Was there any gain from using the single pass rads in actual cooling Blackeagle?(as opposed to flow rates/pressuredrop). I'm wondering if water will run through all of the channel/fin/plates?, or take the course of least resistance...

Then again you're plnning on an Iwaki are'nt you? :D , still thinking of a 30series instead of a 20?...

MadDogMe,

I've never yet had that rad hooked up in a system. I bought it and did the inlet/outlet mod then sent it to Bill Adams for that test. It's still there as I don't need it yet and if it is of any value to him for testing for the Sim that's great. And when it's of no more use for his tests, or gets in his way he'll ship it back. Or if you havn't seen the info on it, it's posted in the Sim development Forum under the thread, "Radiators and Fans", some good info in that comparison of Sense87's dual pass rad and the single pass 2-342 rad. The single pass came out pretty well.

As to the pump I'll use it won't be a MD-30-20. From all I've been able to learn (many thanks to BillA and others) it would add more heat than that heater core can use. There is a post in the thread, "Look at this pump", where Cathar posts information on his MD-30 hooked up to two large heater cores and the pump adds so much heat that even with two cores he gains very little. As the 2-342 single pass I'll be making use of is only about 1/2 of his set up the MD-20 would be workable but wouldn't offer me much extra for the added cost, and I'd have to pull a hard drive cage to fit it. And according to Bill it would have a noticeable increase in noise level. I havn't turned away totally from the idea of a MD-20 as it would offer a increase in performance if I got it set up just right, but not but not a real big performance gain for what it would demand in costs, space, heat & noise.

As the MD-15 will cost less, take up less space, add less heat to both the water & air inside of my tower, it's looking pretty good to me. The MD-15 will still offer the dependablity and long life of a Iwaki. Won't offer a super flow rate like a MD-20 or 30Z, but still quite strong compared to most.

The rad shouldn't be a problem. That is the reason for the inlet/outlets on diagonal cornners, it makes flow resistence in all the tubes about equal. So you shouldn't need a extreme pump to make it work just fine. One thing I've gotten right at least.

I made up my mind to take my time last summer and try to learn all I could before I built a new system. I'm very glad I have. Had I built then I'd be looking at the nForce boards and Barton chips and be sad I hadn't waited, or working my a$$ off on O/T to build yet another system.

I've waited a long time, but now I feel I'm pretty well ready to start buying. I have the rad & will be ordering the tower and DVD & CD drives soon, along with some sound proofing foam to line the tower with. Will order the motherboard, Gfx card, sound card, RAM and hard drive only after all the rest is here and ready. Hope to get the best possible system that way & at best cost. But if I'm able to swing it all, it will be by far the best system I've ever had, and will be one to keep and upgrade as I go along. No more completely new built systems for some time.

Hey Blackeagle,

It's "Since87", as in 'overclocking since 1987'. :p

hell, I thought that was your birthday

Just what were you O/Cing back in 87 man? I can see I got interested in computers a bit late compared to you. My firs one was a pen 350 Compac.

And sorry about the name change.:D

Ahem Pardon me
 

Whilst I commandeer my thread for a moment....

The front of my system's future home (Chenbro SR103 185$)...
http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich.../casefront.jpg

CPU subsystem rough placement....
http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich...cpuroughin.jpg

Ignore the disaster area in the background (MB assembly on tray slides right out and is FAR AWAY from there when work in progress.):D

water will go in pump -> cpu -> rad -> res. -> pump with system path of about 1.3 meters......

(and no the pump will feed in the side not the top, just what I had for display now)

Tried to get a little more detail this time.....
I am doing all this from my laptop (must get time to install photoshop so I can shrink/sharpen this stuff up)

Okay now back to your gabbing.....
:cool:

LOL

Yeah, right. musta been my 1337 use of the englush langwage that through u


IBM PC-AT

Stock frequency was 6 MHz. I overclocked the one at work to 9MHz. Woohoo! 50% overclock! Overclocking involved pulling one socketed crystal and replacing it with another.

That machine had 40 MB of hard disk space and 3.6MB of RAM. It cost about $10K for the hardware and software.

It was running the SCO Xenix operating system. (Multitasking/Multiuser) There were four dumb terminals hooked up to it so that multiple people could use it. We even had a couple 1200 Baud modems so I could dial up from home. Even had an interface to the IBM Selectric typewriter for high quality printing.

That was one loaded system.

Wow Cathar,

Hard to believe they used to pay 10k for a system with a total mb lower than 1/2 a small stick of ram today.

Times do change. With 128mg of RAM in that Compac I thought it was a pretty good set up.

I hate reality (or back to eheim and panaflo)
 

Must install photoshop b4 new posting so that I can crop
As some may have garnered my attempt to get something other than 120mm panaflo H1A (hey they looked good as allelectronics when I saw them :shrug: ) had less than ideal results.

Then I found out that the MJ1200 is about 5 times as loud as my old trusty (and now back in the saddle) eheim 1250. (another is on the way for the GPU/NB loop).

After the delay of remaking the 'inlet expansion' for the 1250 (and yes I bought spares for the impeller cover and locking ring) I am testing the CPU loop once again and here is some explanation for the pic below:
1. Upper T is to allow the last bit of air out from the rad tank (easier than turning over whole case)

2. Tube going to lower right corner allow easy drainage.

Took about 10 minutes to get the last air out of the rad. Running test in the dungeon as I type.

Got the rough plan for GPU/NB loops figured out.

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich...ulooptest1.jpg

now where does it all go???
 

While I wait for eheim #2 for the GPU/NB Cooler (that will be on the other side, pics when I get to that side for real)

Decided to go for the serial instead of parellel setup for them (simplified some routing issues, got close to equivalent flow to 2 3/8" ID in ||) and after all it IS only the NB and GPU. :D

I'm going to use my old BIX for this loop since it fits between the
drive rails in the front (at least that is the plan for now - still fiddling around with layout on that side). :shrug:

Got a raptor to stick in and a 3.5" rheobus is on the way. Will use the 60G for backup purposes (maybe move it out to my USB2.0 enclosure since it is just sitting around)

More later:

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich...temroughin.jpg

one good core deserves another
 

Left is 2-342 for cpu, right is 2-252 for GPU/NB/?
Still figuring out how the innards are going to look (about 80% done. Gets a little neater every time I rearrange stuff.

Can't find something that runs the Fans as well as my whiny nexus controller (less objectionable than the rattle of the fans on other controllers I've tried - would really like a good one to fit in the 2nd 3.5" bay on right).

I've accumulated enough stuff to make a couple more mini systems...:shrug:

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich/rev20/2core.jpg

Rheobus makes a 3-1/2 inch version (ontrols four fans and has LEDs). You can get it here:

www.jab-tech.com

Yeah got that today.
 

Makes my panaflos rattle real well:mad:

Meanwhile decided to see how everything fits on the other side...
Can you say 'rats nest?'

There is a 120mm fan between HD cage and rear to draw out air and cool HDs, one will be moving out after I get the raptor running (another whiny thing but not real loud).

PSU is truecontrol 550 and I will be using most of the connectors on it!

Time to do other stuff for the day. Tomorrow solder pipes to smaller core, goop up the reservoir and at least get the smaller core shroud laid out (1 fan only for that one). Make a back plate for the bottom hole in the back to take a 80mm M1A ( quiet and will be hooked up to the PSU fan control line) I hope to make the PSU fan the loudest one.

http://home.attbi.com/~mikeehrlich/M...ff/ratnest.jpg

thats a lotta core lol

i wonder what the temps would be if the cpu and gpu were on separate loops compared to if they were all on one loop (cores in series / parrallel? ) hmmm.......

:p

They are!
 

You speculation is correct sir!:D

Just a few parts, sure it will all fit
 

Figured I'd share my view of what is being shoehorned into this 'conconction'.

Will assemble and leak test GPU / NB subsystem whilst I am waiting for the new fans and enermax fan controller/temp viewer, (could just sit my rads outside, the wind is a constant 25 mph / frequent gusts to 40 mph as I type this) :cool:


http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich...someassreq.jpg :eek:

Nice sized workshop. Nice sized bench! :D ...

As things slowly resolve themselves
 

First Thanks maddog, the work table was one of my first projects about 10 yrs ago. You can prolly stand about 4 good sized people on it (2x4 1' centered lattice underneath top) and held together w/ 10" lag bolts. If I move it can even be disassembled:D

Had to rebuild res for video/NB cooling (first leaks then too long to bleed):mad: It is leak testing at home as I write this (been going for 12 hrs, no problem. New saying: Snapware is your friend (byebye tupperware!).

Got new enermax UC-A5FATR2 fan controller, hooked up 6 fans and no hum, no rattle, and has 2 temp sensors to boot!

Just waiting for Papst fans to appear on doorstep and can then assemble my world. I will then use my shin-etsu G751(?) heatsink compound (check out the few reviews, seems to beat all else):D
Just using artic alumina on GPU and NB (new C1/A1 stepping of NB really is much flatter than older revs).

Final leak testing!
 

The system is quietly running (water systems that is ) in the basement. Tomorrow I try the computer w/ the temp sensor (compunurse) staring me in the face and the power cord in one hand as I press the power button.

Had one dribble from a 'not tight enough' connection going into the CPU block:mad: That was fixed quickly and tried again.

No pictures since I was distracted by another water problem:

Dropped Pipe section by the street and LOTS of tree roots. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: This has been a war with nature and I am modernizing the 50yr old clay tiles by replacing the whole thing w/ 1/2" thick PVC all the way (10K$:cry: :eek: :mad: ). This will put a 'damper' on my projects for a while (thank god I finished this b4 :cool: )

Trees will go bye-bye this fall REVENGE!! :evilaugh: :evilaugh: :evilaugh:

Pictures will come during the week whilst i watch the money disappear. Gotta switch OS to raptor too (Will be interesting :shrug: )

Re: Final leak testing!
 

lol, what in the world are you talking about??

Replacing entire 50 yr old sewer

Haven't had time to take pics but ...
 

ITS ALIVE, ALIVE!!! :D :D

Learning nuances of fsb vs. mult vs. vcore (lower works better) vs. CPU interface vs...... mem mem like 5-2-2-2 (go figure, most of my progress follows 'well this can't make it any worse:shrug: )
Up to testing at 10x21# or 10.5 @20# at 1.5 vcore and 2.7vdimm
(Looks over at temp monitor touching side of CPU and stuck in SB HSF) Tcpu = 84.7F, Tsb = 98.7, and it is noticably quieter.

The seriellel adapter didn't really put too much dent in drive speed on 100G (41000 vs 42000 in atto) and the raptor tests at about 51500 (and that was at 166 FSB) :D

Gee I wonder what happens at Vcore = 1.475.....:D :cool:

And for the final touch.....
 

Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2003 20:49:01 +1000
To: mad mikee

Subject: Re: Here's the money for the AMD cascade from Mad mikeE

Hi Mike,

Just a quick note to say that your block shipped out today.



:drool: :D :cool:

Final pics after it is installed (and I get my own camera I hope).

hmm! what do I have here!
 

My wife just called and said I got a 'super cpu cooler made in Australia'. :drool:

Wonder what that could be, must check when I get home. :)

Getting new powershot G3 digicam today also :D

Probably install the block during the weekend::cool:

/Edit Block Pics tomorrow w/ NEW G3!!! (thing of beauty, Thanks Cathar! :D

Thank you again Cathar! (Cascade)
 

The cascade went into my system yesterday. Leak tested about 3 hrs w/ no problems, so took the plunge and turned it on. :D :D

The following of course is totally unscientific and qualitative and not finished yet. Only change was cascade replacing MCW-5000 (swifty)and new change of coolant.

Using MBM as temp indicator when running Prime95 torture testing:

Old temps: system ~ 25-26c, CPU 40-41c
New temps: systme ~ 25-26c, CPU 32-33c :D :D :D :D

Using Shin-Etsu G751 so temp may go down over next 2 days!!

Will put up some pics in couple of days after burnin and testing and installing Photoshop.

So I take it that you're pleased Mike? ;)

While I don't think that ~8C better than a MCW-5000 is really possible from a pure "change of the block" perspective (perhaps the MCW-5000 wasn't sitting flat? Dry thermal joint?), I'm glad you're seeing a good improvement.

Do you overclock at all? Seeing any improvement there?

YES!
 

Was going to say 'check the profile' then noticed I wasn't saying what barton I was using (now fixed of course:D ) so: 1.83 at 2.33 GHz and will try for higher after then Shin-Etsu finishes curing. Hopefully the memory won't be holding me back:shrug:

If the MCW-5000 is the cadillac of WB, the cascade is the Ferrari!
Love this block (and I have the fans turned all the way down:D )

I think I am done for awhile
 

First the setup prior to the piece d'resistance:

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich/rev20/swifty.jpg

Then the finishing touch: :D

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich...ascade-bot.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich...ascade-ang.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich...ascade-top.jpg

a transplant:
(note homemade heatsinks for the memory :) )

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich.../casc-mntd.jpg

a transfusion:

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich/rev20/fluid.jpg

and Whalla! a super cooling system!!!!:D :cool:

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich/rev20/boxwcasc.jpg

and so the other half doesn't feel left out:

http://home.comcast.net/~mikeehrlich/rev20/drives.jpg

My sig says my speed and load temp (MBM) under prime95 is 35-36c, no load is 30 w/ ambient ~22-23c (I had to boost Vcore to 1.8v to get to 2400Mhz (what's that about an xp 35-3600? :D)), if I left it at 2300, Vcore goes back to 1.73 and temp down about 3c

Thanks to all the people who have helped, whether by direct input on this 'concoction', or just through the wonderful bounty of information you all pass around so freely and helpfully, and of course last but not least Cathar for making the cascade!!!!!

Overall I am very happy w/ this project and it will serve me well until I work on mikeeputer case rev 3.0 when I rivet my own together w/ the orientation I want and rearrange the compartments so things will be even cooler !!!(next year) :cool: :cool: :cool:

What a great job Mike!

Some great temps and a fine O/C. I thought about the cube type case as they sure do offer lots of room to work with. I don't have room to fit the wide case where my desk is in the house though.

I'd be real interested in what the RAM coolers were made from and if they gave you any gains?

You sure did go all out man, dual cooling loops and all. Great job!

And nice pics!:D

Edit: Any O/C on the 9700?

Re: I think I am done for awhile
 

Your CPU sounds much like mine. It'll do 2400MHz at 1.80v.

Boost that voltage up to 1.95v, and you'll probably find that your CPU will do 2600MHz quite happily.

The best I got out of my Barton was 2795MHz at 2.28v, and again, it does 2400MHz at 1.80v with the water-cooling.

These 0.13u AMD CPU's just love the voltage. The more you give them, the better they go. The only thing holding you back is the fear that you'll toast the CPU.