And i'm very sorry if my design reminds you of maths :p

In all honesty, pm/email if you dont want to post in an open forum, what are they charging you for the machining?

I know a man that could help, they make form tools among other things it may be more cost effective, depends on how much material is left after youve machined the grooves (i.e. min base thickness)

As for a punch, b'jesus thats going to cost £40/50 max, then its a case of a mangle press and bosh bosh bosh.

]JR[

I think we need to talk.

I got hold of many machinists at the start of this project, and in the end, the only one who could get the groove width and height I needed is charging me a shitload.

I'll e-mail you the real price, but its HIGH! too high to sell in all honesty.

I'll like to hear your friends thoughts on it if possible, if he runs a machnie shop.

Sure send me an engineering drawing too if poss and ill get on it tomorrow. A form tool may cost several hundred to setup, but then its like 10-20sec of machine time per item. Then part it off, and go again. If your looking at selling over 100 then its deffo worth it.

Im thinking of opposing C's for a direct die evap, check phase-change.com, since the material stock for my design was round, they were quoting ~£10ea.

]JR[

I'm done with opposing C's ;) despite the results I was seeing... this thing puts my C block to SHAME mate.... its in a different league.

Having said that, I am following your thread over at PhaseChange forums, you're due and update ;) your evap looks very nice, very nice job.

If you want the full ACad pics, i'll send them over, but no, I'm not looking at selling more than 100, although I would obviously like to.

The UK is totally without a waterblock manufacturer of any repute, and I'd like to change that, but I'm aiming modestly for a first shot.

I'm meeting my machinst tommorow, see what he says about the 2 plate job, and I'll get it made. I'm already down a LOT from this project, and I want something perfect at the end.

And he's going to make it for me.

In phase change, gravity and vacuums arent your friend, thus C's or similar it has to be. Once im tried and tested, im aiming for a larger market, although buying my first house is somewhat slowing me down right now.

The demise of Jess is unfortunate, but there will be a return im 100% sure.

Ill see what my man says, will probably take a couple of days for him to get back to me, on the costs of putting your block together.

With respect to watercooling, still, imo everyone is looking at the wrong end of the game, it dont matter what you got strapped to the cpu, if you got 40degree water. Lets see some inovative rad designs, there hasnt been a progressive patent in that department since the mid 70's, and that is a modern heatercore design that we know and love.

]JR[

I agree on the rad design thing, but on the other hand, people have been developping this technology for years, people a lot more intelligent that you or me, simply because if someone could make a more efficient rad design, they'd flog it to Ford and retire a millionaire.

I truly believe that you cannot go much further in rad design.

And yeah, Jess and OCPC seem to be all but gone, sad, but it has happened. To me, it seemed like they could not compete with products from the US and OZ, either on price or performance.

I recall one argument I had with Jess via e-mail, about the price he was charging for some products. I predicted to him that people wouldn't pay that for very long, and as it turned out, i was right. He got undersolf by US products. However, I don't revel in it, I would like to see the UK turning out some half decent watercooling kit, no matter who is making it.

It is a shame, no matter our different opinions on the way watercooling is progressing.

I'd like to see him make a come back. And I'd like to get his, and your opinions, on the latest design JR.

Please help. I have to go to bed, work in 5 hours. Adios.

Ay up JR :) ...

I agree to a degree with JR about the rads, HC's are designed to output heat at a high temperature, not to remove it to ambiant. They don't even have turbulators in them!. Most 'custom made for PC' rads are HC copies in the available molds/stamps. Not new designs. Turbulators and Cu tubes would be a start, as would a single pass for reduced pressure drop. There's room for improvement. But at the end of the day it's chilling water or DDPC that's where the chillblains are :D ...

Can you give us a link to phasechange forums?...

www.phase-change.com

here
or more specifically here is my project so far

]JR[

Unfortunately our applications arent the same, as mdm pointed out. We have small dT's to contend with, heatercores have large dT's. I would lay money on the fact if you could be bothered to try, a 20% improvement over a heatercore is easily do-able.

]JR[

GTA m8
as you mentioned above it would cost £700 pounds in tooling for a punch for cutting the triangles, would it not be cheaper to find a firm to laser cut the middle plate of your block?

By the way nice looking block:drool:

I'm P'd off at the mo as my drill has been out of action for a month and the company servicing it seems to have misplaced it:mad: only had it 2 months, want to try making my first block lol

Hmmm, depending on how I run my radiator setup, my water doesn't climb to much more than 2C above the temperature of the air flowing through.

A Black Ice Xtreme with a noisy fan will hold your water at maybe 7-8C above ambient at full load. A "slightly larger than a BIX" Ford Festiva core will get you down to 3-4C above ambient.

I don't think it's so much that people are looking at the wrong end, it's just that with a decent radiator there's not much left to be gaining at that end.

Something innovative for computer water cooling would be a water-chiller that tracks the dew point and holds the water at a constant 0.5C above the dew point. Now that's an invention I'd like to see.

:) tracking the dew point is easy, sticking it on a chiller is easy, chillers are not cheap tho...

I got 2x380cfm fans on my heatercore, even with a gpu and cpu tec i can stay within 5 degrees of ambient, with just watercooling its difficult to tell the difference between water and ambient.

The problem is rads, that dont take large amounts of fannage, that are efficent at low dT's which heatercores are not. One idea i had for rads was lots of parallel plates pairs, say 1mm apart and 1mm between pairs with the water running between the pairs and air between them (ill draw a pic) that gives you uber area of water touching metal, which inturn touches air.

]JR[

Ok perhaps green pen wasnt the weapon of choice for drawing ;) But I envisage say 50 of these water carrying fins, give a total cross section of (30x1) x 50 = 150mm^2, with a manifold top and bottom to make a single pass all in parallel arrangement.

http://www.phjrw.34sp.com/rad.jpg

]JR[

YGPM re: centre plate idea, should work a treat.

]JR[

Due to lack of in the countryness i havent had a chance to get you a quote, rest assured tomorrow ill ask, and hopefully by friday youll have...

]JR[

Cheers,

I've got a quote for the latest design, and the cost has dropped a fair amount, which is great.

I'm looking to start taking orders, on an ad-hoc basis, in the next week or 2.

I'd also think that the design (without a middle plate and slits) will be less restrictive. And i still think it will work great for pelts.

Yeah, it would be less restrictive, and I have now eliminated the middle plate, but some aspects of a middle plate are now built into the top plate, to save costs.

But as has been said before, restriction is not necessarily a bad thing, if it aids cooling. Just because a block is not restrictive doesn't mean its going to be a top performer.

And although you might be right about the pelt, I doubt it. The circles would only cover about 60% of the surface of the TEC, which is definatly not a good thing.

If you put a 45x45mm pelt on this block, you'd actually be able to see part of the peltier sticking out of the side of the block, not only not under the cooling section, but not even touching copper.

The design is easily adaptable though, just add more circles.

any vague estimates of possible prices yet? :)

ah, i wasnt aware the block was that small.
Of course - it would be good for pelts if you made it larger (more circles).

You are using a lathe, right?
I'd imagine that is much cheaper than machining.

Thats very much the point, machining grooves like the WW is too expensive for me.