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Water Block Design / Construction Building your own block? Need info on designing one? Heres where to do it |
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03-31-2003, 04:57 PM | #101 | |
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I have yet to see anyone be able to razz him the way he has others, but I stick around for that day But he's still right. You may come up with a number of variations of your block, but the only thing you'll be able to measure, is the relative performance among them, not the relative performance against a known block. But hey, I don't see why we're even talking about it, you made it clear that you have no intention of picking up a commercial block, so that you can get a more accurate idea of what the actual performance is. Maybe if someone had a block that they'd be willing to lend you for a while... Either way, you can still optimize your design, and find out which design variation will give you the best result. I'd stick to it, if I was you. |
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03-31-2003, 05:31 PM | #102 | |
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Apparently, you are under the delusion that I am comparing my block to others. However, if you were to *actually read* the posts, you would see that I never drew any comparisons to any other system, nor did I make any claims to absolute accuracy. All I did was simply record a starting point that will be used as a base of comparison for upcoming tests. The power consumption will be the same for all blocks tested. As a constant, any number will do. The water temperature measurements are accurate enough for a hobbyist. The results will be perfectly valid as a comparative measure. But if my process offends you then feel free to never post in this thread again. I assure you, we'll survive without you. |
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03-31-2003, 05:45 PM | #103 | ||||
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If He had his way, we would all just sit on our hands until He spoke and told us what "Is." But that's not gonna happen. He's just not that important. And that upsets him. Quote:
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03-31-2003, 06:53 PM | #104 |
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Personally I admire Graystar for hanging in there. Hes getting gangbanged.. in some cases for good measure, however he is doing what he should do, listening and working through it. A person of lower calibur wouldn't have done this.
Oh.. and one thing about Bill... This IS his being civil! Thanks for taking the time to explain BillA, I am enjoying your comments. The readership will learn alot from this thread for sure. edit.. DOH! Graystar... I was so proud there for a second! Your letting them get to you and regressing. Oh well.. just cut the crap and learn something if thats what you want to do, you have some good participation from the good guys in the industry.. dont burn your bridges now... oh.. and Grumpy men will get you down.. temperatures that is.
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03-31-2003, 07:35 PM | #105 | ||
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But I will pull the reins on my regression and make you proud! |
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03-31-2003, 07:39 PM | #106 |
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Well, there is the iceberg block to compare it with, although I doubt that will tell us much. I think you should make your variations and find your best one, then send it to BillA for testing. Some people might consider having it tested as proving one person right or wrong. I look at it as throwing more info into the data pool. Sponsorship is available to help defer the cost of testing non commercial blocks, details can be found HERE. It used to be a sticky but has since been moved to "General Cooling Forum" and has slipped into oblivion 8( If you decide to go this route, I'd be willing to help and hopefully others would too. There hasn't been a block of this genre put thru the wringer yet. The results would be interesting.
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03-31-2003, 08:08 PM | #107 | |
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I have enough material to make lots of these blocks. After the initial design variations, I might make a few to send to people for testing. Not as accurate as official testing, but certainly cheaper and of comparative value to the testers...and more fun too! |
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04-02-2003, 01:28 PM | #108 |
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I just realized why this block created all that struggle; It defies one of the greatest non written laws of the USA: “Bigger is better”
I don’t care if it’s the performance king or not, the greatness of this design is in the ease of making. Lots of DIYers don’t even have a drill press, and really like a low tools design with decent performance. |
04-02-2003, 05:36 PM | #109 | ||
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I'm hoping to cool 6 computers with one big pump and rad. My main computer (with 2 processors) will get a smaller pump and rad. So far things are shaping up! And don't forget the fun factor in making your own block! I certainly hope people give it a try. |
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04-02-2003, 08:45 PM | #110 |
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...but it wouldn't hurt you to extend the baseplate over the CPU pads.
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04-02-2003, 09:48 PM | #111 | |
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04-03-2003, 03:05 AM | #112 | |
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Did you come here for feedback on your block or to get your ass kissed?, ocers.com is probably your best choice for the later so I hope you came for feedback?... _________________________________________ IMO those pads are'nt worth shit for core protection BB, It's the 4holes mounting that provides stability. A good even pressure on each corner is where it's at (by good I mean 25lbs+). A 'centre' mounting may allow it to 'tilt' under adverse loads on the tubes or block and crush the core, but saying that it should'nt ever happen under normal curcumstances should it?, you'd have to grab hold of the tubes and yank on them... I'd use silicon tube so there's no extra torque on the block though, my old SK6 spring clip was crap, I had to bend it tighter myself cause the weight of the block used to 'loosen' it up after being on there a while, and PVC tube does have a stubborn 'memory' ... |
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04-03-2003, 04:19 AM | #113 | ||
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04-03-2003, 08:05 AM | #114 |
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Is your clip central?, or is it over to one side a bit?. I'd make up a 'plate' out of polycarb or alu with two holes in it for the inlet and outlet and mount it using the four mobo holes (you'll have to put the tubing on after though). You can apply as much pressure as you want then instead of guestimating with the clip. AMD recomend 24PSI of pressure between heatsink and core IIRC, and I'm sure HSF clips don't provide it...
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04-03-2003, 11:45 AM | #115 | |
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My board doesn't have holes for 4-point mounting. |
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04-05-2003, 11:18 PM | #116 |
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I've had some odd expected and unexpected results from various setups.
Starting point - Original Ahanix Iceberg1 system with WhatBlock? Tubing - silicone 1/4" ID Pump - 3 ft. head 150 gph. Radiator - 3.7" x 5.3" x 1.8" Fan - YS-Tech Edge Drive, 5800rpm, 36.8cfm, 3.84 watts, .32 amps, 12 volts. 1. From 1/4" silicone tubing to 3/8" vinyl tubing - temperature dropped about 2C 2. From small radiator to Pinto Heatercore with Vornado 510 fan on low - temp dropped 1C 3. Vornado on high - temp dropped another 2C 4. Switching to inline Danner Supreme Mag-Drive 250 pump - no change in temperature. That last one has me perplexed. The Danner has more than twice the flow and pressure but it didn't make any difference. Some might say pump heat but the other pump was submerged and the Danner was inline. This is something I need to investigate. I also made a new block with scoring on the base to promote turbulence. It seemed to have no effect on temperatures. Finally, I added a second waterblock to see the effects on temperature. The Ahanix components were overwhelmed from the heat of the two processors and the computer had to be shut down. |
04-06-2003, 01:07 AM | #117 |
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Quote: That last one has me perplexed. The Danner has more than twice the flow and pressure but it didn't make any difference. Some might say pump heat but the other pump was submerged and the Danner was inline. This is something I need to investigate.
I think I might be able to answer this one...It is my understanding that you can only draw so much heat from the cpu to the waterblock...ie..efficiency of the waterblock. You will have to change the design of your block or Tweak it a bit more. OR The water currently being used has drawn all the heat it can from the surface area of the block. So if you have a pump that meets the spec's already for the removal of heat...the higher rate and pressure pump will not remove anymore heat and would be considered overkill. Basically it sounds like you have hit the peak performance of your waterblock. Hmm...I will try to explain this better. Lets say your cpu is capable of producing 50 watts of heat...and your water block is capable of removing 30 watts of heat under the right conditions...IE water flow...pressure...Rad Perf and water temp. At this point no mater what outside changes you make other than maybe original water temp..you will not be able to remove anymore heat by changing flow or pressure. I am going to go out on a limb here....and say...Each waterblock that is made will have a predetermined amount of heat it CAN remove under excellent conditions. I may be wrong..its just a theory. Tuff Last edited by Tuff; 04-06-2003 at 01:15 AM. |
04-06-2003, 03:23 AM | #118 | |
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Our CPU cooling problem is primarilly a steady state problem. As such, all of the heat produced by the CPU will be removed by the watercooling system (or HSF, whatever). If this were not the case the CPU would continue to increase in temperature until it fried.
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04-06-2003, 04:56 AM | #119 | |
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I think I know what's up now. It seems like the flow through the block is about the same for the two pumps. I guess my design might be too restrictive. I did intend it to be used with a high pressure pump. I got a hold of one and I'm waiting for the right fittings to hook it up. Edit - I checked this again and the flow is not the same. The Danner is really moving the water through much faster than the other pump. Yet, temperatures remain the same.... Last edited by Graystar; 04-06-2003 at 09:35 PM. |
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04-06-2003, 08:00 AM | #120 |
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Did you resolve the problem of the leaking of the solder? As I remember, you had an issue with your first prototype, where the solder completely clogged the block.
I think that your scoring demonstrates how fins work better. If I had the tools, I'd make and send you another base, where you'd have a bp of 2-3 mm, and fins that stand 3-4 mm tall, out of a single block of copper. |
04-06-2003, 12:46 PM | #121 | |
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04-12-2003, 10:41 PM | #122 |
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WhatBlock? vs. WhatBlock?TB (ThickBase)
bigben2k sent me a 1/8" thick copper base to try. After testing, I found that the thick base made no difference.
I had a motherboard running with a standard WhatBlock? and swapped it out for the thick-base WhatBlock? and the temperature remained the same. This is pretty much what I was expecting. As soon as I gather the parts for a diode reader I'll test again. |
04-13-2003, 12:52 AM | #123 |
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Have you had the chance to make a block with the same cross-sectional area as your barbs/tubing yet?
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04-13-2003, 02:58 AM | #124 |
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But it was'nt less?...
Why not melt it apart and try one with 2mm deep channels in it?, cut them with a junior hacksaw lenghtways about 1mm apart... |
04-13-2003, 11:19 AM | #125 | |||
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Almost forgot...a picture! |
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