Dead??? What did I fry?

AllRoy · 09-16-2002, 11:43 PM

I am running a AMD 1900+, KG7, and gf4 ti4600 with a chiller and 226W pelt on the cpu. Yesterday I had some hard locks on Neverwinter Nights (game freeze) well after (4-5 of these) I got no boot screen. So my question is, what did I fry? I am guessing the mobo but would like to hear what you say....also when I turn the computer on, even though I get no boot, I see the coldblock temp begin to rise.

Gerwin · 09-17-2002, 12:24 AM

Do you get any post-messages from the mobo/BIOS ?

AllRoy · 09-17-2002, 12:42 AM

Nothing...no beeb from lack of vid card and just a blank screen....no boot, no bios....nothing!

Gerwin · 09-17-2002, 01:06 AM

Have you tried resetting the BIOS?

AllRoy · 09-17-2002, 01:18 AM

Still doesnt work

gmat · 09-17-2002, 02:56 AM

It's either the PSU or the mobo itself.
Did you check for a leak, or moisture due to condensation ? Maybe the insulation around the socket failed... Or the PSU was tired of powering a 226W pelt...

MadDogMe · 09-17-2002, 06:45 AM

I'd agree it's probly soaking around the CPU. If the CPU temp is rising I doubt it's dead, I doubt the mobo's dead, and i doubt the PSU is dead either. strip it down and check for moisture around the CPU back/socket.
This happened the other day with a chap with a Swiftech TEC~block, HL's then boot~failure, his was OK after, so keep your fingers crossed!

...

Don't keep trying to boot it up, if it aint dead yet ~ you may kill it that way!!.

How long has this rig been setup & running?.

What kinda Insulation have you got around the CPU?, did you use Di~elactric grease/Vaseline?.

What Block are you using?. Retail or homebrew?.

What kinda insulation have you got on the tubing?.

Have you got the TEC on its own PSU?.

Luck Dude!!...

AllRoy · 09-17-2002, 11:27 AM

How long has this rig been setup & running?.

3 weeks

What kinda Insulation have you got around the CPU?, did you use Di~elactric grease/Vaseline?.

silicon and dielectric grease withconformal coating on the back

What Block are you using?. Retail or homebrew?.

homebrew

What kinda insulation have you got on the tubing?.

foil tape and copper tubing insulation

Have you got the TEC on its own PSU?

Yep

Weird was I cleared the cmos and it worked once

decodeddiesel · 09-17-2002, 11:59 AM

I agree that you should take the system down and remove everything checking for condensation... Then I would rebiuld and try to boot it with just the essentials (ie. MoBo, CPU, Video, RAM, one HDD).

mkosem · 09-17-2002, 03:15 PM

um, I'm hoping that you forgot to mention that there was also neoprene insulating all of the cold parts. There is right?

--Matt

AllRoy · 09-17-2002, 04:52 PM

Sorry...yep..there sure is....lots of it!

AllRoy · 09-17-2002, 06:55 PM

Well...I took everything apart (again) to look for condensation....nothing...so I hooked it back up....this time it lasted about 1 min before lockup and no boot screen

HelpImNewbish · 09-17-2002, 08:49 PM

Make sure its not overheating. Its possible everything isn't quite clamped down good on the CPU. Try putting your graphics card back to default clocks, too. When that gets too hot it'll lock up, but i've never heard of it refusing to boot for a while afterwards.
Give us some more info on your system.

AllRoy · 09-17-2002, 09:40 PM

KG7 Raid (modded)
Athlon 1900+
Teac 24x12x10 CDRW
Pioneer 106S DVD
2 x Quantum Atlas III 10K SCSI drives 36.5 GB
MegaRaid Elite 1600 Raid Card
Gainward Ti4600 golden sample

AllRoy · 09-17-2002, 11:30 PM

ok...now got to the front win xp screen....ran ok for 1-2 min then my front fan went off and then came back on....next the screen started having some graphics problems...(blocks....etc) and win started stuttering....locking up and off

What the heck happened now?

Can O' Beans · 09-18-2002, 01:09 AM

I'd clock everything back down to normal speeds and remove the WC gear if possible, set it off to the side. Go with air heatsink, etc...

If the PC boots up fine under normal working conditions, and is stable through a few benchmarks, then it has to be something in the WC system - condensation, etc...

bigben2k · 09-18-2002, 07:14 AM

It's a PSU problem. Check the voltages on the +12, +5 and +3.3 as you boot up, using a voltmeter. If any of them fall below 95%, replace the PSU with a more powerful one.

Alternatively, disconnect all the peripherals that you don't absolutely need to start the comp.

AllRoy · 09-18-2002, 07:36 AM

The PSU is a Enermax 651 so I really dont think it is it. It can handle my agp amd 2x pci cards.

bigben2k · 09-18-2002, 07:49 AM

Then it might be a PSU fault. Check the voltages anyways.

JimS · 09-18-2002, 02:05 PM

I'd take a close look at the Abit mobo. I've seen those boards have solder connections melt right off under duress. Abit's QC is not the greatest. Take a close look at the mosfets and then try with a magnifying glass to see any unusual looking solder joints.

jtroutma · 09-18-2002, 03:01 PM

I tend to agree with BigBen's diagnosis. I have the same model Enermax and one died on me. It does sound like a voltage problem. Defiantely check at least the 12V and the 5V lines.

I also have the exact same MB and the only problem I seem to have is that if I power off my system for more than say 4 hours, I cant get it to power back up. the work around I found was that I have to unplug the ATX connector from the MB, wait about 30 seconds, plug it back in and then works great.

<shurg> Again check voltages!

AllRoy · 09-18-2002, 09:53 PM

Ok...PSU voltages are normal....the problem graphics glitch disappered for awhile today but then came back

Everything boots fine now except when you expect the windows pro boot screen...it just stays black....nothing...and the monitor does not go to power down....just stays green like it is getting an input

HelpImNewbish · 09-18-2002, 10:16 PM

If there were odd graphics glitches, its obviously a graphics card problem. I've had many failed attempts at putting on HSnks and such on my graphics cards, and in those attempts i've found that glitches like that are caused mainly by memory problems, either interference in the pins (I got artic silver in them one time...) Or too much/ too little voltage (pencil tricks....). Make sure again everything on your GPU is clocked down, including AGP voltage. You never responded before, so if you havent tried it yet, please, clock everything down. Try booting by holding the space bar after post. This should enable VGA mode and not load your graphics drivers, and therefore not OC it. If that doesnt work, or spacebar is the wrong shortcut, just hit F8 like your going safe mode but hit "Enable VGA Mode" instead. Better yet just do safe mode, maybe there are other problems.

AllRoy · 09-18-2002, 10:26 PM

Actually, I think I might be good now...except for a windows problem

I think something must have happened that corrupted windows during all of this....now I always get to the XP pro login screen (no graphics problem) and it hangs....any ideas before I reformat?

HelpImNewbish · 09-18-2002, 10:41 PM

Maybe HD corruption from OCing.
If you've followed everyones advice and covered all your bases up till now, then I'd just try it. Might try booting off another available hard drive, or booting to a floppy and screwing around in DOS for five minutes or something. Just to test stability a bit more. If it locks up donig those things, you know its not the HD. And make sure you stay clocked back when you install a new OS.

09-16-2002, 11:43 PM	#1
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	Dead??? What did I fry? I am running a AMD 1900+, KG7, and gf4 ti4600 with a chiller and 226W pelt on the cpu. Yesterday I had some hard locks on Neverwinter Nights (game freeze) well after (4-5 of these) I got no boot screen. So my question is, what did I fry? I am guessing the mobo but would like to hear what you say....also when I turn the computer on, even though I get no boot, I see the coldblock temp begin to rise.

09-17-2002, 11:59 AM	#9
decodeddiesel Cooling Savant Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: classified Posts: 534	I agree that you should take the system down and remove everything checking for condensation... Then I would rebiuld and try to boot it with just the essentials (ie. MoBo, CPU, Video, RAM, one HDD). __________________ ...i hurt... do me a favor, disconect me... they can re-work me but i'll never be top of the line again ...i'd rather be nothing...

09-17-2002, 03:15 PM	#10
mkosem Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2001 Location: here Posts: 494	um, I'm hoping that you forgot to mention that there was also neoprene insulating all of the cold parts. There is right? --Matt __________________ If you can't cool it, blow it up!! http://www.mattkosem.com

09-18-2002, 07:14 AM	#17
bigben2k Responsible for 2% of all the posts here. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas, U.S.A. Posts: 8,302	It's a PSU problem. Check the voltages on the +12, +5 and +3.3 as you boot up, using a voltmeter. If any of them fall below 95%, replace the PSU with a more powerful one. Alternatively, disconnect all the peripherals that you don't absolutely need to start the comp. __________________ WBTA (Water Block Testing Alliance) Nordic Hardware WC 101

09-18-2002, 07:49 AM	#19
bigben2k Responsible for 2% of all the posts here. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas, U.S.A. Posts: 8,302	Then it might be a PSU fault. Check the voltages anyways. __________________ WBTA (Water Block Testing Alliance) Nordic Hardware WC 101

09-17-2002, 12:24 AM	#2
Gerwin Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 37	Do you get any post-messages from the mobo/BIOS ?

09-17-2002, 12:42 AM	#3
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	Nothing...no beeb from lack of vid card and just a blank screen....no boot, no bios....nothing!

09-17-2002, 01:06 AM	#4
Gerwin Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Amsterdam Posts: 37	Have you tried resetting the BIOS?

09-17-2002, 01:18 AM	#5
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	Still doesnt work

09-17-2002, 02:56 AM	#6
gmat Thermophile Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: France Posts: 1,221	It's either the PSU or the mobo itself. Did you check for a leak, or moisture due to condensation ? Maybe the insulation around the socket failed... Or the PSU was tired of powering a 226W pelt...

09-17-2002, 06:45 AM	#7
MadDogMe Thermophile Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Just shut up ;) ... Posts: 1,068	I'd agree it's probly soaking around the CPU. If the CPU temp is rising I doubt it's dead, I doubt the mobo's dead, and i doubt the PSU is dead either. strip it down and check for moisture around the CPU back/socket. This happened the other day with a chap with a Swiftech TEC~block, HL's then boot~failure, his was OK after, so keep your fingers crossed! ... Don't keep trying to boot it up, if it aint dead yet ~ you may kill it that way!!. How long has this rig been setup & running?. What kinda Insulation have you got around the CPU?, did you use Di~elactric grease/Vaseline?. What Block are you using?. Retail or homebrew?. What kinda insulation have you got on the tubing?. Have you got the TEC on its own PSU?. Luck Dude!!...

09-17-2002, 11:27 AM	#8
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	How long has this rig been setup & running?. 3 weeks What kinda Insulation have you got around the CPU?, did you use Di~elactric grease/Vaseline?. silicon and dielectric grease withconformal coating on the back What Block are you using?. Retail or homebrew?. homebrew What kinda insulation have you got on the tubing?. foil tape and copper tubing insulation Have you got the TEC on its own PSU? Yep Weird was I cleared the cmos and it worked once

09-17-2002, 04:52 PM	#11
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	Sorry...yep..there sure is....lots of it!

09-17-2002, 06:55 PM	#12
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	Well...I took everything apart (again) to look for condensation....nothing...so I hooked it back up....this time it lasted about 1 min before lockup and no boot screen

09-17-2002, 08:49 PM	#13
HelpImNewbish Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Hickville Posts: 41	Make sure its not overheating. Its possible everything isn't quite clamped down good on the CPU. Try putting your graphics card back to default clocks, too. When that gets too hot it'll lock up, but i've never heard of it refusing to boot for a while afterwards. Give us some more info on your system.

09-17-2002, 09:40 PM	#14
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	KG7 Raid (modded) Athlon 1900+ Teac 24x12x10 CDRW Pioneer 106S DVD 2 x Quantum Atlas III 10K SCSI drives 36.5 GB MegaRaid Elite 1600 Raid Card Gainward Ti4600 golden sample

09-17-2002, 11:30 PM	#15
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	ok...now got to the front win xp screen....ran ok for 1-2 min then my front fan went off and then came back on....next the screen started having some graphics problems...(blocks....etc) and win started stuttering....locking up and off What the heck happened now?

09-18-2002, 01:09 AM	#16
Can O' Beans Cooling Savant Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Pa - USA Posts: 264	I'd clock everything back down to normal speeds and remove the WC gear if possible, set it off to the side. Go with air heatsink, etc... If the PC boots up fine under normal working conditions, and is stable through a few benchmarks, then it has to be something in the WC system - condensation, etc...

09-18-2002, 07:36 AM	#18
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	The PSU is a Enermax 651 so I really dont think it is it. It can handle my agp amd 2x pci cards.

09-18-2002, 02:05 PM	#20
JimS Cooling Savant Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Connecticut Posts: 140	I'd take a close look at the Abit mobo. I've seen those boards have solder connections melt right off under duress. Abit's QC is not the greatest. Take a close look at the mosfets and then try with a magnifying glass to see any unusual looking solder joints.

09-18-2002, 03:01 PM	#21
jtroutma Cooling Savant Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: SLO, CA Posts: 837	I tend to agree with BigBen's diagnosis. I have the same model Enermax and one died on me. It does sound like a voltage problem. Defiantely check at least the 12V and the 5V lines. I also have the exact same MB and the only problem I seem to have is that if I power off my system for more than say 4 hours, I cant get it to power back up. the work around I found was that I have to unplug the ATX connector from the MB, wait about 30 seconds, plug it back in and then works great. <shurg> Again check voltages! __________________ Athlon64 X2 4200+ @ 2.5Ghz (250FSB x 10) OCZ VX 1GB 4000 @ 250FSB (6-2-2-2 timmings) DFI LANParty nForce4 Ultra-D SCSI Raid 5 x (3) Cheetah 15K HDDs LSI Express 500 (128MB cache) OCZ PowerStream 520W PSU ATI X850XT PE (Stock) DTEK WhiteWater + DTEK Custom Radiator Eheim 1250

09-18-2002, 09:53 PM	#22
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	Ok...PSU voltages are normal....the problem graphics glitch disappered for awhile today but then came back Everything boots fine now except when you expect the windows pro boot screen...it just stays black....nothing...and the monitor does not go to power down....just stays green like it is getting an input

09-18-2002, 10:16 PM	#23
HelpImNewbish Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Hickville Posts: 41	If there were odd graphics glitches, its obviously a graphics card problem. I've had many failed attempts at putting on HSnks and such on my graphics cards, and in those attempts i've found that glitches like that are caused mainly by memory problems, either interference in the pins (I got artic silver in them one time...) Or too much/ too little voltage (pencil tricks....). Make sure again everything on your GPU is clocked down, including AGP voltage. You never responded before, so if you havent tried it yet, please, clock everything down. Try booting by holding the space bar after post. This should enable VGA mode and not load your graphics drivers, and therefore not OC it. If that doesnt work, or spacebar is the wrong shortcut, just hit F8 like your going safe mode but hit "Enable VGA Mode" instead. Better yet just do safe mode, maybe there are other problems.

09-18-2002, 10:26 PM	#24
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	Actually, I think I might be good now...except for a windows problem I think something must have happened that corrupted windows during all of this....now I always get to the XP pro login screen (no graphics problem) and it hangs....any ideas before I reformat?

09-18-2002, 10:41 PM	#25
HelpImNewbish Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Hickville Posts: 41	Maybe HD corruption from OCing. If you've followed everyones advice and covered all your bases up till now, then I'd just try it. Might try booting off another available hard drive, or booting to a floppy and screwing around in DOS for five minutes or something. Just to test stability a bit more. If it locks up donig those things, you know its not the HD. And make sure you stay clocked back when you install a new OS.

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