phase change n00b needs help

Opt3x · 03-03-2003, 05:04 AM

I am building myself a case. I have been reading about phase change cooling and I am considering implementing some form of it in my case.

What I am wanting:
*Capillary Phase Change, Cooling Water.
*Water Pumped through to CPU, NrthBridge, GPU.
*40W-60W Peltier/s cooling reservior water.
*StampII based controller.

I don't know if this is unworkable or highly improbable but I don't believe it to be impossible. Money is no object but I wonder if this system can be done with these restrictions:
*12v Compressor
*CPU Temp under 0C at 100% load with some form of antifreeze or brine(if I can get stainless components made up)
*I'd like the whole system to fit in a perspex/aluminium box no bigger then 20mm sqr.
*As quiet as posible (30db or less)

So all up thats a Water cooled system with the water being cooled down to -0 temps by a small phase change system then the water being kept cool by peltiers to prolong the time before the compressor starts back up.

I'd like the system to be practical but i mainly want it for the bragging rights and the ultimate PC factor at my local LANs.

Can it be done?
Is a capillary system the way to go?
Can I fit W/C and Phase and Peltier in a 25mmSqr box?
Am I stupid and insane?
If I have stainless steel components can I run brine as my heat transfer medium?
Is the compressor from a car-camping fridge okay?

As I said before money is no object. The only reason I am thinking of this setup is I am worried about condensation. Direct contact Peltiers and direct contact phase run the risk. Another question:

What would a PC Dehumidifier do in the way of condensation?

Maybe I have lost my brain! The system doesn't need to be an elaborate Nitrogen cycle system. I would consider this reasonable and my mate was a qualified refridgeration tech about 15yrs ago and he reckons it can be done... so I leave it to you to help me see the light.

Sorry half of this isn't relvant but hell you seem like the most knowledgeable cooling people here.

THANKS

Enyin · 03-07-2003, 05:17 PM

Always interesting to hear ideas - no bash here just some follow up questions for ya.

Why have pelts cooling the water if you're cooling the water with your phase change system? or do you mean pelts on your cpu / gpu and you're cooling the hot side of the pelt with water, which in turn is cooled by the phase change chiller - this is a workable design, sort of a hybrid cascade system

As far as condensation goes you're going to have it at the temps you want to go to - your two options are to A) insulate every cold surface in the system with closed cell foam / silicone / conformal coating etc B) make the case airtight and dessicate the air inside with a dehumidifier or chemical dessicant

Referring to the size aspect - you want to fit the whole phase change system in a 20mm box? I have to assume that 20mm was a typo - that is *really* small. Your average small hermetic compressor is going to be around 200mm high and equally as wide. If you take a look at the commercial phase change systems like vapochill you'll see that they usually fit them into a compartment that is attached to the bottom of a normal case

You definitely have something doable started here - just a few other quick answers:
1- yes capillary is going to be the way to go, it's difficult to find an expansion valve that is small enough for our size systems
2- I hear stainless steel is incredibly hard to work with, just go with windshield washer fluid as your coolant and use cheap copper tubing available at any home depot
3- 12vDC compressors are available
4- quiet is possible - think of the noise a dorm fridge makes when it turns on, it's barely audible
5- car camper compressor - depends on the size of it, might be good - probably low power draw
6- what's a PC dehumidifier?
7- you are not stupid or insane, it's a fun hobby

*these are just my opinions - and I'm just a joe schmoe interested in the hobby like you - good luck and be careful!*

Opt3x · 03-14-2003, 06:40 PM

Thanks you're a legend.

03-03-2003, 05:04 AM	#1
Opt3x Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 2	phase change n00b needs help I am building myself a case. I have been reading about phase change cooling and I am considering implementing some form of it in my case. What I am wanting: Capillary Phase Change, Cooling Water. Water Pumped through to CPU, NrthBridge, GPU. 40W-60W Peltier/s cooling reservior water. StampII based controller. I don't know if this is unworkable or highly improbable but I don't believe it to be impossible. Money is no object but I wonder if this system can be done with these restrictions: 12v Compressor CPU Temp under 0C at 100% load with some form of antifreeze or brine(if I can get stainless components made up) I'd like the whole system to fit in a perspex/aluminium box no bigger then 20mm sqr. As quiet as posible (30db or less) So all up thats a Water cooled system with the water being cooled down to -0 temps by a small phase change system then the water being kept cool by peltiers to prolong the time before the compressor starts back up. I'd like the system to be practical but i mainly want it for the bragging rights and the ultimate PC factor at my local LANs. Can it be done? Is a capillary system the way to go? Can I fit W/C and Phase and Peltier in a 25mmSqr box? Am I stupid and insane? If I have stainless steel components can I run brine as my heat transfer medium? Is the compressor from a car-camping fridge okay? As I said before money is no object. The only reason I am thinking of this setup is I am worried about condensation. Direct contact Peltiers and direct contact phase run the risk. Another question: What would a PC Dehumidifier do in the way of condensation? Maybe I have lost my brain! The system doesn't need to be an elaborate Nitrogen cycle system. I would consider this reasonable and my mate was a qualified refridgeration tech about 15yrs ago and he reckons it can be done... so I leave it to you to help me see the light. Sorry half of this isn't relvant but hell you seem like the most knowledgeable cooling people here. THANKS

03-07-2003, 05:17 PM	#2
Enyin Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: NJ, USA Posts: 22	.. Always interesting to hear ideas - no bash here just some follow up questions for ya. Why have pelts cooling the water if you're cooling the water with your phase change system? or do you mean pelts on your cpu / gpu and you're cooling the hot side of the pelt with water, which in turn is cooled by the phase change chiller - this is a workable design, sort of a hybrid cascade system As far as condensation goes you're going to have it at the temps you want to go to - your two options are to A) insulate every cold surface in the system with closed cell foam / silicone / conformal coating etc B) make the case airtight and dessicate the air inside with a dehumidifier or chemical dessicant Referring to the size aspect - you want to fit the whole phase change system in a 20mm box? I have to assume that 20mm was a typo - that is really small. Your average small hermetic compressor is going to be around 200mm high and equally as wide. If you take a look at the commercial phase change systems like vapochill you'll see that they usually fit them into a compartment that is attached to the bottom of a normal case You definitely have something doable started here - just a few other quick answers: 1- yes capillary is going to be the way to go, it's difficult to find an expansion valve that is small enough for our size systems 2- I hear stainless steel is incredibly hard to work with, just go with windshield washer fluid as your coolant and use cheap copper tubing available at any home depot 3- 12vDC compressors are available 4- quiet is possible - think of the noise a dorm fridge makes when it turns on, it's barely audible 5- car camper compressor - depends on the size of it, might be good - probably low power draw 6- what's a PC dehumidifier? 7- you are not stupid or insane, it's a fun hobby these are just my opinions - and I'm just a joe schmoe interested in the hobby like you - good luck and be careful!

03-14-2003, 06:40 PM	#3
Opt3x Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 2	Thanks you're a legend.

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