Here in the US, I've seen liquid gasket type products that might be similar to blue-tac in automotive? It comes in both adhesive and plain gasket varieties.

Also, does anybody know how durable the P4 core is? I wonder if the core would start to erode at all. I'm probably being too paranoid, tho :p

About Intel's IHS, does anybody think it'd work using the IHS as a baseplate? I mean, remove the IHS, then attach a direct-die block to the heat spreader and reapply the heat spreader with thermal epoxy?

I probably don't understand your question correctly, but the way I interpret it, you want to remove the IHS, use it as the base of a poly-topped block, then reattach it?

I would say you're just adding another poor thermal interface at that point with the thermal epoxy, since you are replacing Intel's thermal paste/epoxy with a different kind that is quite possibly of lower quality, and I doubt you could mount the IHS as well as they did.


It does make sense to me to remove the IHS, though. I had a great boost in my ability to cool my old K6-2 when I de-capped it; I doubt the P4 is much different in that respect (removing two thermal interfaces which are _not_ flat, b/c of the serials, etc...).

I use the stock mounting cage with the 2 cam levers to mount my P4 blocks. The socket doesn't interfere. You could use the 4 holes in the motherboard and fashion a plate type hold-down. If you're dealing with socket mounting "ears" and an older style socket it gets a little harder.

I really like the P4 mounting system.

It's better than any water block I've ever used, and I've made many, including a pretty close copy of Cathar's block.

Note though, it has a very small margin for error, and proper (multiple) jet design and implimentation is critical to get better-than-copper-water-block results.

anyway, here's a big update.

I've made a new-n-improved CPU direct die block, as well as blocks for the northbridge and Radeon 9700pro GPU.

I've gone back and improved the multiple jet approach that worked so well before, also incorporating a little "rice" in the design allowing the cores to be very visible.

But enough of my rambling, since you've only came here to see the pictures :P

on with the show;

The 3 volunteers;
http://users.bigpond.net.au/volenti/DD1.jpg

The multiple layers of the blocks block laid out under their respective cores;
http://users.bigpond.net.au/volenti/DD2.jpg

The 3 blocks after assembly and a polish;
http://users.bigpond.net.au/volenti/DD3.jpg

The addition of the copper hose connecters;
http://users.bigpond.net.au/volenti/DD4.jpg

Close up view of the GPU block, the surface mount components on the chip surface were sealed with epoxy, the "dreaded" blu-tack gasket can also be seen through the perspex;
http://users.bigpond.net.au/volenti/DD5.jpg

Shots of the blocks mounted in position;
http://users.bigpond.net.au/volenti/DD6.jpg

http://users.bigpond.net.au/volenti/DD7.jpg

And finally the 1/2'' to 4x 1/4'' splitters I made up to run the whole mess.
http://users.bigpond.net.au/volenti/DD8.jpg

Since I hosed the previous install of XP (only just got back up and running) I haven't had a chance to run any tests, I'll get some performance results up soon.

Volenti, you rock! :drool:

This is revolutionary, You should start a company. Direct die was dead and you resurrected it. :mad:

I still think you should test the same setup with a good block to really see if your setup is the absolute best. :p

Let us know your results. It would be cool if you could stick everything in a case. Also, don't use pure methanol of the gpu core cause we all know what would happen if something overheated :D

How about directly cooling the hd's with water? :D

Yeah, useless, like direct die cooling a nb :p

I really admire your work


One thing that i would like to ask, is direct die phase change cooling possible?

I don't understand how the cpu block works. How exactly does the water exit?

my early results show this block to be slightly better than my previous multijet direct die block, by a mere 1/2 a degree or so (c)

since this setup is using evaporative cooling, I'm using straight tap water with a dash of dish washing detergent.( I use a microjet irrigation in-line filter to prevent the jet's from being clogged up)

The water enters via 2 diagonally opposite tubes that only run half way into the block, they feed into the central chamber that contains the jet holes, the water then travels through the jets, over the core, then back up the other 2 tubes that extend almost all the way to the bottom of the block. The outlet tubes also travel through the centeral chamber, however they are sealed at either end to prevent the water short cutting.

I could do a harddrive easily enough, but it would only be good for the wank factor, like the northbridge :D

as for the phase change, I doubt it, no point anyway, they're already killing the p4's with phase change + high V-core (northwood sudden death syndrome)

High vcore kills cpu but i doubt really low temps kill them. What's better is that with a low enough temp you can stably oc p4s without running a high vcore.

I heard you used a filter. I'm currently working on a project to Wc several PCs with a single bong. Can you give me more info on these filters, how they work and where to search for them?

Thanks

Any hardware/gardening store that sells those micro irrigration setups for the garden will also stock in-line filters (to stop the fine spray heads from clogging up) They look like a black plastic pipe bomb with hose fittings on either end, they have a removable internal sive that can be cleaned and re-used,and their cheap.:)

I've thoght about using that filters, but they are designed to use with higher pressure water. Have you tested the flowrate change with and without the filter?

I haven't actually measured it, but the ones I'm using seem to have the same impact that a single 90 degree elbow does.

You can always use 2 in paralell with Y adaptors.

Are you using the triple 'head modded' pump setup for this Volenti?, cause you're gonna need abit of pressure/head for those three puppies are'nt you? :) ...

Kudos on another inspiring job...

Tell us:

Ambient temp
Water temp
core temp
pumps

Are those hoses of the fuel line Kind? I’ve used that some time, are soft and cheap, but tend to develop a white layer in contact with water. It grows over time and deposit on the rest of the system. That could be a long term problem with your jets.

I will be using the 3 stage pump mod, after I finish polishing it up, and get the valves sorted, currently just using a boring old "standard" 2.5m head pond pump. All 3 blocks combined, since they are plumbed in paralell, don't stress the crap out of the pump like the single CPU clock did before, however they are still far more restrictive than "normal" water blocks, and a high pressure pump will still be prefered.


since my ambient temps vary so much during a daily cycle all I can give is a snap shot at this point in time (the reason why I normally just give cpu above water temps)

ambient 29 c
water temp 23.5 c (evaporative cooling remember)
core temp 32.5 c (usual disclaimer about differences between different mobo's ect)
currently just a standard 2800L/H 2.5m head pond pump (to be replaced by the 3 stage pump mod)

Allthough I did buy the hose as fuel hose, it looks and feels like normal silicone hose and have been using it on and off for over a year with out any problems, I will keep an eye out for it though.

Nevermind, maybe mine were low quality stuff, definitely not silicone.

Man, your work is so stimulating! :cool:

Wish I have more time, sure I’ll be pump modding and direct dieing.

I must admit that those see-through blocks look really adorable!
Do you think that direct die on an AMD XP would be too difficult because those L bridges? They could be insulated, but what would be good and TRUSTY insulation?

Keep up the great work!:cool:

I had to insulate some components on the radeon's GPU (used my trusty epoxy) I see no problems with doing the same thing with an AMD XP.

In the new year I'll grab a throughbred and direct die cool it, the small hot core will be ultimate test of my jet design.

If you were to do an XP, I would suggest cover every spec of substrate with something, JFettig over at ocforums lost his 1600+ to an unknown cause, but thinks the substrate absorbed water, maybe it was the core

epoxy and water dont mix.
epoxy is sooner or later going to be dissolved by the water if no insulation is used. I think a bit of silicon might be in order. or just use loctite glue.

My XP is running pretty well now with direct die cooling, and has not shown any problems in the month or so I've been running it.

It does not have very much of the substrate exposed to water, though.

I'll give temp readings as soon as I get around to soldering my AXP internal probe reader soldered back on.


Edit:

Volenti: what do you use to bond the pieces of acrylic together? I've been using superglue (cyanoacrylate), but I suspect there's something better... :D

Oh, also, how do you bond the acrylic and copper?

Epoxy was recomended to me for Cu>poly~carb bonding. Any chance of some pics of your XP setup?, is it a palimino or a t~bred A or B?...

What about combining this project with your Pumpblock Project? I think high flowrates above the die would bring a great performance improvement.
But it might be quite hard to fix such an constructions on the little P4...

I wonder if this would work better than a good Watercooler when usig a T-Bred. the P4 die looks much bigger than an T-Bred. When both use the same energy you have to carry away much more heat/mm². Would also be interestig if the direct cooling is still better when using really extreme CPU Voltages. Might be possible that an ordinary Watercooler is better in that case.

The pump block can't come close to competing with the water volecities achieved with the direct die style jets, though it may have some limited applications in "koolance" style all-in-one solutions,(using a small 12v pump say) since it can still give good performance with very low system flow rate.

With the understanding of jet design that's been developed here I recon we could come up with a jet setup that would give the best blocks a good scare, but I'll not going to wreck another cpu prooving it;)

It's a Tbred 1700+. I forgot to look up the serial, but it seems to get flaky around 1800MHz. I don't remember off the top of my head, but I think I'm running it at 1720 right now.

I would have pictures, but I don't have a digital camera, and my friend's just got stolen from his car.


Epoxy makes sense. It sounds like a good material to use for the layers of plastic as well, but I dislike the long cure times, and I wonder how to keep bubbles out--they're especially noticeable when bonding two pieces of clear plastic. :D

Volenti: how do you keep bubbles from forming when you bond parts, and what have you been using to polish your blocks? Mine always melt when I try the buffing wheel on my dremel, and I don't quite have the patience to do it by hand. :p

I didn't really have any trouble with bubbles in the epoxy, but I usually mix the epoxy slowly to avoid "whipping" air into the mix.

I use a bench grinder with stitched and loose leaf calico buff wheels, as well as the correct buffing compound for each. It's the buffing compound that does most of the work.

Y not run 2 or more pumps parrallel? That would provide alot more pressure. Put a Y connect b4 the block.