Will this fit?

[unreal]

Hi guys,
Right I've got a storm G5 and AquaXtreme 50Z pump, I was going to buy Black Tygon 3/8 id 5/8 od - firstly will this fit?

I was thinking of combining it with a PA160 in my Lian-Li pc-60.

So any advice? Will it fit?

P.s. Forgive my lack of knowledge, decided to shift up and not use this Zalman Reserator.

[Etacovda]

The G5 and the 50z are natively 1/2, but you can swap the barbs out on the g5, and use adapters on the 50z.

The Pa160 can be fitted with whatever barb you choose, as long as the thread is correct.

So yeah, it can be done - but you'll need adapters for the 50z, and different barbs for the G5 and the PA

[unreal]

Originally Posted by Etacovda

The G5 and the 50z are natively 1/2, but you can swap the barbs out on the g5, and use adapters on the 50z.

The Pa160 can be fitted with whatever barb you choose, as long as the thread is correct.

So yeah, it can be done - but you'll need adapters for the 50z, and different barbs for the G5 and the PA

So possibly better to just buy 1/2" ID Tygon R3603 Tubing, or will the 3/8 have better performance?

[bobkoure]

I'm wondering how 3/8 ID tubing is going to have better performance than 1/2 ID...?
FWIW, I've switched a couple of systems from 3/8 to 1/2 "just to see" - and saw no improvement in temps - this on two systems both optimized for low noise (innovatek hpps pumps, swiftech 5002 or 6000 blocks). YMMV with higher performance systems.

Oh - the 3/8 ID is a lot easier to route in the case (I'm using soft silicone thick-wall tubing to reduce pump vibration transmission - but it's bulky.) So 3/8 is higher performing in the sense that it blocks less airflow through the case - and a lot of "optimizing for low noise" is ensuring that your case have as little air restriction as possible.

[unreal]

Originally Posted by bobkoure

I'm wondering how 3/8 ID tubing is going to have better performance than 1/2 ID...?
FWIW, I've switched a couple of systems from 3/8 to 1/2 "just to see" - and saw no improvement in temps - this on two systems both optimized for low noise (innovatek hpps pumps, swiftech 5002 or 6000 blocks). YMMV with higher performance systems.

Oh - the 3/8 ID is a lot easier to route in the case (I'm using soft silicone thick-wall tubing to reduce pump vibration transmission - but it's bulky.) So 3/8 is higher performing in the sense that it blocks less airflow through the case - and a lot of "optimizing for low noise" is ensuring that your case have as little air restriction as possible.

Thats good to know.

So I was going to purchase from one of these 2 UK stores:
here
and here.

So with my storm block, what do I need to make it compatible with 3/8? Also for the Thermochill PA160, what would I need then?

The links go to the barb pages so if you could tell me please

[bobkoure]

3/8 will typically fit right over barbs for 1/2 tubing (or least that's the case for silicone tubing which is what I use).
If you're optimizing for low noise I'm not sure the storm is the right block - not that it will hurt if you already have one - but something like a Swiftech 6000 will actually perform just fine with a low power (and so low noise) pump. Look at the low flow end of the block performance curves...

[unreal]

Originally Posted by bobkoure

3/8 will typically fit right over barbs for 1/2 tubing (or least that's the case for silicone tubing which is what I use).
If you're optimizing for low noise I'm not sure the storm is the right block - not that it will hurt if you already have one - but something like a Swiftech 6000 will actually perform just fine with a low power (and so low noise) pump. Look at the low flow end of the block performance curves...

I had an AquaXtreme 50Z pump in the pipe line, which isnt precisely too low power/noise is it.

Reason I ask of 3/8 is because I can get it at like a third of price of 1/2 or 7/16... So its going to save me loads so I thought might be not too much of a compromise.

[zoson]

http://www.columbia.edu/~ahm89/Pictures/guts-s.jpg
You can cram an awful lot into a PC60.
Since the picture I ripped out the HD rails and fixed that nasty 180' bend going to the pump. I am also now using a Hydor L30 instead of the ViaAqua 1300. Both are excellent pumps, but I owned two VA's, and both started having the clicking noise problem.
I use Tygon 1/2" ID 5/8" OD tubing. You can see that I've got some pretty extreme bends in there, but I have never had a kinking problem.
Edit: to my knowledge, it's the general consensus here on procooling that 1/2" id tubing provides better performance.

[bobkoure]

Originally Posted by zoson

that 1/2" id tubing provides better performance.

I think you'd find that the current consensus is that "it depends on what you're doing". Not that 3/8 would ever outperform 1/2 but that it often makes no difference and there's an advantage with 3/8 in ease of routing and potentially in reducing case air restriction.
There had been a consensus on 1/2", but that was some while back (one of the reasons I tried swapping a couple of systems over from 3/8 to 1/2).

I'm not sure I'd pick 3/8 over 1/2 for cost reasons, though. How much tubing do you need for connecting pump rad block(s) and (optional) res? Two meters? Less?

[pauldenton]

Originally Posted by unreal

I was going to buy Black Tygon 3/8 id 5/8 od

hmm - most people using 3/8ID seem to use thinner walls than that - so i imagine you'd be forgoing some of the ease of routing etc ...

one of your 2 chosen stores has 7/16ID 5/8OD pretty cheap...
http://store.over-clock.com/Tubing.html

[unreal]

Cool just 1.07/foot.

So is that stuff good, I presume so Marci seems to recommend it on forums because its ok with UV unlike tygon.

So better to get 1.07/foot stuff then?

Suppose price same as I would get tygon, and no need to convert (aka buy new barbs) for everything.

[Long Haired Git]

My approximator shows that the tubing makes bugger all impact to the flow rate once modern (restrictive) blocks are in use and assuming an internally housed system (ie, 2m of tubing or less).

Eg, take a Swiftech kit:
MCP655 @ 5
Storm block
MCR220QP

With 1.5m of 1/2" tubing I get 6.0386 LPM.
With 3m of 1/2" tubing I get 5.9388 LPM
With 12m of 1/2" tubing I get 5.4219 LPM

(note: figures are not accurate anywhere near 4 decimal places, not even to a single decimal place, but shown as comparable to figures further down)

Switch to the smaller tubing, but do NOT change the barbs:

With 1.5m of 3/8" tubing I get 5.767 LPM.
With 3m of 3/8" tubing I get 5.4484 LPM
With 12m of 3/8" tubing I get 4.2184 LPM

To put this into temps, CPU temp I get is from 17.6°C above ambient as worst case with 12m of 3/8" tubing down to 17.0°C above ambient with 1.5m of 1/2" tubing.

Now, barbs are a different story. You can use 7/16" tubing over 1/2" barbs and I am told the flow rate is basically unchanged as you get extra restriction from the smaller bore but you get a nicer entry into the barb as the "tightness" of the tubing over the barb means the diameter change at the barb is less severe.

I didn't know you could get 3/8" tubing over a 1/2" brass barb: pictures anyone?

Lastly, changing the barbs does have an impact. Check out the graph at BillA's "thermal management testing" site in the HE heater core comparison article. He changes the barb size and the smaller barbs do have an impact.

That's the code I am working on now with the approximator: getting it so that when you choose 3/8" tubing it changes the barbs on the Storm and includes the extra restrictiveness in the head calcs.

[bobkoure]

Originally Posted by Long Haired Git

I didn't know you could get 3/8" tubing over a 1/2" brass barb: pictures anyone?

I can't speak to brass barbs as I don't use 'em, but I've had no problems pushing 3/8 ID soft silicone tubing over both the inlet/outlet to montego heater cores (which appear to be 1/2 ID brass tubing so slightly over 1/2 OD) and over eldon james single barb nylon fittings. I don't have any pictures around - guess I could just fetch a fitting and piece of tubing from the basement, push the tubing on and snap a photo. Not sure what that would prove, though...

[Marci]

Get barbs here - select 3/8" or 1/2" from drop down box... http://www.thermochill.com/acatalog/...cessories.html (scroll down page, you'll spot em) - tubing also on same page, all sizes and types (inc 7/16)

Get rad here - http://www.thermochill.com/acatalog/pa_series.html

3/8" ID Tygon and 7/16" Masterkleer share the same 5/8" OD, so neither is better than the other for routing / air restriction. I *had* a photo comparing all popular sizes side by side, but can't find it now. The 7/16 is however much cheaper than the Tygon...

Personal recommendation - PA160, 3/8" BSPT thread to 1/2" Barbs (x2), 7/16" Masterkleer hose.

Marci seems to recommend it on forums because its ok with UV unlike tygon

S'not why i recommend it tho, tis just an added bonus... if wanting to use UV dyes, always best to avoid Tygon and other tubing with UV Filters... or it dulls the effect... which usually results in the end-user dumping MORE dye in to achieve the effect. 3 months later they're in complaining about their stained tubing etc.

[unreal]

Thanks for the posts guys, there really appreciated. Cant wait!

Marci what I meant was, I found a guy selling Black Tygon 3/8 id 5/8 od at £1/foot so actually cheaper than the masterkleer.
I will not be using any dyes as im not into the flash stuff, its going in a windowless case.

Difference is, if I go with tygon I would need smaller barbs for the storm block correct? (or super stretch it). Also I guess I would have to convert the 50Z pump and possibly whatever GPU block I decide (EK blocks looking promising though )

P.s. Thanks Long Haired Git for those facts... sadly it makes it even harder to choose

Also Marci, it states

3/8" BSP Nickel-plated Barbs 3/8" BSP Threaded Nickel Plated Brass HoseBarb suitable for use with all ThermoChill products."

- the 's' indicates plural correct, as in 2 barbs supplied?

Oh I was gonna get some of the bits from EP, suppose thermochill prices same but - "Thermochill PA160 Wings (with anti-vibration mounts)" is the same as the "MK160 (aka PA160 Wings Kit) Include M3 Antivibration Mounting Studs" that Thermochill sell correct? i.e. both include M3 antivibe mounts as shown in your Lian-li pa160 install?

Marci i'm going to be copying you completely TBH, although in your guide I dont actually see where the wings kit is used? I see the vibe mounts but not the actual wings...

Its either:
Storm G5 1/2"
AquaXtreme 50Z 1/2"
PA160 1/2"
Masterkleer 7/16 ID 5/8 OD.

or
Storm G5 with new 3/8" barbs
AquaXtreme 50Z converted to 3/8" (how?)
PA160 with 3/8" instead of 1/2"
Black Tygon 3/8 ID 5/8 OD.

So sorry about the long post.

From what I understand you guys have posted:
1) outer size identical so neither easier to route
2) Masterkleer has larger internal diameter so should have (slightly) higher flow rates.
3) I would need to convert both block + pump to use 3/8" where 1/2" I would not.

I think at the moment I would favour 7/16" because I suppose being able to see the loop and possibly see airbubbles/buildup could be useful (although not being able to see through the black might be good as buildup of stuff looks nasty from what pictures i've seen about.)
Also it seems silly to spend loads of cash and not get 100% out of loop.

Main favouring point is that 1/2" gives me versitility, could get Maze 4 GPU block and in future easier to swap components. Also saves me converting the block + pump which adds cost I suppose but nothing in return.

Suppose black would look kickass with this Ultra-D and black PC-60 though
Anyways sorry for the long post, I hope i've got everything right that you guys have picked.

So Marci, given price approximately the same, would you still favour masterkleer?

[unreal]

Another 100 views and no comments

Probably take 1/2" just for ease of future compatibility

[pauldenton]

Originally Posted by unreal

Another 100 views and no comments

Probably take 1/2" just for ease of future compatibility

if the aesthetic considerations are irrelevant (leaving black tubing neither a deal maker nor a deal breaker) i would say the 7/16" is definitely the way to go.....

is the black tygon the stuff in this build? - if so then it appears that it's stiffer (and hence harder to route) than regular tygon....
http://forums.bit-tech.net/showpost....&postcount=749

it does look good though

afaik you just have to stretch the 3/8 over the 50z's barbs (of course if it is extra-stiff this may not be as easy a job as with regular tubing...) so another possible arguement for the masterclear...

[unreal]

Well my storm + 50Z arrive tomorrow

Going to go with:
Storm G5 1/2"
AquaXtreme 50Z 1/2"
PA160 1/2"
Masterkleer 7/16 ID 5/8 OD.

So just need to add zerex + hose clips + PA160 mounting kit (with antivibe mounts)

P.s. Can anyone else see where Marci uses the wings in the mounting kit in his Lian-li pc-6x guide?

[Marci]

Vibe mounts are screwed into the wings... it ain't rocket science. ON sides of rad are screw holes. On side of wings kit are screw holes.

IE: Wings screw straight onto the opposing face shroud points - the only place they CAN go.

Upto EP-UK asto whether they include M3 mounts or not. They're available with and without em from ThermoChill/O-CuK... tis the customers choice.

I will ALWAYS favor Masterkleer.

Also Marci, it states

WHAT states... ThermoChill... O-CuK??
Quantity is always 1 unless explicitly stated otherwise. Assuming u mean ThermoChill link, Quantity box says 1 by default, so u get 1 by default unless u ask for more than one. Description says HoseBarb singular.

if I go with tygon I would need smaller barbs for the storm block correct?

Storm comes with both 3/8 and 1/2 barbs in the box.

Main favouring point is that 1/2" gives me versitility, could get Maze 4 GPU block and in future easier to swap components.

All DangerDen products are available with 3/8 fittings anyways, and to convert em u just replace current fittings with 1/4" BSP to whatever size hosebarb. More or less all other blocks out there have changeable fittings to allow u to run whatever hosesize u want...

You're WAAAYYY overcomplicating things d00d...

[unreal]

Originally Posted by Marci

You're WAAAYYY overcomplicating things d00d...

Probably, . First time and dont wanna mess anything up! Better ask now than learn later.

P.s. I didnt know about the wings kit bit, because i've never seen a clear picture of one mounted, the order in which it mounts etc... Mainly because i've never held a PA160 and your picture of it fitted has the gasket neoprene stuff covering it.

Anyways do you happen to know if Thermochill's PA160's are actually in stock as no other site on the web actually has stock, but thermochill's site doesnt actually say.

Oh and regarding the barbs "3/8" BSP Nickel-plated Barbs" - s is a plural which had confused me, thanks for clearing it up.

Well my G5 arrived today, I knew the base and top a lil damaged (well like theres a mark where whatever chip was under it was, and the hold-down has some scratches.) Base from an angle looks completely flat so not to worried - and Cathar's site does say dont lap so I think I will try without for now.

As for the holddown, anything I can use to buff marks out and polish it to restore it to its previous glory?

[Marci]

Brasso or Silvo to buff up the hold down... but don't touch the block with it...

PA160 is in stock... at both ThermoChill and O-CuK... others should have restocks shortly - DD's order is going thru production at the moment...