt take care of this privately then instead of ignoring it for another 3 weeks and letting it turn into this mess. I would post a similar thread to this one if I saw someone posting on a forum who had my money and wasnt sending me my waterblock and wouldnt respond to PMs. What else can you do?

08-23-2003, 06:47 PM	#74
BillA CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered" Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Posts: 2,371.493,106 Posts: 4,440	jd it would seem that neither you or lr are much concerned with customer relations/satisfaction if so - you are both 1st class fools - when you learn how business works, you WILL realize that your customers ARE your business ignore them at your peril BTW, paypal does send the correct address, so the responsibility was the sellers it is curious that no one has asked how I came to have that name and e-mail . . . . he wanted something from me, the biggest a-hole lol what a pair of clowns

08-23-2003, 06:51 PM	#75
Blackeagle Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: U.S.A = Michigan Posts: 1,243	well it is possible to shut off/block the pop ups in your edit options listing. But your PM's are also shown at the bottom of the forums list page.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)