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General Liquid/Water Cooling Discussion For discussion about Full Cooling System kits, or general cooling topics. Keep specific cooling items like pumps, radiators, etc... in their specific forums.

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Unread 05-11-2003, 08:19 AM   #1
CoolROD
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Default UV Light to Kill W/C Bacteria

UV light is used in the food processing industry to kill bacteria. Barbers, dentists, doctors, and lab techs even sterilize with it. I have used it for some time -with real success- to neutralize the nasties that ALWAYS grow in milling machine / wet saw coolant. I know that there are MANY systems running UV / blacklights for decoration.

I am looking at putting UV Lights / LEDs in my Res. and around my system to kill bacteria.

Does anyone have data on algae / bacteria growth in their systems that use black lights?

Does anyone know if UV light will hinder algae growth?

edit: formatting...
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Unread 05-11-2003, 10:25 AM   #2
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I would have thought it would be odd using UV to killl bateria; shouldn't it promote growth?

Or you could breed some new sort of life in there
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Unread 05-11-2003, 11:31 AM   #3
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i dont think the UV blacklights people put into their cases produces the type of UV you are talking about (used for sterilization purposes).
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Unread 05-11-2003, 11:40 AM   #4
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It's possible a high intensity hard UV source could kill bacteria. This is what they are starting to use in photolithography in semiconductor device fab. However, this is not the same as the UV cold cathodes you can get. Being in the same room as one of these things would be enough to blind you.

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Unread 05-11-2003, 11:42 AM   #5
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Ultraviolet Sterilization is often used in aquariums to prevent bacteria and parasites but will not help with some kinds of algae (string algae). I don't think LED's are going to do much as most of these UV lights are in the 8-30watt range.
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Unread 05-11-2003, 11:50 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by ross89
Ultraviolet Sterilization is often used in aquariums to prevent bacteria and parasites but will not help with some kinds of algae (string algae). I don't think LED's are going to do much as most of these UV lights are in the 8-30watt range.
There are other complications. In aquariums that still try to kill the bacteria, the UV light is usually put over a "sump" or something, without tubing etc between the light and the water. They also have little light proofed boxes that pass water through sterilizing UV. works quite well, but very impractical for W/C
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Unread 05-11-2003, 01:24 PM   #7
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The aquarium sterilization sounds very much like my machine coolant setup. I am just using an 18" fluorescent blacklight. I thought that if there was any real interest in this than I might look into something for a PC. As far as the LEDs...there are some pretty powerful laser guys out there and if you pulse the output you can get increased intensity...

I also have a few microwave magnatrons lying around...talk about mutant bacteria!

Thank you guys for all of the great responses , but I don't want to drop the ball here. I think that there is some promise with this idea. Though I am willing to bet that there will be an accelerated degradation of cheaper hoses ie: vinyl.

Anybody out there knowledgeable in UV light sources?
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Unread 05-11-2003, 01:30 PM   #8
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I recently bought a new fluorescent blacklight tube for my company's blueprint duplicator. This thing is intense. There is a minimum of visible light and serious warnings about eye damage -cataracts, etc. This commercial unit is much more serious than any "Party Favor" black light that I have seen.
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Unread 05-11-2003, 02:03 PM   #9
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Here is a number of UV solutions for Aquarium use if anyone is interested http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...=6&pCatId=4393
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Unread 05-11-2003, 03:03 PM   #10
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Great Link! This looks -to me- like something I could easily adapt to PC W/C use.
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Unread 05-11-2003, 03:12 PM   #11
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I am thinking about using the UV5 as my reservoir.
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Unread 05-11-2003, 03:32 PM   #12
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Had to delurk as I considered this idea a while back. The important factor your missing is the wavelength of the UV light. check out this chart:

http://www.priva.ca/images/vialux-action-spectrum.gif

Now because any water cooling system is going to be cycling water through the UV over and over, it doesn't have to be as effective as a UV disinfector where the water only goes through once before you drink it. According to the chart though, you'll still have to be somewhere under 300 nm.

From this site:

Quote:
With a peak wavelength of 350nm, this is the shortest wavelength UV LED I've heard of in current production.
So UV LEDs won't work very well for disinfecting. One other interesting thing I learned while browsing around that site:

Quote:
the 20-LED NUV Adapter radiates intense near-ultraviolet light at right around 395nm where most fluorescent stuff glows.
Which tells us the probable wavelength of most decorative UV sources, like CCFLs meant for modding, or black light bulbs meant to light up your flourescent posters.

So if you want to try any other UV source that's not designed for disinfecting, make sure you find out the wavelength first.

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Unread 05-11-2003, 03:47 PM   #13
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Al Kaseltzer -That is exactly the kind of data I am looking for. Current target = 265nm. Also Ross89 thanks for the aquarium links. I had not even considered that market for ready-made parts.

Does anyone have experience with the "Tetratec UV5 Clarifier"
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...=6&pCatId=4528
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Unread 05-11-2003, 05:02 PM   #14
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Unread 05-12-2003, 07:13 AM   #15
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Thanks -missed that one. I searched for various UV topics and one pointed to that thread...but I saw it mentioned UV Dye... and quit reading too soon. Nonetheless there are a few links that we could use here. From the previous thread here are two online aquarium suppliers with UV products:

http://www.aquaultraviolet.com/sterilizers.html

http://www.aquadynamite.com/aquauv.html
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Unread 05-12-2003, 06:28 PM   #16
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I think anything designed for an Aquarium will work for disinfecting a Water cooling system, but it will be very over designed. The aquarium sterilizers you linked to seemed to be specified based on the total water in the aquarium, starting at 100 to 200 Gallons. With a small aquarium pump all the water will pass through once every one or two hours. In a WC system even with a large reservoir, you'll have what, maybe a whole gallon? It's going to pass through the sterilizer once a minute.

If you can find a lower wattage UV source, it will avoid adding extra heat to your system.

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Unread 05-12-2003, 06:41 PM   #17
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Hello Montreal! (I moved from there!)

You're right on. I'm really wondering what the purpose of the UV LED really is?!?

As for the heat, I think that there are ways around it, albeit involving some customizing.


Going over all the links, UV-C kills bacterias, not UV-A, which is the harmless glow-in-the-dark stuff.

BTW, and a little OT, I recently compared an 8 Watt UV neon (the decorative kind) and found it to be about as strong as 4 good UV CCFL tubes.
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Unread 05-12-2003, 07:11 PM   #18
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The equipment and lamps that I have looked into are UV-C. BTW most are fluorescents and the mention of quartz is just describing a tube that forms the ID of the Res. -A Fluor. bulb is inside that.

I am not really concerned with the heat, though it is a real addition to the total btu load of my system. You were totally correct to mention it and this extra heat could easily have been overlooked.

I am not after superlow temps. I have a peltier w/ controller and the operating temp of my cpu is programmable. I also enjoy overkill -so the overdesign of my system just makes my smile

I want my system to have as much "up time" as possible. Besides my system is portable and I really don't want to get somewhere and have to perform maintenance. I want my system to run 2 yrs. without maintenance. I have not found a water concoction that most users can agree upon. So, giving you Pros credit, I have to conclude that one might not exist. I am merely looking for alternatives. I do know that many of you have been up more than two years. But, every little bit helps, right?

This is all just fun for me and I also enjoy making some things overly complex and mabye a little "sexier" -in my eyes.
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Unread 05-12-2003, 07:56 PM   #19
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Actually, #Rotor's been using the same mixture for more than 3 years.

I would think that it's out there, but not easy to setup.
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Unread 05-12-2003, 09:49 PM   #20
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My experience is with UV light in a system Res. of relavively high volume ~5 Gal. and low system volume ~1/2 Gal. The UV LED was just an easy way to get that (Low Voltage).

My company builds hydraulic systems and machinery so I just can't imagine a hyd. system without a properly designed res. But, the fish parts I have been shown will accomplish both for me.

BB2k -do you have a handy link to bios settings for the Asus A7N8X deluxe? Specifically, when I take my memory timings out of auto (CL-2.5, etc.) I do not see "Performance Enhanced DDR Enabled" at the post. I have been pretty upset with this. I may have even bought the wrong memory ...

2*(CORSAIR 256MB 2700 XMS 333MHz CL2)

But in February PC3200 was too pricey for me.
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Unread 05-13-2003, 02:45 AM   #21
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Does the UV led you speak of output UV-A or UV-C light?
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Unread 05-13-2003, 09:05 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by CoolROD
BB2k -do you have a handy link to bios settings for the Asus A7N8X deluxe? Specifically, when I take my memory timings out of auto (CL-2.5, etc.) I do not see "Performance Enhanced DDR Enabled" at the post. I have been pretty upset with this. I may have even bought the wrong memory ...

2*(CORSAIR 256MB 2700 XMS 333MHz CL2)

But in February PC3200 was too pricey for me.
No, just the sucky Asus website. Do you have the latest BIOS rev? Did you check the approved memory list for this board? (you don't have to use approved memory, it's just easier to figure things out if you do).
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Unread 05-13-2003, 10:44 AM   #23
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Althornin: Be aware that when I spoke about my experience with a system Res. -I was talking about the coolant Res. in lathes, milling machines, and so forth. The light I have been using is a "party light" 18" fluorescent from some place in a mall. I just remove the Res. lid and lay a piece of glass over the tank and set the light on it.

We have proven that it is the wrong wavelength to be most effective, but it does work. It gives off visible light so it might be ok to assume that it also radiates into the higher regions -although not as efficiently.
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Unread 05-13-2003, 10:47 AM   #24
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I just did a web update last week, but it didn't help. I am going to borrow some better ram and try that. Could I get a screen shot of your bios with your settings? -or is that highly classified.

Honestly, if I switch from auto and manually put in values -my system fails the memory test at post.
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Unread 05-13-2003, 11:17 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by CoolROD
I just did a web update last week, but it didn't help. I am going to borrow some better ram and try that. Could I get a screen shot of your bios with your settings? -or is that highly classified.

Honestly, if I switch from auto and manually put in values -my system fails the memory test at post.
Not classified, just non-existant: I'm still building it.

Try relaxing the timings until you get it going, then start tweaking it up. I like your idea of trying another RAM: it should be most interesting.


There was a link above to a UV sterilizer with an angstrom number, for a name. That's the UV wavelength we need; I just wish I remembered how to convert it to nanometers.
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