Videocard / pump conflict? Screen 'gittering'

[JakeX]

I setup my watercooling, and I have a VIA 1300 pump in my 1/2" WC system, cpu, gpu, and nb are cooled.

Upon turning on my machine for the first time I noticed that my screen is a little 'gittery' it seems to vibrate back and forth, at first I thought maybe its the cable and that I have it not in all the way, but I checked it out and everything is plugged in correctly and so I don't know what it could be.

2nd, I attached a DD Maze3 block to my ATI9700pro, and I lightly scratched the plastic around the core (after scraping 'gently' at the crud that came with the stock heatsink). Now I doubt this light scrape of the plastic around the core (didn't hit anything) could have done this..

So it leads me to believe that since my pump is about 5-7" away from the card that it could be interfering somehow. I don't know what it could be, my buddy says maybe its due to the fact that the pump has 3 prongs and not 2 and it isn't grounding correctly. Any info on this guys? anything like this happen to you?

The gittering is very slight, but noticable when you look close to the monitor.

Maybe I can insulate the pump somehow?

[iroc409]

my 9700p runs minus one resistor on the core, so you probably didn't do any damage.

is there anything nearby the monitor that could cause some distortion? does your monitor cable have at least one ferrite bead in it?

it could still be the pump tho, although i would think that emp would screw with your hard drives before it would the video...

[killernoodle]

You dont have to worry about the HDDs being damaged by EMI, but the monitor may be a problem. Move the comp away from the monitor about a foot and try again. I know that if I get too close with the pump my monitor starts jiggling unless I run it at 60hz for some reason, but that hurts my eyes. I just put it on the floor and it is fine.

[JakeX]

hmm so the EMI in the pump causes my monitor to do this? I have the pump away from the monitor a good 3-4 feet..

[JakeX]

oh ya.. pump is in my case.. case is under desk.. monitor on top of desk :P so its got clearance... I've never had this.. and ya I doubt its my 9700pro cause i fainly scratched the surface.. and I don't think i cut through anything..

[JSimmons]

If your pump's power cable is touching (or running parallel with) your monitor cable, try moveing the pawer cable a different path under the desk.

[AntiBling]

Try unplugging the pump just for a few seconds while its running and see if the screen clears up. That way you can be sure its the pump and not something else that is causing your problems.

[JakeX]

Uggh its the pump when I lower the refresh rate of my monitor from 75mhz to 60mhz its perfect.. no jittering no nothing

How can I eliminate this and still do 75mhz refresh rate? I will go nuts @ 60mhz.. I didn't switch to WC to get this crap *sniff*

Any way I can insulate the pump? lol.. anybody have the same problem?

[AntiBling]

Assuming you tried what I said and it goes away when you unplug the pump...

Try these simple things first. Move it a little farther away from your monitor if possible, to see if its a proximity issue. Could be its still not far enough away.

Try orienting the pump at a different angle. Rotate the pump 90 degrees within the case, or rotate the whole case.

Try powering the pump from a different source than the PC or monitor.

Post back what you found!

[feathers]

The pump generates a strong EMF field (so does any mains waterpump). You could screen the pump by wrapping some copper sheets around it and grounding them. This should reduce the EMF. It's actually not a good idea to have a pump which generates such a strong emf placed inside a computer. It may be standard practice for many users but it's actually pretty dumb. I use an Eheim 1048 and that generates a similar field. It will adversely affect the picture on a monitor and so if the pump isn't screened then it should be situated away from the monitor (and the computer).

[guandi]

If the pump really was causing EMI a sheet of aluminium foil around the pump and touched to the case would be sufficient, but i highly doubt that is the cause.

Just to rule stuff out, try this....

get a long mains exstension lead and plug your monitor into it from another part of the house. if that stops it, your wiring in that part of the house is on the fritz. i got my dad to rewire my whole room just so my computers would stop crashing randomly due to power fluctuations (before PFC Supplies), otherwise i had to have everything plugged into a socket 2 floors below.

Do the same with the pump if mains powered, or use a seperate PSU to power it if 12v. (plug it all in, then use a peice of wire to short out the green and a black wire on the ATX Molex) that will rule out any power fluctuations in the PC itself.

I have had a Eheim 1060 sat in a computer, right next to a monitor with no problems before, but i have also had the same setup turn a monitor into a kaleidoscope. no two setups are identical

[feathers]

A mains pump such as an Eheim does generate an EMF. Simple as that. I don't know if some pumps come with built-in shielding but the 1048 doesn't! It generates a very strong field!

Perhaps your computer helps to shield your 1060 from the monitor?

Or perhaps the 1060 doesn't generate such a strong field?

[guandi]

Go get a 1060. dont plug it in, just take the front of the impellar housing off and hold it next to a monitor. turn the impellar with your finger. now go buy a new monitor.

All motor driven pumps will generate a EMF, becouse the use magnets. how well they are sheilded and how powerfull they are does make a difference, but i cant be assed to finssh wthis sentance i am going to bed.

[AntiBling]

Originally Posted by guandi

Go get a 1060. dont plug it in, just take the front of the impellar housing off and hold it next to a monitor. turn the impellar with your finger. now go buy a new monitor.

All motor driven pumps will generate a EMF, becouse the use magnets. how well they are sheilded and how powerfull they are does make a difference, but i cant be assed to finssh wthis sentance i am going to bed.

Buy a new monitor? Ever heard of a degauss coil? Stick to what you know.

[AntiBling]

And while Im at it,
If the actual PC case ( made of aluminum or steel ) wont stop EMF, hows a wrap of tin foil going to make any difference? My mag 3 gave my monitor the wobblies if I put the PC case within two feet of it, with the pump inside. The case is steel and quite heavy, and grounded too. Perhaps it attenuated some of the field, but not nearly enough. The copper sheeting idea sounded more like a real solution. There are some EMF shielding wraps you can buy on the web, but they are damn costly, more than the cost of a different pump.

[guandi]

Now i am awake, yes. i do know what a degauss coil is, and i do know that when a monitor has been damaged by a magnet 9 times out of 10 its buggered.

Have you ever seen real EMF Sheilding? i have about 60ft of it at work that we used to wrap the portakabin/office in at work when we had a mobile medical scanner powered on in the workshop for replacing and testing the Electron tubes. otherwise we have to turn off the power, none of the phones work, and our secretaries laptop wont even power on. its a thin metal sheet with a honeycomb pattern cut into it. the whole roll of 60ft can be lifted by two people quite easily. this sheilding protected against several of these baby's...

Thomson Tubes Electroniques Electron X-Ray Tube out of a Lithotripter....

(sorry 56kers)


sorry about the mess in the background, just a 1060, 1250, DD Double heatercore, DD RBX, Demonic XTC and a D-Tek Whitewater (decided to fall off the back of the table without me noticing, but trust me, its there ) for size comparison.

I Do know about the effects of EMFs and how EMI can affect electronics by altering the current, voltage, and even direction of flow through a circuit. It can even give you headaches as it affects the electronic signals in your brain. i work around this stuff. so you stick to what you know, and i will do likewise. never assume someone doesnt know what they are talking about

[AntiBling]

I dont believe a monitor can be damaged with a magnet. Ive never heard of such a thing before now. I have a degree in electronics and I did bench repairs on computer monitors for 3 years before moving on to my current job repairing semiconductor mfg equipment. Tell me how it can be done... This is a new one for me!

[AntiBling]

Just to pre-empt the obvious, you could strike the monitor with it or smash the screen, thats one way LOL but IM talking about with EMF. Never seen a gaussed up screen a coil couldnt clean.

[guandi]

A CRT Is much the same no-matter what its used for, monitor, tv, whatever. ever held a magnet to a TV? goes all funky colours, and usually ends up with purple blotches. you can the the same to a monitor, and altho the degauss can fix it, if you put anything larger than a powerfull fridge magnet near it, dont expect the screen to ever be the same again. you will never get rid of the purple blotches.

i'm not sure exactly what it does to the insides, but i know that if it affects the flow of the electron beams to the screen/mask if they are concentrated into a small enough spot they might be able to burn the phosphor, either that or the magnet can burn out the cathode filament, or mis-align the anode. one way or another, i have one crap sony i just tested it on sat behind me, and several others that have long since been resigned to the crusher at work (crts make a lovely pop), that have all been fscked by magnetic feilds in one form or another.

I used to repair monitors for freinds and my college, but i got a bit too cocky and needed to have my heart jump started and physio to get back the feeling in my right arm for a week after i got electrocuted by some godamn unsafe taiwanese crap pile that hit me with god knows how much even after i dishcharged the caps

[AntiBling]

What I meant was the magnetic fields most people are familiar with like in the water pump in your example, or speaker magnets, or starting up a motor next to a monitor, something like that. A hand held deguass coil will absolutely clean that up if the internal one wont do it. Fear not, your monitor is not destroyed. Just take it to a shop and give them 10 bucks to degauss it while you wait.

The magnetic fields you are describing where you work are obviously much greater in strength than the average household PC user is likely to come in contact with. I have zero experience with super strong magnetic fields you are describing... If you say they can trash a CRT, I believe you.

PS Glad you didnt get killed!