Temps!!!!

Chad2 · 02-13-2003, 07:44 PM

i have a p4 a 1.6ghz with 256mb pc3200 ram on a BD7 ll-raid board. the cooling is a swift tech MCW5000 water block on the cpu, and old BE cooling waer block on the north bridge (where my problem is), all being cooled with my six ft bong cooling tower (this has about 6 layers of gutter cover twisted together, makes it quite and gives the water more time to evaporate). ok so for starters, my water temp stays about 5 C (10-12 F) below ambiet (so about 16 C or 60 F). well, before i put the water block on the northbridge i could never oc more then 2.6ghz (2.4 stable). The temp of it would never go above 50 C. now, as soon as i put the water block on it, i could oc to 2.8ghz (2.6 stable). now the problem is that i put it to 2.4 just to see if the temps are better on it with water cooling, well, it turned out, they are really high. for example, last night i ran 3dmark03 (at 2.4), it got all the way up to 66 C (pretty high, shouldnt it be lower??). then i put it to 2.8, the northbridge got all the way up to 98 C (thats right 98, hey, now i can boil some water :-) ). well, i just want to know, are theses temps right? cause if they are, how come when i have the water block on it i can oc more if it doesnt keep it as cool.

How i mounted it: i used the same mount as the heat sink (the bar that clips on the bottum left and upper right), but what i did is, i made a line about 1-2mm deep across the waterblock where the bar would sit in. and i also put the paid from the heat sink on it. it sits pretty tight and doesnt move around, when i take it off, it looks like there was contact between the core and the water block. so i think it is mount well enough.

any ways, if u have any answers on how to mount it better or if i should even worry about these temps. none of this is making sense to me because the cooling seems to not be as good, but i can oc more, so HELP.

Chad

SonixOS · 02-13-2003, 07:47 PM

I think if you developed your own suspension mechanism will provide you with optimum conduction. Look at how the Maze 1c is held down to the motherboard and think of a design that uses a similar type of thing for your waterblock. I think that would work well.

Chad2 · 02-13-2003, 07:49 PM

how can i do that. There are no holes on the motherboard to mount it down like you would to the cpu. I thought of using hooks with threaded tops so that i could hook the loops and tigten it down like that. but where would i get something like that or how could i make it. also. it seems to fit pretty snug now so im not sure if that would solve the problem

SonixOS · 02-13-2003, 07:52 PM

dude. go look at how the Maze1c is held down. it DOES NOT use any mounting holes. foo!

BrianW · 02-13-2003, 08:26 PM

Harsh relpy SonixOS!!!

Maybe you should understand his question before you flame him. He is saying he has no holes in his motherboard to use in mounting. The Maze1C that you refer to uses the socket on the motherboard to mount to the cpu.....

As far as help for your question Chad, if it were me, and there were no mounting holes on my motherboard, I would just epoxy the cooler to the chip.

Brian W

SonixOS · 02-13-2003, 08:39 PM

heh. he's my best friend. he lived in my neighborhood before he moved to college. in other words, he's mah homie. He's still a 20 min distance from me though. not that far.

I have a design in mind that i will show him how to do it when I see you.

Chad2 · 02-13-2003, 08:41 PM

do u think that would hold it up better then the way i have it mounted now. i will take a pic tonight and post it tomarrow to show u how its mounted now more clearly. but thanks for ur help. and sonix is my friend, he is just messing with me, not bashing. thanks again and i will post the pic so u can check it out

ambient · 02-14-2003, 10:59 AM

sup with your water flow. What pump are you using? could be that you just don't have good enough flow through the block. That would account for the high cpu temps and cold water

Chad2 · 02-14-2003, 11:57 AM

the block is cold to the touch, and my cpu is running off the same pump and water. the water feels cold going into the bong cooler, so im sure its not the flow or the temp of the water. i think that it might be a reading error on the sensor or, i dont know. the mount isnt great but its on snug, it wont wiggle around. and like i said, the block feels cold to the touch, even when it gets up to 100 C (i ran 3d mark again oc to 2.8 northbrifge got up to 108C, wierd part is, it doesnt crash). so im wondering if i should even worry about the temp. do u think i should ignor it?

chad

jaydee · 02-14-2003, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chad2
the block feels cold to the touch, even when it gets up to 100 C (i ran 3d mark again oc to 2.8 northbrifge got up to 108C, wierd part is, it doesnt crash). so im wondering if i should even worry about the temp. do u think i should ignor it?

chad

You wearing welding gloves? I assume you mean 100F ?

Chad2 · 02-14-2003, 12:24 PM

no, i mean. the computer says that the northbridge is at 108 C (YES THAT IS C NOT F). and yes it is cold to the touch (with my bare hand). once i go home this weekend i will bring up my ir thermometer and test it. but im telling u this. the block is not HOT like i think it would with temps like that.

Chad2 · 02-14-2003, 01:04 PM

here are the temps

Chad2 · 02-14-2003, 01:08 PM

here is a pic of the set up

Chad2 · 02-14-2003, 01:09 PM

here is a pic of the mount

Blackeagle · 02-14-2003, 01:33 PM

In your first post you said that in mounting the NB block you used the "paid" from the original heat sink. Do you mean the thermal pad that stuck the original heat sink on?

IF so that may well be the problem, might want to do as BrainW suggested and remove that thermal pad and put it on with some good termal epoxy. A better TIM will have to help.

With the NB block cool to the touch but the board reporting 100C it has to be in the TIM or the boards reading really crazy, best I can see.

Chad2 · 02-14-2003, 01:38 PM

i have artic silver 3 thermal paste on it. when i take it off u can see the marks it leaves in the thin layer. also, i dont know if it is the temps on the motherboard because when i had the stock heatsink, it had temps of like 55 maybe 60, but i couldnt oc more then 2.6. so i dont know, its all confusing. i have been working on cooling systems for a while, and everything seems like it should be working. but..... tell me what u think

chad

ps: do u think i should get the epoxy and use that insteadwith the mount, but i dont know how it would improve it considering i have thermal paste on it now

Chad2 · 02-14-2003, 01:40 PM

also, when i say cold id ont me COLD COLD, like it feels like soemthign at room temp, and when u remove ur finger the tip feels a little cooler.

Blackeagle · 02-14-2003, 02:04 PM

Guess it wouldn't hurt to remount it with epoxy in case the hose torqe is causeing a poor contact between the block and the NB that your wire retainer isn't controling fully. Crazy how your O/C is good, it may well be the board's readings at fault. :shrug:

Best of luck, but let us know what you find is the cause.

SonixOS · 02-14-2003, 06:09 PM

thanks, ill try to get some epoxy and ill let u know how it turns out.
thanks again
chad

jaydee · 02-14-2003, 08:16 PM

That POS wire is not going to give that block even close to good enough pressure on the north bridge! That is a heavy block with hoses attached. it needs to be bolted down some how. 100C is going to light the silicone on fire. Pretty good chance the temps are way wrong.

Conversion:

Quote:

100 degree Celsius = 212 degree Fahrenheit

AMD CPU's are only rated to withstand 85-95C before they die. I can't see how the NB could withstand such heat and you would definatly be burning your finger at 212F!

jaydee · 02-14-2003, 08:17 PM

I also bet you have MBM setup wrong. Make sure you have the right mobo selected when installing it.

Chad2 · 02-14-2003, 10:57 PM

the temps match what is says in the bios. also, i didt want to mount it that way, but i dont know how else to mount it, do u think that the epoxy would help with holding the block on it. and if its not on there as good as the heatsink was, then that brings up the other ?. why does it oc 200mhz faster. (before with heatsink 2.4 stable, 2.6 max. Now 2.6 stable, 2.8 pretty stable but will crash once in a while). thanks again
chad

jaydee · 02-14-2003, 11:02 PM

Your temps are not right. So untill that is rectified nothing else will add up. I don't know if your bios is messed up or the probes or what. But if it was 212F things would be melting down!

UnloadeD · 02-15-2003, 12:03 AM

I wouldn't mount it to NB with epoxy for a couple of reasons. Mainly because it would be semi-permanent. When I install a new water setup, I put it all in dry, getting tubing cut to length and twisted right directions. Then I remove it all while components are still conected, fill it outside of the case, do the twists/turns required to remove all the air, then let it run for a while. Then I put it back in the case, and let it run for a while making sure there are no leaks from installing, then I power on the computer. All of this would be very hard to do if the NB block is attached permanently. I would go with trying to get some kind of plate and threaded hooks like you mentioned earlier. I don't know what to tell you about your temps. Have you recently changed bios? It seems to me the reported temps have to be wrong. I would see if anybody else with same m/b is reporting trobles and if they found a fiix.

peace.
unloaded

02-13-2003, 07:44 PM	#1
Chad2 Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 12	Temps!!!! i have a p4 a 1.6ghz with 256mb pc3200 ram on a BD7 ll-raid board. the cooling is a swift tech MCW5000 water block on the cpu, and old BE cooling waer block on the north bridge (where my problem is), all being cooled with my six ft bong cooling tower (this has about 6 layers of gutter cover twisted together, makes it quite and gives the water more time to evaporate). ok so for starters, my water temp stays about 5 C (10-12 F) below ambiet (so about 16 C or 60 F). well, before i put the water block on the northbridge i could never oc more then 2.6ghz (2.4 stable). The temp of it would never go above 50 C. now, as soon as i put the water block on it, i could oc to 2.8ghz (2.6 stable). now the problem is that i put it to 2.4 just to see if the temps are better on it with water cooling, well, it turned out, they are really high. for example, last night i ran 3dmark03 (at 2.4), it got all the way up to 66 C (pretty high, shouldnt it be lower??). then i put it to 2.8, the northbridge got all the way up to 98 C (thats right 98, hey, now i can boil some water :-) ). well, i just want to know, are theses temps right? cause if they are, how come when i have the water block on it i can oc more if it doesnt keep it as cool. How i mounted it: i used the same mount as the heat sink (the bar that clips on the bottum left and upper right), but what i did is, i made a line about 1-2mm deep across the waterblock where the bar would sit in. and i also put the paid from the heat sink on it. it sits pretty tight and doesnt move around, when i take it off, it looks like there was contact between the core and the water block. so i think it is mount well enough. any ways, if u have any answers on how to mount it better or if i should even worry about these temps. none of this is making sense to me because the cooling seems to not be as good, but i can oc more, so HELP. Chad

02-13-2003, 07:47 PM	#2
SonixOS Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 282	I think if you developed your own suspension mechanism will provide you with optimum conduction. Look at how the Maze 1c is held down to the motherboard and think of a design that uses a similar type of thing for your waterblock. I think that would work well. __________________ -sonix- ======================= Antec SX830 Abit KR7A-133 MSI Geforce3 Ti200 VT128 TV-IN and TV-OUT Sound Blaster Audigy Linksys LNE100 V2.0 Toshiba DVD Drive 40x/16x IBM Deskstar 60GXP 60gig Watercooled http://www.sonixnet.tk =======================

02-13-2003, 07:52 PM	#4
SonixOS Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 282	dude. go look at how the Maze1c is held down. it DOES NOT use any mounting holes. foo! __________________ -sonix- ======================= Antec SX830 Abit KR7A-133 MSI Geforce3 Ti200 VT128 TV-IN and TV-OUT Sound Blaster Audigy Linksys LNE100 V2.0 Toshiba DVD Drive 40x/16x IBM Deskstar 60GXP 60gig Watercooled http://www.sonixnet.tk =======================

02-13-2003, 08:26 PM	#5
BrianW Cooling Savant Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Desert City in California Posts: 631	Harsh relpy SonixOS!!! Maybe you should understand his question before you flame him. He is saying he has no holes in his motherboard to use in mounting. The Maze1C that you refer to uses the socket on the motherboard to mount to the cpu..... As far as help for your question Chad, if it were me, and there were no mounting holes on my motherboard, I would just epoxy the cooler to the chip. Brian W __________________ Water Cooled Inwin Q500 (Dual Rads: Rad1 = DTEK Pro Core \| Rad2 = Blick Ice Estreme, Hydor L30, Dangerden Maze2, Bay Res Typhoon Reservoir, 1/2 " DD Tygon Thick Wall Hose). Flow: Res, Pump, CPU watervlock, Y into both rads, both rads into res independently. Athlon XP 1800+ (@ 1731 - 150mhz fsb.), on a Asus A7N266-c, and a Radeon 9000 *waiting for RMA'd Saphire 9800 ultra from Newegg)

02-13-2003, 08:39 PM	#6
SonixOS Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 282	heh. he's my best friend. he lived in my neighborhood before he moved to college. in other words, he's mah homie. He's still a 20 min distance from me though. not that far. I have a design in mind that i will show him how to do it when I see you. __________________ -sonix- ======================= Antec SX830 Abit KR7A-133 MSI Geforce3 Ti200 VT128 TV-IN and TV-OUT Sound Blaster Audigy Linksys LNE100 V2.0 Toshiba DVD Drive 40x/16x IBM Deskstar 60GXP 60gig Watercooled http://www.sonixnet.tk =======================

02-13-2003, 07:49 PM	#3
Chad2 Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 12	how can i do that. There are no holes on the motherboard to mount it down like you would to the cpu. I thought of using hooks with threaded tops so that i could hook the loops and tigten it down like that. but where would i get something like that or how could i make it. also. it seems to fit pretty snug now so im not sure if that would solve the problem

02-13-2003, 08:41 PM	#7
Chad2 Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 12	do u think that would hold it up better then the way i have it mounted now. i will take a pic tonight and post it tomarrow to show u how its mounted now more clearly. but thanks for ur help. and sonix is my friend, he is just messing with me, not bashing. thanks again and i will post the pic so u can check it out

02-14-2003, 10:59 AM	#8
ambient Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 312	sup with your water flow. What pump are you using? could be that you just don't have good enough flow through the block. That would account for the high cpu temps and cold water __________________ water cooled 1.4 tbird @ 1580 143x11 vcore 1.88 vio 3.55

02-14-2003, 11:57 AM	#9
Chad2 Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 12	the block is cold to the touch, and my cpu is running off the same pump and water. the water feels cold going into the bong cooler, so im sure its not the flow or the temp of the water. i think that it might be a reading error on the sensor or, i dont know. the mount isnt great but its on snug, it wont wiggle around. and like i said, the block feels cold to the touch, even when it gets up to 100 C (i ran 3d mark again oc to 2.8 northbrifge got up to 108C, wierd part is, it doesnt crash). so im wondering if i should even worry about the temp. do u think i should ignor it? chad

02-14-2003, 12:24 PM	#11
Chad2 Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 12	no, i mean. the computer says that the northbridge is at 108 C (YES THAT IS C NOT F). and yes it is cold to the touch (with my bare hand). once i go home this weekend i will bring up my ir thermometer and test it. but im telling u this. the block is not HOT like i think it would with temps like that.

02-14-2003, 01:33 PM	#15
Blackeagle Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: U.S.A = Michigan Posts: 1,243	In your first post you said that in mounting the NB block you used the "paid" from the original heat sink. Do you mean the thermal pad that stuck the original heat sink on? IF so that may well be the problem, might want to do as BrainW suggested and remove that thermal pad and put it on with some good termal epoxy. A better TIM will have to help. With the NB block cool to the touch but the board reporting 100C it has to be in the TIM or the boards reading really crazy, best I can see.

02-14-2003, 01:38 PM	#16
Chad2 Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 12	i have artic silver 3 thermal paste on it. when i take it off u can see the marks it leaves in the thin layer. also, i dont know if it is the temps on the motherboard because when i had the stock heatsink, it had temps of like 55 maybe 60, but i couldnt oc more then 2.6. so i dont know, its all confusing. i have been working on cooling systems for a while, and everything seems like it should be working. but..... tell me what u think chad ps: do u think i should get the epoxy and use that insteadwith the mount, but i dont know how it would improve it considering i have thermal paste on it now

02-14-2003, 01:40 PM	#17
Chad2 Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 12	also, when i say cold id ont me COLD COLD, like it feels like soemthign at room temp, and when u remove ur finger the tip feels a little cooler.

02-14-2003, 02:04 PM	#18
Blackeagle Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: U.S.A = Michigan Posts: 1,243	Guess it wouldn't hurt to remount it with epoxy in case the hose torqe is causeing a poor contact between the block and the NB that your wire retainer isn't controling fully. Crazy how your O/C is good, it may well be the board's readings at fault. :shrug: Best of luck, but let us know what you find is the cause.

02-14-2003, 06:09 PM	#19
SonixOS Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Silver Spring, MD Posts: 282	thanks, ill try to get some epoxy and ill let u know how it turns out. thanks again chad __________________ -sonix- ======================= Antec SX830 Abit KR7A-133 MSI Geforce3 Ti200 VT128 TV-IN and TV-OUT Sound Blaster Audigy Linksys LNE100 V2.0 Toshiba DVD Drive 40x/16x IBM Deskstar 60GXP 60gig Watercooled http://www.sonixnet.tk =======================

02-14-2003, 08:17 PM	#21
jaydee Put up or Shut Up Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 6,506	I also bet you have MBM setup wrong. Make sure you have the right mobo selected when installing it.

02-14-2003, 10:57 PM	#22
Chad2 Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Maryland Posts: 12	the temps match what is says in the bios. also, i didt want to mount it that way, but i dont know how else to mount it, do u think that the epoxy would help with holding the block on it. and if its not on there as good as the heatsink was, then that brings up the other ?. why does it oc 200mhz faster. (before with heatsink 2.4 stable, 2.6 max. Now 2.6 stable, 2.8 pretty stable but will crash once in a while). thanks again chad

02-14-2003, 11:02 PM	#23
jaydee Put up or Shut Up Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 6,506	Your temps are not right. So untill that is rectified nothing else will add up. I don't know if your bios is messed up or the probes or what. But if it was 212F things would be melting down!

02-15-2003, 12:03 AM	#24
UnloadeD Cooling Savant Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: MidWest USA Posts: 176	I wouldn't mount it to NB with epoxy for a couple of reasons. Mainly because it would be semi-permanent. When I install a new water setup, I put it all in dry, getting tubing cut to length and twisted right directions. Then I remove it all while components are still conected, fill it outside of the case, do the twists/turns required to remove all the air, then let it run for a while. Then I put it back in the case, and let it run for a while making sure there are no leaks from installing, then I power on the computer. All of this would be very hard to do if the NB block is attached permanently. I would go with trying to get some kind of plate and threaded hooks like you mentioned earlier. I don't know what to tell you about your temps. Have you recently changed bios? It seems to me the reported temps have to be wrong. I would see if anybody else with same m/b is reporting trobles and if they found a fiix. peace. unloaded

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