[winewood]

Ok, I for one think GTA is absolutely right.
(preparing for flames)

If someone says, I can get the right numbers, and basically through intimidation, tech speak, using impossible standards and everyone else is irrelevant, they are the problem in this scenario. Many people are perpetuating this as well.

EVERY time I see someone attempt to get basic numbers, they are attacked here. Therefore no one wants, nor will post numbers AT ALL if they know whats good for them. They wait for someone to discredit them for self gratification and then all the assclowns come to pipe in on a blanket party. How does this help anyone? Other forums not filled with roadblocks are helping each other reach a good understanding of what THEY can do to be more accurate. In the meantime they find what is accessable and attempt to make it better. This one is stalemated completely (in case you haven't noticed) pH and Jaydee will fail, because i doubt neither will have an exact replica of Bills testbed, nor will they be helped to find the easiest and most fair way (possible to a normal individual) with anyone elses help.

1st of all there IS a way to get basic simple numbers that are predictors of how a block will work without flushing $20K down the drain for a test setup.
2nd No ONE person has all the answers, and cannot dictate to everyone else what is acceptable and what isn't.
3rd There HAS TO BE a way to find a good predictor of performance or a guage.
4th Sitting in one spot spinning your wheels is a sure way to accomplish nothing.

BillA stated he wouldn't "help" when he joined Swiftech? (I don't know or remember) Well thats exactly what is happening regardless! Attempt to convince the world that any result not blessed by ONE technique is completely invalid. That just isn't reasonable nor rational. He is accompishing his goal of self inflation and glorification by stating everyone else is CRAP, and as seen in this thread being a *sarcasm*-> great help in getting this moving toward an objective. A constant crap on everyones parade isnt the glue that joins anything together. Positive constructive feedback is.

Now BigBen2k wanted HELP on an objective. BillA wants the world to belive he is the messiah and standing alone on a platform and is making sure that BigBen will never reach a goal that doesn't leave Billa in the center of everything. BillA you are paid to do your job and use your equipment. I find it highly suspect that now, no one can measure anything anymore.

Frankly a good 'ol posting of I get X on my system with one block, and X on my same system with the other. There is direct and indirect meathods avaliable. SOMETHING is better than nothing.

Now is it BillA's job to help us? No. Is it our job or interest to find an answer? Yes. Ask yourself in honesty. Who is helping people get to a goal of a testbed and who is putting a stick in the spokes of the wheel? I appreciated your contributions Bill. I really did. But please stop this game of yours. Only your employer seems to gain since frankly they are the only ones we will never see any critisims from you on.

Now show me someone whom I can respect who will be willing to make testing accessible to the masses, and not be intimidated. If I make people mad with this, at least I may see some action on BB's resolution..

If you disagree, feel free to post. I have been here for long enough to speak my peace and make up my own mind on my observations. Flame at will.

update: just saw pHaestus' post. This is a classy move. A simple orchestrated testbed is a great idea.