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General Liquid/Water Cooling Discussion For discussion about Full Cooling System kits, or general cooling topics. Keep specific cooling items like pumps, radiators, etc... in their specific forums. |
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08-06-2004, 07:10 PM | #26 |
Cooling Savant
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1.5" height without the compensator suggests that it would fit in a 5.25" bay along with a fill/bleed kit correct, or is the compensator required?
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08-06-2004, 07:11 PM | #27 |
CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered"
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either configuration is available
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08-06-2004, 07:28 PM | #28 |
Cooling Savant
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Interesting... premium price compared to the MCP650 though.. are we looking at 3 figures?
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08-06-2004, 07:47 PM | #29 |
CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered"
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not quite, not cheap
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08-06-2004, 08:17 PM | #30 |
Cooling Savant
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i would imagine that is why C - systems doesnt want to raise the price of thier pump's: its ALOT easier to drop $35 then say $87.50 or even $60.
hmmm only 3/8" ID I like that actually, couple nice ideas spring to mind. |
08-07-2004, 12:12 AM | #31 |
Cooling Savant
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I'll bite, Bill. Reliable, designed for no maintenance for several years, specific to electronic cooling, and affordable for a high-end OEM? Spells G5, I'd wager.
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08-07-2004, 12:29 AM | #32 | |
c00ling p00n
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Quote:
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08-07-2004, 12:53 AM | #33 | |
Cooling Neophyte
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08-07-2004, 02:16 AM | #34 |
Cooling Neophyte
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I suppose two pumps would be used in an app where one large one won't fit- think of those chieftech's with two 80mm slots instead of one 120mm
other than that you have added noise, added heat in our application, and 'technically' more potential for maintainence |
08-07-2004, 10:36 AM | #35 |
Cooling Savant
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You guys ever notice how Bill likes to tease us with these guessing games, then gets real quiet when the answer comes out? I think he's avoiding the question of what I won...
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08-07-2004, 10:53 AM | #36 |
CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered"
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a big Mac ?
call whoever yes HS, you are correct (shit, took a gd road map !) and now you know the designer of that system, and its provider |
08-07-2004, 11:02 AM | #37 | |
Cooling Savant
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08-07-2004, 11:19 AM | #38 |
CoolingWorks Tech Guy Formerly "Unregistered"
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noooooo
you missed a clue it was posted |
08-07-2004, 11:43 AM | #39 |
Big PlayerMaking Big Money
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yea look at the title on that page "Delphi DC pump". Now consider that the Corsair complete kits were made by Delphi...
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08-07-2004, 11:46 AM | #40 |
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the elephant in the refrigerator is becoming clear, and bigger
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08-07-2004, 01:48 PM | #41 |
Big PlayerMaking Big Money
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OK so we have a serious mfgr of pumps interested in PC cooling. When will we see a quality self-priming setup with reservoir built into pump inlet? I want I want. I'm tired of Gooping barbs in tupperware!
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08-07-2004, 01:51 PM | #42 | |
Cooling Savant
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If I remember correctly unregistered, you found C-Systems claim of 50,000 hours MTBF for their pumps to be a completely ludicrous proposition at the time they were unveiled, I did too. I believed, and still believe Hotseat's testing claims and rationale for that pump's MTBF rating. You didn't let him off the hook though. Now you sell a pump with the same claim...ironic to say the least. But which one is more reliable? C-Systems pumps claim the same MTBF your pumps do, and both pumps are engineered by companies with a lot of experience designing cooling solutions for transport equipment like cars, boats, etc. I guess we need to buy some random samples of both pumps and put'em in a loop and wait 'till one breaks. Until that test I don't think the information exists to substantiate a claim of one pump being more reliable than the other. I doubt C-Systems pumps are prone to failure. They had growing pains because the market blew up on them faster than they anticipated. But I can buy two CSP750's from D-tek and save $10 vs. buying one of Swifttech's pumps, from Swiftech directly. So what's advantageous here? |
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08-07-2004, 02:03 PM | #43 | |
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08-07-2004, 02:22 PM | #44 |
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read the original review thread, you are working apples against oranges
what Dan stated was that the motors were purchased from a vendor who had established MTBF values for the motor (presumably the rotating parts and electronics) N.B. the pump does NOT have a 50,000 MTBF (as relates to the shaft seal, and the housing seals, etc.) -> Lee did NOT update the article to reflect this information (why ?) note that there is much I do not know about the C-Systems pumps, just paying very close attention to what is said by those who do know Dan, care to comment ? HAL-9000 being not "prone to failure" is quite different from a MTBF of 50,000 hrs the MCP600 is a good example, it will never have a MTBF of 50,000 hrs because there seem to be a few 'early failures' which cannot be eliminated, handled under warranty - not mission critical - Swiftech incurred massive expenses related to solving the pump head problem, (which became a net loss when the pump mfgr decided to sell direct to our distributors) Swiftech anticipates NONE of these kinds of problems because the MCP650 is a proven and validated design (and because we have a contract) |
08-07-2004, 03:19 PM | #45 | |
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I run a MCP600 pump, have no complaints whatsoever...love the pump. But I'm moving into an Nvidia Ultra 6800 next week for DoomIII reasons, and am going to watercool it. That CSP750 would be a great way to keep the overall flow in the circuit up to par even with the new addition, and with minimal impact and fuss. That kind of scalability makes those things unique in the business, it definitely has a place in the market. Discreet scalable pumps do have advantages. Jury's still out in my mind regarding overall performance as the sole solution in a rig; but I don't know if the MCP650 is either better performing or more reliable than a CSP750-X2, because that information really isn't available at this stage on account of both products' histories in watercooling being rather recent, and not tested enough by valid independent reviewers. That's my point. |
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08-07-2004, 03:25 PM | #46 |
Cooling Savant
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So when you come out with a new pump how do you know the MTBF is over 5 years without actually testing a bunch for over 5 years, it has to be just a, hopefully, educated guess doesn't it?
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08-07-2004, 03:38 PM | #47 |
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the 50,000 hr MTBF is not done by a reviewer, only by the mfgr and perhaps then reviewed by an outside lab
(Razor6, a formal write-up is being prepared) please note that I am not denigrating the C-Systems pump, I even think I have a place for it "Discreet scalable pumps do have advantages." - unclear multiple pumps in series ? multiple pumps in parallel ? the example that comes to mind is the Exos, why do they use 2 pumps ? is it fair to say that the Exos pumps ARE prone to failure ? (based on anecdotal forum evidence ?) other examples ??????? "that information really isn't available at this stage on account of both products' histories in watercooling being rather recent" no, not so at all; do some investigation before saying such nonsense the Laing D4 has over 4 yrs service history in solar heating systems - which are far more demanding than watercooling re the C-Systems - you might be correct, I don't know, but Dan stated that this design did have some years of 'water' service (Dan would have to respond to this point) |
08-07-2004, 03:44 PM | #48 |
Cooling Savant
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off topic, so I hope apples waterblocks are better then corsairs, if they are indeed made by the same company.
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08-07-2004, 06:22 PM | #49 | |||
Cooling Savant
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Last edited by HAL-9000; 08-07-2004 at 06:31 PM. |
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08-07-2004, 07:12 PM | #50 | |
Cooling Savant
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MCP 650 is the same as the muffled D4 except for a sticker. Swiftech is the sole North American distributor, meaning, I think, that they sell to DangerDen. As for price, I'm guessing that we just have to wait until the inevitable drop comes. |
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