Pro/Forums - 1 TB Limit?

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- Snap Server / NAS / Storage Technical Goodies (http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/forumdisplay.php?f=82)

- - 1 TB Limit? (http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=13356)

well put it this way - if I pull out all 12 drives the machine still starts up fine :-)

That's news to me, That may be the fix we are needing. How big is the flashram in that thing ??????

Yup

http://www.snapappliances.com/Products/18000.shtml

Quote:

The award-winning Snap Server™ 18000 is the fastest Snap Server ever. Ideal for primary or secondary storage, it provides critical high-availability features including redundant hot-swappable components and battery-backed Nonvolatile Memory (NVRAM). iSCSI support allows block applications and data to be deployed or stored on the same server as traditional file services and storage. With its high-powered performance, dynamic on-the-fly scalability up to 45.2TB and a price tag less than $5.00/GB, the GuardianOS-based Snap Server 18000 redefines cost-effective enterprise storage.

http://www.pcwb.com/catalogue/item/Q...e&lead=froogle

All the drives are Hot Swap

So they cant really have the Os on the drives....

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Originally Posted by re3dyb0y

Or is it?

Maybe, Maybe not.

Yeesh....none of you have ever seen laugh in????

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Originally Posted by jontz

Yeesh....none of you have ever seen laugh in????

I remember it being on Nick at Night during the 80's but i was in gradeschool then.

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Originally Posted by jontz

Yeesh....none of you have ever seen laugh in????

Oh yes I have, and I mean when it was first aired... lol

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Originally Posted by Phoenix32

Oh yes I have, and I mean when it was first aired... lol

Wowzers :D I was in the re-run era...

I saw the original broadcast's

I miss the old Nick at Nite.

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Originally Posted by blue68f100

I saw the original broadcast's

We all knew that you were around for the first computer...first fire....big bang... :D

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Originally Posted by Hallis

I miss the old Nick at Nite.

I haven't watched it in years, does it totally suck now?

And WOW did this thread go off on a tangent. Sorry! :D :doh:

To be honest i haven't watched in forever. I used to like watching the old shows like Dobie Gillis, and things like that.

*Looks Blankly*

Back on Topic? :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by re3dyb0y

*Looks Blankly*

Back on Topic? :P

Na, this is more fun.

I believe that these days, software raid has been shown to be better than hardware raid and besides, most raid controllers sold these days are really jbod anyway which could only be raid by software. The first tipoff is when your raid controller is larger than your motherboard and needs a piano moving crew to lower it into place (slight gratuitous exaggeration) and then you need a ton of ram in the raid card itself. One of my Unix admin friends where I work (Boeing) claims that side by side, the software raid with the modern 'nix os'es usually outperform the big iron kilobucks hardware raid setups.

he's probably right. there is something to be said for hard core hardware though. Like having more video memory than most people's whole computers :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davesworld

I believe that these days, software raid has been shown to be better than hardware raid

BAH! Not in this lifetime. Software RAIDs have proven many times to be less reliable. Why? Because the software is quite often buggy and not very well tested or supported, whereas companies who put it in firmware on a controller have a tendancy to get it right (or that expensive card doesn't sell). The real difference between the two is where the RAM and Processor time is coming from, either the system RAM, system CPU, and software loaded on that system, or from the controllers RAM, controllers CPU, and firmware loaded on the controller.

The advantage of Software RAID is it is cheaper. It can cut way back and not have a dedicated XOR Processor or RAM and the software can be done cheaply. But rarely will it match the performance or reliability of a current Hardware controller (not some outdated card). For the average Joe, most of us cannot afford the up-to-date Hardware controllers, or like many companies, can, but choose to go for the less expensive approach.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davesworld

and besides, most raid controllers sold these days are really jbod anyway which could only be raid by software.

Uh sure, if they are Software RAID cards, which is what the vast majority are. Duh!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davesworld

The first tipoff is when your raid controller is larger than your motherboard and needs a piano moving crew to lower it into place (slight gratuitous exaggeration) and then you need a ton of ram in the raid card itself.

And what decade were these cards made? Of course they are a bit larger to some extent because they have the XOR Processor, RAM, and Firmware on the card. But these days, that does not mean all that big (not any bigger than your decent video card and a lot less cooling). A decent current XOR Processor is not that large nor does it need much cooling (passive only). The RAM requirements are the same or less than a modern video card, which does not take up much space, all depending on how many ports we are talking about. When you are talking about a dedicated CPU and RAM, it does not take that much to get the job done for a quality high performance Hardware RAID. The exception to this is when they allow the user to use their own RAM. This takes up space to provide slots and so forth for common previous generation RAM sticks, which are most often used. Your exaggeration was more than slight.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Davesworld

One of my Unix admin friends where I work (Boeing) claims that side by side, the software raid with the modern 'nix os'es usually outperform the big iron kilobucks hardware raid setups.

I DO NOT intend to insult your admin friend, but he is either making assumptions and never tested anything, or he is using up-to-date PC/Server systems and seriously outdated Hardware RAID controllers. This goes back to what I said above. If he is using up-to-date systems, then those software RAIDs have access to fast CPUs and generous ammounts of fast RAM. The fact still remains that the CPU time and memory space is being stolen from the system. Without those controllers stealing their CPU/BUS time and memory space, those systems would perform better. And based on all that you said, I can only assume he is using seriously older Hardware RAID controllers. Ask yourself this, how far have we come in processors, memory, bus speeds, etc etc etc in just the last 10 years? Or how about even last 5 years? The comparison is weak...

I DO NOT desire to start a debate here at all, but I felt compelled to correct some misinformation here for those who may not be in the know and be faced with making a decision between the two some day. For this section of the forum, it really is not worth much unless they have one of the later SNAP units that can install expansion cards. Why? Because for the most part we are talking about NAS units. These units, mostly SNAP, are proprietary and cannot just change at our whims or someone is building a do-it-yourself NAS unit. If it's for the proprietary units, then we are stuck with the choices the company chose for us. If building a do-it-yourself NAS unit, it will probably be a Software Raid for a couple reasons. #1, most people building these units cannot (or do not want to) pay the price for a good current Hardware RAID controller. #2, if it is for an NAS unit, the system is a dedicated unit for that purpose and thus the CPU and memory in that unit has very little else to do than run the Software RAID, so it does not hurt anything to use the Software RAID. The caveat for this is if you are doing this unit for a multi-user environment and/or with heavier loads and/or data streaming and/or with a Gigabit LAN, be sure to pick a processor that can handle that load. -AND- if you go with a Software RAID, do not use some unknown cheap POS. Pick a quality highly rated controller, otherwise, you will live with the bugs.

My appolgies to those who I bored to death with this and I did not intend to offend anyone. I can't help it. I am an anal retentive a#%hole who hates generalizations that mislead people and are quite often just plain dead wrong.

Pheonix - Ive heard the same about RAID also

Software raid, if say done in windows, and windows messes up = Raid bye bye

Hardware is better it seems

The raid cards are large, as many have upgradable/changable ram, its own processor or similar

Not designed for home users or little servers

Designed for preformace servers

Pheonix - I think you won the award for the ProCooling Snap Discussion Longest Rant :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by re3dyb0y

Indeed, Well played, sir.

I had a friend with a Compaq Smart Array card. i dont remember how many drives he had connected up to it but they were SCSI and the card was a beautiful thing.

Shane

OMG! You put Phoenix into full on rant mode! RUN FOR YOUR LIVES YOU FOOLS!!!!!! On second thought, don't bother, there is NO WHERE TO HIDE!!!

:hammer: :doh: :D

LOL

They don't call me the fire bird for nothin' ya know... :D