Sub forum for Radiator Design - Page 6

Cathar · 08-21-2005, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydee

As expected, didn't last very long. So much for objectivity from OCAU.

I'm not sure what's going on there. It's not usually like Agg to intervene.

Cathar · 08-21-2005, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cathar

I'm not sure what's going on there. It's not usually like Agg to intervene.

I spoke to Agg. He had already spoken to JSE and told him that JSE had to expect questions and if he was going to make claims such as he did, and expect antipathy if he gave no answers.

Apparantly Agg and JSE reached an agreement where JSE was going to stop making claims if he wasn't prepared to back them up (that is my understanding - I could have that wrong), and as such Agg considered the episode over and closed the original thread, and this is why he closed the subsequent thread just recently. As far as Agg was concerned the matter had already been beaten, JSE wasn't going to relent and give the answers to even basic questions, and so the whole lot was shut-down and left to die.

Etacovda · 08-21-2005, 05:36 AM

I guess thats why hes been posting infrequently now... cant complain

jaydee · 08-21-2005, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cathar

I spoke to Agg. He had already spoken to JSE and told him that JSE had to expect questions and if he was going to make claims such as he did, and expect antipathy if he gave no answers.

Apparantly Agg and JSE reached an agreement where JSE was going to stop making claims if he wasn't prepared to back them up (that is my understanding - I could have that wrong), and as such Agg considered the episode over and closed the original thread, and this is why he closed the subsequent thread just recently. As far as Agg was concerned the matter had already been beaten, JSE wasn't going to relent and give the answers to even basic questions, and so the whole lot was shut-down and left to die.

Well the thread had a lot more to do with just JSE as that is why I didn't name names. Not completely happy with the out come but can live with it.

Also IMO if someone makes these claims on an open forum then it should be handled on the open forum. Calling bull shit dosn't happen enough these days.

dacooltech · 08-21-2005, 10:32 AM

Quote:

brand new line of rads with different features and performance ?
jeez, can't buy no respect 'round here

but I guess thats because the performance is unknown, ok . . . .

http://www.swiftnets.com/assets/ima...0hl-600x440.gif

http://www.swiftnets.com/assets/ima...iss-600x440.gif

http://www.swiftnets.com/assets/ima...-cw-600x440.gif

welcome back Bill

did you design those radis?

I thought those radis are also from China, no?

FYI a company from China contacted me about those radis couple times within the last few months...

BillA · 08-21-2005, 10:47 AM

Hi Bruce
yup
and yup
and yup again, the Chinese will retain the right to sell
(the blue paint is cooler)

Les
will delve into next week

dacooltech · 08-21-2005, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by unregistered

Hi Bruce
yup
and yup
and yup again, the Chinese will retain the right to sell
(the blue paint is cooler)

oh OK... so you designed those radiators, applied for a patent, and the Chinese are going to pay you royalty? aren't you guys supposed have some type of exclusive rights on them? :shrug:

BTW I didn't understand how exactly the patent-pending self-purging brass plenum chamber thing works?

BillA · 08-21-2005, 11:33 AM

thats all Bruce, want more talk with Gabe

Joe · 08-21-2005, 06:59 PM

Sorry to be late to the party, but since I am going to be re-orging the forums with teh new site update coming up - Do you guys still see a need for a Radiator design sub forum?

jaydee · 08-21-2005, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe

Sorry to be late to the party, but since I am going to be re-orging the forums with teh new site update coming up - Do you guys still see a need for a Radiator design sub forum?

IMO a General Radiator Discussion forum would cover it. I don't see to much discussion for rad design alone to warrant it.

Spot · 08-21-2005, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydee

That is exactly what I want.

a 80mm version would be cool to.

lol, you already know that's a coolwave. Don't think I've seen a 80mm version yet.

Spot · 08-21-2005, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dacooltech

oh OK... so you designed those radiators, applied for a patent, and the Chinese are going to pay you royalty? aren't you guys supposed have some type of exclusive rights on them? :shrug:

BTW I didn't understand how exactly the patent-pending self-purging brass plenum chamber thing works?

"exclusive rights" in China "works" differently, their concept of "rights" are ...well different.

Spot · 08-21-2005, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydee

IMO a General Radiator Discussion forum would cover it. I don't see to much discussion for rad design alone to warrant it.

I think this will do.

jaydee · 08-22-2005, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydee

That is exactly what I want.

a 80mm version would be cool to.

Ummm, errrr... I guess I should have taken the time to actually look at the PA160....
http://www.thermochill.com/pa160.php The connector fittings are perfect... Now if they could make a 80mm version to.

bobkoure · 08-23-2005, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydee

As expected, didn't last very long.

Interesting. The last comment was about trolling - possible someone reported the thread as a troll and the admins closed it without really looking at it? Just trying to give them the benefit of the doubt.
Anyway, why not start parallel threads both there and here - and be sure to put a link to the "other" thread in the very first post in each of the two parallel threads.

Then, of course, radiator testing figures to the side, there's the whole issue of whether OCAU actually is biased in this way (which I don't have enough experience with OCAU to comment on) - IMHO it wouldn't be unreasonable to do the same thing (parallel threads) discussing this as well. If they don't close it, maybe there's no intentional bias...(?)

I've no problem with biased sources of information - so long as it's clear what their bias is.
[us-centric] IMHO that's what the "freedom of the press" was all about when the bill of rights were passed - not "neutral, unbiased" voices, but lots of competing, highly biased ones. Yes you have to be a critical thinker to figure out what might be "real" but that's the way the world is - you're never going to have neutral sources - just ones that claim to be (Like Fox networks - we all know how neutral they are)[/us-centric]

BillA · 08-23-2005, 08:53 AM

lets be candid, the thread was a troll
Cathar described Agg's reasoning and from the OCAU perspective its no biggie
besides, the only 3 designers of rads (in the Western world) are posting in this thread, what more do you want ?

Marci · 08-23-2005, 08:56 AM

I don't particularly see OCAU as biased in any one way or another, just when it comes to watercooling there are a majority of n00bs and uneducated folks who don't know what to beleive, with minimal experienced representation (sort of - discounting the obvious native highlights)... and sometimes mods just close stuff to prevent future eventualities... I wouldn't put too much into events with regards OCAU and the reasoning behind closing the thread as being biased or unbiased... it's a good place, I like it over there... and have never come across any form of bias when it comes to topics such as this in the past. Think it's more an insightful mod has spotted an attempt to stir something up and they'd rather opt for the easy life and resolve it behind the scenes than let what could potentially be a fight start in their forums.

You're too used to the freedom / relaxed moderation of procooling forums in comparison is all... as the mods here know that folks can have an argument without necessarily having a fight... s'not the same elsewhere

Joe · 08-23-2005, 08:58 AM

THeres mods here? Holy shit when did that happen? hehe

Marci · 08-23-2005, 09:00 AM

ProCooling - the home of Active Cooling & Passive Moderation....

Joe · 08-23-2005, 09:02 AM

Yeh, we choose to think that our asshole like attitudes will drive away trolls on its own

keeps moderation needs to a low level. Really the ProForums are quite self cleaning

Joe · 08-23-2005, 09:11 AM

I mean check this thread out as an example:

http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=12111

who needed to moderate that?

jaydee · 08-23-2005, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by unregistered

lets be candid, the thread was a troll
Cathar described Agg's reasoning and from the OCAU perspective its no biggie
besides, the only 3 designers of rads (in the Western world) are posting in this thread, what more do you want ?

Yes it was a troll thread, a troll thread to cut the shit (which is piling higher and higher everyday).

If the Australian site doesn't want to expose a lier in their own community then that's their loss IMO. That's why I let it go. If this guy was from the states then I would have just begun.

Yes 3 designers all in this thread. That's why I didn't post the same thread here.

jaydee · 08-23-2005, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe

I mean check this thread out as an example:

http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=12111

who needed to moderate that?

Oh hell, how did I miss that? To late to jump in now I guess.

Cathar · 08-23-2005, 08:05 PM

OCAU exposes liars all the time, but what are we going to do?

I moderate the EC forums but deliberately take a very stepped-back approach to such issues because more than once I've had such people level allegations at me for being unfairly biased for even doing something as simple as asking probing questions like any concerned forum member would do. This is to be expected though, 'cos, you know, even though I have only ever exercised my moderative powers to move threads about that get posted in the wrong forum or to delete out and out abusive posts, I MUST be very heavily biased to do something as heavy handed as to ask questions.

The rest of the overall OCAU forum moderation practises fall under a delicate balance of stepping around arse-hole rip-off merchants who are only too happy to sue OCAU for defamation on the basis that it condones slanderous statements against said arse-hole merchants by not forcibly removing such statements.

Now this is not to say that anyone in the EC forum has acted in that way, but it has happened in the past with various vendors who didn't like the stories of negative feedback being posted on OCAU after they ripped someone off. Even though OCAU has won every single legal battle on the basis that it is not responsible for the posts of its members and members have the right of free speech, Agg @ OCAU has been forced into a position where it is just easier to moderate potential vendor verdict posts/topics than to be repeatedly dragged through the courts wasting his time and money in legal expenses.

This is the main reason why OCAU in general removes/moderates anything which can be deemed as a vendor verdict. It is purely because it seems that if there are enough arse-holes who attack the right of free speech of pointing out what arseholes they're being, then rather than attack the speaker it's easier and more convenient to attack the forum thereby modifying the forum's policies to prevent such free speech.

So that's why OCAU is the way it is. It's a situation of legal convenience.

Joe · 08-23-2005, 08:12 PM

People sue for defamation? I mean really sue? or just talk about it. because it seems 99% of the internet is all talk, and no game.

08-21-2005, 05:36 AM	#128
Etacovda Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Dunedin NZ Posts: 735	I guess thats why hes been posting infrequently now... cant complain __________________ Hypocritical Signature I tried to delete: Procooling: where scientific principles are ignored because big corporations are immune to mistakes and oversights.

08-21-2005, 06:59 PM	#134
Joe The Pro/Life Support System Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,041	Sorry to be late to the party, but since I am going to be re-orging the forums with teh new site update coming up - Do you guys still see a need for a Radiator design sub forum? __________________ Joe - I only take this hat off for one thing... ProCooling archive curator and dusty skeleton.

08-23-2005, 08:53 AM	#141
BillA CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered" Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Posts: 2,371.493,106 Posts: 4,440	lets be candid, the thread was a troll Cathar described Agg's reasoning and from the OCAU perspective its no biggie besides, the only 3 designers of rads (in the Western world) are posting in this thread, what more do you want ? Last edited by BillA; 08-23-2005 at 09:00 AM.

08-23-2005, 08:56 AM	#142
Marci Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2003 Location: Wakefield, West Yorkshire, UK Posts: 486	I don't particularly see OCAU as biased in any one way or another, just when it comes to watercooling there are a majority of n00bs and uneducated folks who don't know what to beleive, with minimal experienced representation (sort of - discounting the obvious native highlights)... and sometimes mods just close stuff to prevent future eventualities... I wouldn't put too much into events with regards OCAU and the reasoning behind closing the thread as being biased or unbiased... it's a good place, I like it over there... and have never come across any form of bias when it comes to topics such as this in the past. Think it's more an insightful mod has spotted an attempt to stir something up and they'd rather opt for the easy life and resolve it behind the scenes than let what could potentially be a fight start in their forums. You're too used to the freedom / relaxed moderation of procooling forums in comparison is all... as the mods here know that folks can have an argument without necessarily having a fight... s'not the same elsewhere __________________ www.minimotosidecars.org / www.thermochill.com / www.themusiccollective.co.uk

08-23-2005, 08:58 AM	#143
Joe The Pro/Life Support System Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,041	THeres mods here? Holy shit when did that happen? hehe __________________ Joe - I only take this hat off for one thing... ProCooling archive curator and dusty skeleton.

08-21-2005, 10:47 AM	#131
BillA CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered" Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Posts: 2,371.493,106 Posts: 4,440	Hi Bruce yup and yup and yup again, the Chinese will retain the right to sell (the blue paint is cooler) Les will delve into next week

08-21-2005, 11:33 AM	#133
BillA CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered" Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Posts: 2,371.493,106 Posts: 4,440	thats all Bruce, want more talk with Gabe

08-23-2005, 09:00 AM	#144
Marci Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2003 Location: Wakefield, West Yorkshire, UK Posts: 486	ProCooling - the home of Active Cooling & Passive Moderation.... __________________ www.minimotosidecars.org / www.thermochill.com / www.themusiccollective.co.uk

08-23-2005, 09:02 AM	#145
Joe The Pro/Life Support System Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,041	Yeh, we choose to think that our asshole like attitudes will drive away trolls on its own keeps moderation needs to a low level. Really the ProForums are quite self cleaning __________________ Joe - I only take this hat off for one thing... ProCooling archive curator and dusty skeleton.

08-23-2005, 09:11 AM	#146
Joe The Pro/Life Support System Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,041	I mean check this thread out as an example: http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=12111 who needed to moderate that? __________________ Joe - I only take this hat off for one thing... ProCooling archive curator and dusty skeleton.

08-23-2005, 08:05 PM	#149
Cathar Thermophile Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 2,538	OCAU exposes liars all the time, but what are we going to do? I moderate the EC forums but deliberately take a very stepped-back approach to such issues because more than once I've had such people level allegations at me for being unfairly biased for even doing something as simple as asking probing questions like any concerned forum member would do. This is to be expected though, 'cos, you know, even though I have only ever exercised my moderative powers to move threads about that get posted in the wrong forum or to delete out and out abusive posts, I MUST be very heavily biased to do something as heavy handed as to ask questions. The rest of the overall OCAU forum moderation practises fall under a delicate balance of stepping around arse-hole rip-off merchants who are only too happy to sue OCAU for defamation on the basis that it condones slanderous statements against said arse-hole merchants by not forcibly removing such statements. Now this is not to say that anyone in the EC forum has acted in that way, but it has happened in the past with various vendors who didn't like the stories of negative feedback being posted on OCAU after they ripped someone off. Even though OCAU has won every single legal battle on the basis that it is not responsible for the posts of its members and members have the right of free speech, Agg @ OCAU has been forced into a position where it is just easier to moderate potential vendor verdict posts/topics than to be repeatedly dragged through the courts wasting his time and money in legal expenses. This is the main reason why OCAU in general removes/moderates anything which can be deemed as a vendor verdict. It is purely because it seems that if there are enough arse-holes who attack the right of free speech of pointing out what arseholes they're being, then rather than attack the speaker it's easier and more convenient to attack the forum thereby modifying the forum's policies to prevent such free speech. So that's why OCAU is the way it is. It's a situation of legal convenience.

08-23-2005, 08:12 PM	#150
Joe The Pro/Life Support System Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,041	People sue for defamation? I mean really sue? or just talk about it. because it seems 99% of the internet is all talk, and no game. __________________ Joe - I only take this hat off for one thing... ProCooling archive curator and dusty skeleton.

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