What gas do you use.
 

Just interested in what gas you run in your rigs.
R22 is about to be banned in EU, so don't think Ill bother there.
Reading up looking likely R410a ?????

Any sugestions :)

Hi Jess,

U probably already know this but Chip-Con use "Refrigerant: Environmental friendly R134A".

HCF 134a
The production of R-22 or Chlorodifluoromethane is being phased out (pun intended)

Here is the info on Tetrafluoroethane (R134a)
http://www.dupont.com/suva/na/usa/aa/

Danfoss http://www.danfoss-maneurop.com/inte...unction=refrig

Yeah currently got R134a myself, but TBH its not that good.
Supprised chipcon use it - but thanks for answering that, i did wounder :)

Yeah R134 is a horrible refrigerant though.
I very cheap easy refrigerant to use is R290(propane).Works great,I use it in all my systems.Beats the pants off of r134a any day :)

Check out this link for the various types of refrigerants.

They won't tell you which one is best, but it's a start. I hear that R-409A is good, but apparently hard to get.

Propane is flammable R134A is not!

As you already know Phase change cooling efficiency is determined by the pressure? the R used is less important than the compressor spec, however I do agree that 404A is a better option for this application in europe (Ozone friendly).

Nice logic.
Who cares if propane is flammable?If you have any brains at all you wont hurt yourself :rolleyes:

That's what Punisher said, then he heat stressed his system with a torch.

We never saw him again:D

Propane is dangerous, in more ways than one. The smallest leak will wake you up at night, or when you turn on the light switch, first thing in the morning...

There are better, and safer alternatives. Propane is just not a smart choice, any way you look at it.

Wrong.
I have emptied systems and went right ahead and brazed things on the same system.Propane is NOT as flammble as you think,you can go ahead and think what you want.But until you actually try using it,you can't comment.Although it does smell bad :)

I talked to punisher after he soldered his while it was full of propane(not something you usually want to do) and it just made a fireball....Big deal.
Oh by the way he got banned from here,thats why you havent heard from him :p

R290 is a safe refrigerant if you know what your doing.Even if it had a slow leak over night and you turned your light switch on,what do you think would happen?Nothing,thats what would happen.
I have had my room full of propane,smells horrible,but I didnt get some crazy out of control fire.

They make alot of propane based refrigerants too.Propane makes fire if introduced to flame,freon makes a poisenous gas.
So dont go around using your torch on a full system ;)

I could link the specs on these materials you mention and explain why R134A and R404A have better thermodynamic properties for phase change cooling.

Perhaps I could persuade you to give the other refrigerants a try I think you would be surprised! :)

In the UK there are laws about usin / handling these materials(for H,S & Environmental reasons) This is what Jessfm's original post was about!

Hey,I never said R290 was the holy grail of refrigerants did I?I just said it is a cheap refrigerant(8 bucks for 30 pounds).And it is damn cold.

R134a is NOT better than R290,I have used both.R134a is a medium temp refrigerant.R290 lacks molecular weight,that is why it doesnt perfrom as good as say R22.If R22 wasnt so expensive I would be using it,trust me.But I ran out of R22....
R290 definitely owns R134a!

So your telling me propane is banned where you live? :confused:
I know r290 is not legal to be used in commercial refrigeration,but in DIY it does not matter.

I personally thought about changing from R22 to R502. Its pretty good reliable one. It was widely used like 10 yrs ago dunno what happened. Another interesting one is R408 i think. Anhydrous Ammonia is the name. Very TOXIC! But will achieve very low temps.

R407c is pretty nice. And if you can get it HC-12a is really cheap and works pretty well.

|Punisher| was banned for promoting the use of propane as a refrigerant, while clearly not taking the time to discuss the dangers, nor the safety measures required to handle/use it safely. He was wreckless, period.

If you have HVAC training, then I would encourage you to share the RELEVANT information, instead of blindly promoting R290 (propane). Otherwise, you will get banned too.

And no, testing a theory by pressing a torch against a system loaded with propane DOES NOT constitute relevant experience/knowledge. It was, and still is foolish to try it.

This "little fireball" may not seem to be a big deal to you, but for everyone else out there, it could become one, as it ignites something else, starting a REAL fire.

As for your room being full of propane, you certainly did get lucky. Had a fire started, you would not be around to tell us about it, now would you?

Well you see, I am not punisher.
Uhm he got banned for flaming.He gets banned for flaming everywhere he goes.Trying to promote R290 is no reason to get banned,even HVAC techs carry it.I am not blindly promoting it.I actual handle the stuff,you probably dont even come near it.

IMO if you cant seal your system up,and worry about it leaking.You shouldnt be playing with this stuff, or you should learn to braze.

Also he wasnt testing a theory by putting a torch to it,as far as I know he forgot it had propane in it.Not a good thing really.Usually in a running phase change system you dont have a torch on a solder point, so i wouldnt worry about that :rolleyes:
If it would have been R22 it would have created a deadly gas mmmmm sounds great..... little wanna be torch or deadly gas,lets just think about that?

Why dont YOU tell me the disadvantages to R290 after actually using it?Hell, have you even built a system?
Alot of refrigerants are made with propane.I read somewhere R290 is used in the UK.(commercial freezers I believe)

Doesnt matter, I am not forcing anyone to use it, just trying to open their eyes to a good cheap refrigerant.Sure you have to take precautions, like learning how to braze so your system doesnt leak would be good.Just dont be an idiot with the stuff and you will be fine.Same with R12 R22 etc. dont sniff it....

Be nice if you could give me some RELEVANT information why I should not use it.I have had nothing bad go wrong, other than that sulfar smell.Also why the hell would you have an ignition source near your phase change system?

That's the kind of useful information I'm talking about!

Welcome to ProCooling.

haha I see, I thought you were just bitching at me ;)
Thanks for the welcome(although I have been here for awhile) :)

Here's a link to the US department of Transportation, on HAZMAT.

Hazardous Material handling precaution.
(go down to the refrigerant section)

You'll find usefull info, including wether the refrigerant can be ignited with a spark, if it creates a toxic substance if burned, and general precautions.

I've been playing with some 1,1 difluoroethane. Seems to be a pretty good refrigerant. Its really cheap. It is extremely flamable though. Or so it says on teh warning label. http://thecrucible.ca/images/DFE.jpg

If anyone is interested, I seem to remember that over at Overclockers.com that someone put up an article going into great detail about building a phase excahnge system. The design part is not what is important with most of you HOWEVER the author went into details about almost a dozen refrigerants that can be used and even the boiling points on most of them. Might not be a bad idea to check it out.

Just a thought, that's all......

The story header is called "How-To Build A Refrigerator CPU Cooler"


Enjoy freezing your machines :D

You missed this thread

Opps...forgot :)

But propane is used to make R134A work better in auto application.

Since 134A itslef sucks ass for cooling, it needs a helper to achieve the same performance of R12.

Thats why R134A boosters have a flammable warning on them, they are propane based.

What about Home brew's ??

R290 with R134 , say 40/60%

Or how about just straight R290?
Dont be a wuss, do you want good temps, or not?It is up to you....
There are alot of propane based refrigerants....

iirc the thing about propane is its really light. So you're supposed to mix it with something else to make it heavier.

It does have a low molecular weight, but I use it straight and it works fine.Just a little less performance than R22....

the R134a aint tha expensive, you can get it at any aouto supply and it fits the gauges...so I use it. I might ry the propane inrichment though, sounds interesting!

Sorry to bump this ancient thread, but the concern over propane seems badly overstated to me. I built a propane flamethrower a while ago and while it certianly burns, it does NOT burn like some people seem to think. In fact my device was ineffective, I badly overestimated how well propane burns.

Basically even under pressure an explosion of a modest amount of propane is pretty harmless. I had a 1.5gal tank of propane that I didn't check was empty when i put the torch to it. It blasted up in my face, and while it was unpleasant, it was not very harmful; I wasn't hurt and learned to ALWAYS double check fuel lines are empty first.

This was with a very large amount of propane compared to what most people here would likely be using. Its pretty hard for me to imagine a serious accident happening with propane. Its just not that easy to burn in the amounts we're talking amount, and if it did escape it would dissipate harmlessly into the air at 10x the amounts we're interested in.