Cats & cars - EE question

[Cathar]

Originally Posted by DrMemory

Someone or something could get seriously killed.

Seriously? As opposed to what? A Darwin Award style killing?

[DrMemory]

No, seriously such as no bloody crossed fingers and no getting better to paraphrase Monty Python.

[jaydee]

Before you try opening up the flame thrower why not pull your head out your ass first. I don't remember ever saying using the cat as the connection greenman nor killing the cat satanico. While you have that battery handy hook up some 10ga to both the positive and the negative and make an arc with it. If your going to sit there and tell me that arc isn't going to make a cat jump if it's foot just happens to be close to it then go ahead and flame on. I have welded with a 12V batter before. Plenty of power to make a cat jump. Don't remember saying running the current through the cat though. That's kinda ****ing dumb.

[Cathar]

C'mon guys, I'm allergic to cat fur, and right now there appears to be too much of it flying about.

[DrMemory]

Flame on! (Thanks Human Torch)

And speaking of heads and asses. There was no mention at all of arcs in your original post. Standing by the car waiting for the cat so you can start the arc will get boring very quickly. Getting the cat to stick its foot in there (or go anywhere near it) will be real tricky. I suggest heavy clothing and gardening gloves. If current doesn't run through the body then even high voltage electricity will have no effect. Its called static electricity because the current is not flowing, and as you may (or may not) know, nothing much happens until you get close to that door knob and the current flows. You are in way over your head here.

Flame off!

Yea, this is my last post on this thread. I've never been much of a cat fan myself but I don't want anybody hurting them either.

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by DrMemory

Flame on! (Thanks Human Torch)

And speaking of heads and asses. There was no mention at all of arcs in your original post. Standing by the car waiting for the cat so you can start the arc will get boring very quickly. Getting the cat to stick its foot in there (or go anywhere near it) will be real tricky. I suggest heavy clothing and gardening gloves. If current doesn't run through the body then even high voltage electricity will have no effect. Its called static electricity because the current is not flowing, and as you may (or may not) know, nothing much happens until you get close to that door knob and the current flows. You are in way over your head here.

Flame off!

Yea, this is my last post on this thread. I've never been much of a cat fan myself but I don't want anybody hurting them either.

I was trying to mess with you but greenman had to jump in with his superior knowledge complex. I though it was horrifically obvious I was leaving the details out intentionally (note the extreamly short posts with no details) but I guess not. I was getting a kick out of your posts as they were technically correct but wrong in that I can very well get a cat to jump with 12@600 amps (normal sized car battery).

It is easy to get the cat to set off an arc. The cat would probably walk on the same parts of the car and you know this because it leaves the paw tracks. You can setup a boobie trap pretty easy. Cat trips a switch, voltage turns on and a arc sparks next to the switch it tripped. Ever sparked wires together near something not expecting it? JUMP! It would be all the better at night as the sparks would be brighter.

You can also set a fire cracker with its fuse in between the spark and light the fire cracker and set it off. That will scare off just about anything and may make it not return. Might worry the neighbors though.

Only reason I know this is because I have done it. Passed the spare time in welding class back in high school.

[satanicoo]

lol.......

[msv]

How much current can a normal cat handle before shitting all over the car?
regards
Mikael S.

[Kobuchi]

Originally Posted by Groth

Maybe rig up a motion detector to a relay controlling a selenoid valve that turns a garden hose on/off. Anything gets near the car, it gets sprayed.

Motion Activated Sprinkler

[Groth]

So much for my patent.

Hmmm, maybe if I design one that tracks the target and uses pepper pray...

[myv65]

Anytime we've had a cat that liked to jump on objects it should not (typically kitchen counters) we simply placed mouse traps all over the place. It was not uncommon to be awoken in the middle of the by the sound of traps snapping followed immediately by loud cat howling. No cat ever needed a repeat "lesson".

[lolito_fr]

Lol. Could have mousetraps, cayenne pepper, motion sensitive tracking pepper spray AND 600A spark generator...

Redundancy

[DrMemory]

Originally Posted by jaydee116

I was trying to mess with you but greenman had to jump in with his superior knowledge complex. I though it was horrifically obvious I was leaving the details out intentionally (note the extreamly short posts with no details) but I guess not. I was getting a kick out of your posts as they were technically correct but wrong in that I can very well get a cat to jump with 12@600 amps (normal sized car battery).

It is easy to get the cat to set off an arc. The cat would probably walk on the same parts of the car and you know this because it leaves the paw tracks. You can setup a boobie trap pretty easy. Cat trips a switch, voltage turns on and a arc sparks next to the switch it tripped. Ever sparked wires together near something not expecting it? JUMP! It would be all the better at night as the sparks would be brighter.

You can also set a fire cracker with its fuse in between the spark and light the fire cracker and set it off. That will scare off just about anything and may make it not return. Might worry the neighbors though.

Only reason I know this is because I have done it. Passed the spare time in welding class back in high school.

Ok jaydee, one last post just to clear a few things up. I'm not trying to piss anybody off. I'm just trying to make sure that people in this forum that are thinking about using electricity, do so in a manor that will not get anybody or anything accidentally hurt or killed. Since I've joined this site, not too long ago, I've seen several posts that are clearly made by people that do not know enough about electricity to do what they want to do safely.

The main difference between high current, low voltage arcs and low current high voltage is this. As you learned in welding class, with high current (the voltage doesn't really matter unless you are trying to pass a lot of current through a high resistance) you get a LOT of heat. Enough to melt metal. I've heard tales about people losing fingers when a metal wedding ring got between a high current low voltage buss and a ground buss. Any body part accidentally getting in contact with the arc will be badly damaged. These arcs also produce short wave ultra-violet light which damages eyes and why arc welders use welding masks.

High voltage, low current does not produce high temperatures, but this does not mean it is safe. High voltage produces enough of an electric field (pressure) to allow current to flow through a "high resitance" human or animal body, or body part. Actually it is the (dry) skin that has a fairly high resistance, the salt present inside animal bodies reduces this resistance dramatically. The current flow affects the nerve cells of that body without damaging them (enough current will cause damage of course). The effect can be a just a tingling sensation, that "bite" you get from a staic discharge, involuntary muscle spasms, to complete incapacitation (with a real nasty bite I hear). But as long as a low enough current is used, it won't permanently damage or kill you. If however, the right amount of current passes through the nerve cells that are responsible for making the heart beat, fibulation can occur, and without a defibulator handy, the person, or animal will probably die.

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by DrMemory

Ok jaydee, one last post just to clear a few things up. I'm not trying to piss anybody off. I'm just trying to make sure that people in this forum that are thinking about using electricity, do so in a manor that will not get anybody or anything accidentally hurt or killed. Since I've joined this site, not too long ago, I've seen several posts that are clearly made by people that do not know enough about electricity to do what they want to do safely.

The main difference between high current, low voltage arcs and low current high voltage is this. As you learned in welding class, with high current (the voltage doesn't really matter unless you are trying to pass a lot of current through a high resistance) you get a LOT of heat. Enough to melt metal. I've heard tales about people losing fingers when a metal wedding ring got between a high current low voltage buss and a ground buss. Any body part accidentally getting in contact with the arc will be badly damaged. These arcs also produce short wave ultra-violet light which damages eyes and why arc welders use welding masks.

High voltage, low current does not produce high temperatures, but this does not mean it is safe. High voltage produces enough of an electric field (pressure) to allow current to flow through a "high resistance" human or animal body, or body part. Actually it is the (dry) skin that has a fairly high resistance, the salt present inside animal bodies reduces this resistance dramatically. The current flow affects the nerve cells of that body without damaging them (enough current will cause damage of course). The effect can be a just a tingling sensation, that "bite" you get from a staic discharge, involuntary muscle spasms, to complete incapacitation (with a real nasty bite I hear). But as long as a low enough current is used, it won't permanently damage or kill you. If however, the right amount of current passes through the nerve cells that are responsible for making the heart beat, fibulation can occur, and without a defibulator handy, the person, or animal will probably die.

Sounds fine to me. I just wanted to see how much techno mumbo you were going to throw into my face before you asked me HOW "12V@600A will make a cat jump". You already had an answer and refused to think about other posibilities. What bothers me about some of the "know it alls" in this forum is they quickly jump to one conclusion about something and flame on that conclusion not realizing there is more than one way to skin a cat! BTW I am VERY guilty of this myself.

[Arcturius]

Originally Posted by myv65

Anytime we've had a cat that liked to jump on objects it should not (typically kitchen counters) we simply placed mouse traps all over the place. It was not uncommon to be awoken in the middle of the by the sound of traps snapping followed immediately by loud cat howling. No cat ever needed a repeat "lesson".

Great, now everyone around me has heard my giggling and knows I'm not working. ;p

The below assumes you've already tried talking to your neighbors, and they're too dense to bother with trying to keep their cats from roaming (which is quite typical, unfortunately).

One form of revenge that always worked well on cats in our neighborhood: leave super-greasy food scraps at the edge of your yard (preferably under a shrubbery) where the neighbor cats typically enter. We usually used leftover KFC with lots of gravy.
The cats would chow down, go home, and get sick all over the neighbor's white carpet.
(NOTE: usually also attracts other unwanted critters like skunks, but they just move on once the food is gone, provided you don't bait them too often. )

Another tactic:
If you've got good cover from prying eyes (some ppl would get all bent out of shape if they saw this, go figure ) and you happen to catch the cat in the act (but they don't see you) a pellet gun pumped up 3-4 times (instead of the normal 10) stings pretty good, but doesn't actually break the skin.
Might be a little more satisfying form of revenge, but I still like the 1st one better (or the mousetraps ).

[DrMemory]

Originally Posted by jaydee116

Sounds fine to me. I just wanted to see how much techno mumbo you were going to throw into my face before you asked me HOW "12V@600A will make a cat jump". You already had an answer and refused to think about other posibilities. What bothers me about some of the "know it alls" in this forum is they quickly jump to one conclusion about something and flame on that conclusion not realizing there is more than one way to skin a cat! BTW I am VERY guilty of this myself.

Sigh.

It's only techno-mumbo to those who don't know it but like to think that they do, or worse, believe that they don't need to. In the world of electronics and electricity, that can get you seriously damaged or killed. In case you missed it, this is a tech web sight. That's why you keep finding people that can talk and walk tech on it. If you don't like techno-mumbo maybe you should stay away from tech web sights. Or do something that might seem strange or maybe even impossible to you. Make some attempt to learn it!

I prefer to think about useful solutions as opposed to half-baked (pun intended) ideas. Your solution to making the cat jump is not a good one unless you like to cook parts of cats to charcoal and damage their eyes (those were just two of the most obvious problems, there are others). I thought after getting handed several clues you might have figured this out for yourself, but as usual techno-mumbo-phobe(s) just don't get tech.

[SCompRacer]

I've used Havahart® traps for capturing pesky critters.

[Kobuchi]

But then lolito fr would have to keep the cat in there. And get more traps for the other neighbourhood cats. And feed them...

[lolito_fr]

or just take 'em for a nice long drive in the countryside...

[SCompRacer]

Originally Posted by lolito_fr

or just take 'em for a nice long drive in the countryside...

Mafia style one-way, or catch and release?

[fafnir]

why don't you just stay up one night and then shoot the cat?


instead of all these unrelated wild fantasies, ask yourself,


1. is it a (cat)?

2. do you hate the (cat)?

3. do you have the means to deal with the (cat)?

4. would you not violation of any laws when you deal with the (cat)?



if yes to all four questions, stay up one night, identify the disturbance, and get rid of teh thing first


might wanna have a trash bag ready or a hole dug out in your yard before you start or something



_

[msv]

Wow, You´re true to Your name, Fafnir.
In the start of thread it was specified that killing the cat was not an option (personal preferences, don´t ask me).
Well, I´m also too soft to shoot a cat.
regards
Mikael S.

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by DrMemory

Sigh.

It's only techno-mumbo to those who don't know it but like to think that they do, or worse, believe that they don't need to. In the world of electronics and electricity, that can get you seriously damaged or killed. In case you missed it, this is a tech web sight. That's why you keep finding people that can talk and walk tech on it. If you don't like techno-mumbo maybe you should stay away from tech web sights. Or do something that might seem strange or maybe even impossible to you. Make some attempt to learn it!

I prefer to think about useful solutions as opposed to half-baked (pun intended) ideas. Your solution to making the cat jump is not a good one unless you like to cook parts of cats to charcoal and damage their eyes (those were just two of the most obvious problems, there are others). I thought after getting handed several clues you might have figured this out for yourself, but as usual techno-mumbo-phobe(s) just don't get tech.

Umm ok whatever.

[DrMemory]

Originally Posted by jaydee116

Umm ok whatever.

Brilliant response (note: sarcasm)! Almost as well thought out as all of your other "wonderful ideas" in this thread. Just what I'd expect from you.

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by DrMemory

Brilliant response (note: sarcasm)! Almost as well thought out as all of your other "wonderful ideas" in this thread. Just what I'd expect from you.

Like I said, whatever. Guess you never heard of fuses or self resetting breakers.

EDIT: I also don't remember suggesting it was an idea to consider......... Thread was getting very non serious at the time. Chill out.