Is Swiftech going down for the count?

[9mmCensor]

Some of you have been screwed over by some people. That sucks. I think that could end the gripes about being screwed over at work and in business.

I know it hurts, but need we taint the hobby we love with our personal gripes?

[BillA]

9mm
think on the title of this thread
where does Swiftech fit in this 'hobby' ?
they are possibly the largest single supplier and the source of most of what is around today
(you can only debate this if you have 5 years or so of involvement, a perspective on Swiftech's many product introductions)

returning to the topic, so what if they disappear ?
while there would be a considerable supply disruption, no doubt others will be pleased at the opportunity
will Stew license another company ? (ask him, not me - if curious)
will some of Swiftech's uniquely good products be copied and made by others ? (not by CoolingWorks before anyone asks)

the topic is quite legit to those looking at the 'big picture'

you bundle Gabe's dishonoring signed contracts (more than CoolingWorks, eh) and lying to employees as "personal gripes", but they are material to the thread topic
- Gabe has past customers who will never deal with him again, more than Erick's and my "personal gripes" at work wrt to Swiftech's survival
(you will see a prime example of a customer's abandonment in the near future)
- and the time of (late) filing of financial statements is universally understood in the financial community, ask your broker if my statements are deemed unreliable by you

but now the thread topic has evolved to BillA, which is fine

without question I am 'excessively blunt', and 'overly aggressive';
if the things that trigger such are considered unwarranted by the readership then I should not be posting - at least the blunt and aggressive parts
- is the milk and pap remaining of interest to me ?

Joe has spoken clearly, as have others, and there is no good reason for me to antagonize the readership here
but I will leave a cautionary note for consideration; do not forget the 'net clue factor'

2 current examples suffice:
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...2&postcount=30 - here we have a long-term poster who does not have a clue, and no one has corrected him
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...59&postcount=5 - here a rather well known scientific 'principle' was referenced, and no one asked how this could possibly apply given the geometries involved, no clue here either (though Ben got it) [for completeness, bypass is the concern; such will also reduce the pressure drop but increase the thermal resistance, the delayed test results suggest they are fishing for good data to post; marketing kinda stuff]

both these posters have recently been taken to task by me; and the readership has spoken, I can accept that
I've been posting for over 5 years and have always retained the ability to admit when I was wrong,
and been unrelenting when I believed I was correct (wittiness the "flawed TTV testbed" issue with Stew which I intentionally pursued wherever I found Stew posting it)

"The time has come," the Walrus said,. "To talk of many things:. Of shoes -- and ships -- and sealing-wax --. Of cabbages -- and kings -- ...

to my dwindling friends here (before I've none at all), be cool
- Joe, you have my permission to edit everything I've written - except this post please ('net clue' in progress)

[Joe]

but now the thread topic has evolved to BillA, which is fine

You do that to yourself though Bill, you seem to have a knack for taking most threads and turning them into personal statements, and changing the discussion from something about an object, to sparring with Bill.

[9mmCensor]

Originally Posted by BillA

9mm
think on the title of this thread

without question I am 'excessively blunt', and 'overly aggressive';

part one.
An objective look at how the company is in dire straights, would be favourable. Rather than a look at how the company screwed you and people you know, and this is why its going to flounder.

Part two.
That is what is great about you Bill. You say what you mean. It might be cryptic, but its honest.

[TerraMex]

You do that to yourself though Bill, you seem to have a knack for taking most threads and turning them into personal statements, and changing the discussion from something about an object, to sparring with Bill.

i'd venture the oposite, any reaction into pissing contests comes from the others,
you know how he (billa) posts and usually why ; not fishing for a fanbase, technical with the care bears on the background?

Edit:

That is what is great about you Bill. You say what you mean. It might be cryptic, but its honest.

If it's cryptic, how do you know it's honest?
j/k. On the money.

[bigben2k]

slightly off-topic:
I was asked a question in PM, because the person wasn't comfortable opening it up for everyone.

Let's see how it goes:
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=12850

[Etacovda]

note the 'apparently' in my sentence, which suggests that they were not my words (which they werent, go look at ocau ) - i know about the bypass, any moron will know that for ****s sake, i failed to see the point in repeating what ben said DIRECTLY above me...

How does the removed pressure drop in that area effect cooling performance? the ideal impingement has no 'channels' to remove the water, the water should just get out of the cups and 'dissapear' ideally, right?
ANY extra included channel will increase pressure drop - so reducing the pressure drop shouldnt hurt performance? Slower to remove the stagnant water from the block?

And before you say anything, yeah, I said I was out - but if you're going to insult my level of intelligence and completely mis-read my posts, I feel the need for correction.

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by BillA

2 current examples suffice:
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...2&postcount=30 - here we have a long-term poster who does not have a clue, and no one has corrected him

Responded in other thread. No clue? Prove it.

[BillA]

I see in another thread that Swiftech is apparently screwing someone else also out of money due
?
guess thats another whiner with a"petty" "personal beef"
??
tisk, tisk

sarcasm aside, I do feel responsible as I facilitated the "agreement"
a lesson for all; liars do not discriminate, its all about utility

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by BillA

I see in another thread that Swiftech is apparently screwing someone else also out of money due
?
guess thats another whiner with a"petty" "personal beef"
??
tisk, tisk

sarcasm aside, I do feel responsible as I facilitated the "agreement"
a lesson for all; liars do not discriminate, its all about utility

It is ashame Gabe not dealing with Cathar appropriately. Same with you and Lothar and anyone else they are taking advantage of. I had a feeling things would end up like this when they went public. Puts politics over honor. Of course that seems to be the way all business is run these day.

[BillA]

nothing to do with going public
the shame is when 'we' say all businesses, some have honor - but few
capitalism has a bad name with me, a Libertarian long ago

[ProHandyman]

Originally Posted by BillA

the shame is when 'we' say all businesses, some have honor - but few capitalism has a bad name with me, a Libertarian long ago

I totally agree! Capitalism let to run unchecked by government leads to this, and many other woes! My small biz has always run slightly red or black... but at least I can sleep at night, and have customers that smile.

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by BillA

nothing to do with going public
the shame is when 'we' say all businesses, some have honor - but few
capitalism has a bad name with me, a Libertarian long ago

Maybe not but when you are on the stock market you have to make the investors happy at whatever cost. Usually that comes down to honor when things are bad. Maybe Gabe had none to begine with I don't know. Seemed like things were pretty good before though. Live and learn I guess. You can't be that shady forever though. Sooner or later you will not have anyone to sell anything to.

[BillA]

as a friend said; you can bet on the horse or bet on the jockey
I bet on the horse, I was wrong
can only blame myself, all the signs were there - I substituted hope for reason

go for integrity

[gmat]

Anyone else in your position would have done exactly the same Bill, unless this one had powers to predict the future, or professional psychologist skills... which no one here has. Blame the people who abused from the situation.

[BillA]

just had a shocker
from a reference in another thread, I went to FrozenCPU to look around
lo and behold just about no Swiftech stuff, closeout levels it would almost seem
this is fatal
I would guess Swiftech's sales are in sharp decline, they are 8 weeks past the end of their reporting period
no wonder

[Cathar]

Hmmm. I just got off the phone to Gabe.

Very interesting discussion.

In short, aside from us not talking for about 5 months, the matter of royalties over the Storm was settled on the spot, and that'll be happening. Swiftech, at least from my point of view, seems to be continuing to act ethically and honouring our agreement, even though it took a phone call to fix it. Probably as much my fault for not talking to Gabe though, but it's all settled now, so that's that.

In short, Swiftech seems to be travelling well, after absorbing some transitional costs of moving various parts of production to China.

What I did find most interesting was that Gabe informed me that Erick (Lothar5150) had in the past expressed interest in buying Swiftech. Coupled with Bill's ongoing employment with Lothar5150 and Bill's current large number of shares with Swiftech, I am of my own opinion that perhaps the large reason for why this thread even exists is an attempt to drive down the price of Swiftech stock through enough negative press, so that Lothar, coupled with Bill's current stock ownership in Swiftech, can mount a cheaper take-over bid.

I mean really. The readers of Procooling really need to ask themselves. Why would Bill & Erick be sustaining this long term, out of the blue, attack on Swiftech? What's in it for them? If Bill owns stock in Swiftech, what would be in it for him to attack Swiftech. Only once we all understand that Bill's current business partner has aspirations to buy out Swiftech does the seediness of this thread start to make sense.

Despicable. Deplorable. Distasteful. Disgusting. All terms I've come to associate with Erick over time.

Have a think about it everyone. Ask yourselves what makes sense.

Be prepared for the usual backlash responses by Bill and Erick, but really, what are they both doing here bagging out Swiftech for? What is in it for them. I reckon it's all starting to make sense now.

Sad. Sad that an enthusiast forum reader base would be subjected to such sleazy business shenanigans. I don't even understand why the Procooling owners tolerate this thread's existence.

[bigben2k]

Kinda jumping to conclusions there, no? I'd have thought over the conversation for a bit before posting this theory.

Having met Bill personally, I have no reason to believe that he would do such a thing.

What are you doing Cathar? I know that you and Bill have your differences, but is this really where you want to take it?

[Cathar]

Originally Posted by bigben2k

Kinda jumping to conclusions there, no? I'd have thought over the conversation for a bit before posting this theory.

Having met Bill personally, I have no reason to believe that he would do such a thing.

What are you doing Cathar? I know that you and Bill have your differences, but is this really where you want to take it?

Either that, or Bill is a witless accomplice in Erick's plans.

I was shocked that Bill, who espouses ethics in public, would ever go work for Erick.

I don't know what to think when it comes to Bill. Maybe Erick saw his chance.

Remember, Bill wants his money. Gabe is paying Bill back when he is able to (doesn't harm Swiftech's solvency according to what Bill disclosed of the contract).

Ask yourselves, what would be the fastest way for Bill to get his money back?

Someone is pulling someone's strings here. Erick is the one of main concern though, and it is he who started this thread. Is Bill being played? Is Bill a willing accomplice?

Nay bigben2k, I lost all respect for Bill after a recent post of his to me. All respect. I no longer distinguish Bill's "ethics" from Erick's "ethics". I've met Bill and spoken to Bill many times, but his anger over Swiftech is something that has pervaded his every post for a long time now. Don't know how anyone could not see that. I no longer have any idea what would be going through his head.

Sad that an enthusiast forum would ever host a thread such as this, even before I made my post.

Frankly when it comes to Procooling, lately it's been more of ProBillDictatorship.com. Feel free to disagree with me BigBen2K. After years of Bill slagging off on you, now you're one his his biggest lapdogs. Bill kicks you in the head so many times, and yet you still come running back. Never understood that. Now that most here who used to support Bill have left since his attitude has remained totally unchecked, it hasn't surprised me in the slightest that Bill now almost refers to you as a friend since you're about the only person willing to tolerate his crap.

[jaydee]

I can not see anything positive happening at this point in this thread.

If anyone disagrees with my choice to close this thread let Joe or pH know and they can choose to re-open it.

[Joe]

I am going to re-open it just to let Bill reply to Cathars post in fairness. then the thread is closed...

God damn do I hate babysitting a kidergarden.

[BillA]

interesting speculation, but no more than that

I am glad that you will be paid your due, only wish the same applied to me ($55,000+ owing)
easier to pay small creditors than large, especially those with a following affecting product sales
- noticed that I do not diss Swiftech's products ? why ? because they are good products, generally speaking
the problem is Gabe, a liar, not Swiftech's products (I can distinguish between the two)

when Erick had that interest I (and everyone) thought that WCing had a viable future; but I no longer believe so, though Erick kind of does still
the future of CPU cooling is not WCing, a fact that will become more apparent over time

re my stock:
shortly I will be legally able to begin selling it on the OTC market, just watch
your speculations are just that, and no more

on a more general note it is apparent that you have an agenda,
when you called me an Intel whore in place of a technical response it was apparent you were going personal

go to it sport, you fit well on that other forum
a cooling god indeed

[Joe]

well I can see it now... another PM saying that I need to re-open it for Cathar... and then after that Bill... the never ending battle of the last word in this pissing match.