Inexpensive CNC Mill Desktop *Opinions Plz*

[ToddTheFrog]

I was searching the web the other day and came across this little computer controlled CNC Desktop Machine. Do you guys think this will get the job done for possibly making small batch runs of custom cpu / gpu / nb / harddrive waterblocks?

It is only around $3,000 to $3,500.


Link:

http://www.microkinetics.com/cncmill.htm

[jaydee]

That's pretty much what I have. No, don't buy it for copper milling. Especially for production on any scale. Wouldn't even recommend it for prototype work.I got mine here: www.acumotion.com

[firtol88]

Originally Posted by jaydee116

That's pretty much what I have. No, don't buy it for copper milling. Especially for production on any scale. Wouldn't even recommend it for prototype work.I got mine here: www.acumotion.com

OMG I think I would have run off as soon as I heard the music, never would have given them money. LMAOROF

* edit it still hurts, oh the pain You bastard you did that on purpose didn't you!!!

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by firtol88

OMG I think I would have run off as soon as I heard the music, never would have given them money. LMAOROF

* edit it still hurts, oh the pain You bastard you did that on purpose didn't you!!!

LOL, I bought it about 3 years ago and the music wasn't there. In fact it was a totaly different website than the new one. I actually like the mill but it just isn't up to a lot of copper use. In fact they recommend shutting it down after 30minutes because the motor is not self cooled. It does however work well for #rotor style blocks. It doesn't have any problems drilling copper and the CNC conversion makes it very precise. Don't regret buying, but if I knew then what I know now I would have opted for a better one. I have done some nice copper blocks on it non the less. Just takes hours to do one block.

[ToddTheFrog]

Do you think upgrading to the 268 oz motors on acumotion.com would make it worth it for machining copper?

Todd

[JFettig]

its the whole machine, not just the motors. you almost need something that is made of cast iron to machine anything more than aluminum.

I built a custom cnc for about that much, it will machine a lot of good stuff and hold up. was a $500 mill to start with and I put a couple more thousand into it to make it cnc. a seige x2(mini mill, homier, harborfreight, grizzly all have it) but in order to do that it takes quite a bit of knowledge and experience. I would have actually wished I would have gotten a bigger one now.


It is quite difficult to find a cnc mill thats not incredebly tiny nor incredebly big and expencive. theres almost no happy medium thats not custom made.


Firstly, do you know anything about machining, cad, cam, or cnc? G-codes M-codes anythig like that? If not, I wouldnt suggest taking the step your thinking about just yet.

a good place to learn a bunch of stuff is cnczone.com and read up wherever else you can.


Jon

[ToddTheFrog]

I am a CAD engineer. Never CNC machined anything but anytime is always a good time to start :-)

Todd

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by ToddTheFrog

Do you think upgrading to the 268 oz motors on acumotion.com would make it worth it for machining copper?

Todd

No. The problem is the construction of the mill itself. The MaxNC15 is a much better option for a cheap desktop mill. http://www.maxnc.com/ fixittt used to make batch's of the D-TEK Spiral on one before he gave up.

Still if you plan on anything resembling production save up and get a better mill. This one http://www.flashcutcnc.com/html/mach_9000.html would be the minimal one I would get for even small batch's of copper blocks. I just about bought one a month ago but I didn't like the limited spindle speed of 3000RPM max. I would prefer a spindal speed of 10,000 at least for the smaller end mills. makes thing go ALOT faster.

[ToddTheFrog]

Originally Posted by jaydee116

No. The problem is the construction of the mill itself. The MaxNC15 is a much better option for a cheap desktop mill. http://www.maxnc.com/ fixittt used to make batch's of the D-TEK Spiral on one before he gave up.

Do you think this can handle copper for an enthusiast? If so how long do you think it would take to make an average waterblock?

Todd

[murray13]

Too bad this one isn't in the states.

I've seen one of those in action. It would make a great setup.

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by ToddTheFrog

Do you think this can handle copper for an enthusiast? If so how long do you think it would take to make an average waterblock?

Todd

The MaxNC 15? Sure. Fixittt used to make dozens of what now is the D-TEK Spiral. He also made all kinds of other blocks with it. I am not sure how long it would take, depends on the design. Faster than the Sherline as it is much stouter.

[Tempus]

Originally Posted by jaydee116

No. The problem is the construction of the mill itself. The MaxNC15 is a much better option for a cheap desktop mill. http://www.maxnc.com/ fixittt used to make batch's of the D-TEK Spiral on one before he gave up.

Still if you plan on anything resembling production save up and get a better mill. This one http://www.flashcutcnc.com/html/mach_9000.html would be the minimal one I would get for even small batch's of copper blocks. I just about bought one a month ago but I didn't like the limited spindle speed of 3000RPM max. I would prefer a spindal speed of 10,000 at least for the smaller end mills. makes thing go ALOT faster.

Just curious what you think the realistic "hobbist" capacity of this mill is. Could you get enough prototyping output (and repeatability and accuracy) to actually enjoy using it?

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by Tempus

Just curious what you think the realistic "hobbist" capacity of this mill is. Could you get enough prototyping output (and repeatability and accuracy) to actually enjoy using it?

Tough question. It really depends on the user. I can pretty much do what I want with my little Sherline but it takes patients. My Project X block is an example of what can be done if you don't mind spending several hours just on the base. I would expect the MaxNC 15 to cut some time off and that big flashcut mill should do it in about an hour (rough guess).

Milling process.


Milling the outer channel.


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Drilled the cups.


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Milled the inner channels connecting the cups.


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Milling O-ring Groove.

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Milling the jet/inlet, outlets ,screw holes and mounting holes in the top peice.


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Drilling the screw holes and mounting holes.

[Tempus]

Thats cool looking man. Makes me even more determined to get one once I get my garage rebuilt. =)

[SysCrusher]

Question. How are you doing curves? Rotary table?

[Incoherent]

Originally Posted by SysCrusher

Question. How are you doing curves? Rotary table?

A good question. They are beatiful. I guess it's thanks to the CNC mod. Jaydee?

I have a Sherline as well. I agree with Jaydee that it's capabilities are limited - primarily due to the time factor. It is slow work.
If I was to buy a another mill it would be a heavier one but I have not seen one in my price range that could match the little Sherlines accurate feel and precision. Of course it is mostly about ones skill level (mine is low or non-existant) but I haven't seen a larger (cheap) mill with a more repeatable, small back-lash or smooth movement of the XY table for example. (Not speaking from a very wide base of experience mind you)
My major gripe is the z-axis. It is not very stable, doesn't allow me better than 0.05mm accuracy, compared with the XY axis where I can maintain better than 0.02mm.
Overall though, I think my opinion of the tool matches Jaydee's. I'd recommend a heavier duty one for the amount of material you need to cut for waterblocks.
It's great for fine work though, and I do like it. A rotary table makes all the difference as well.

[JFettig]

oh man, what he is doing is nothing compared to what its capable of, It could do a profile of your face 3d and all. no rotary tables needed. with rotary tables you can machine some really crazy stuff too, all the way around parts, on 4 sides or whatever, really cool stuff. and with 2 rotary tables now thats some insane stuff, thats where you get to the 5 axis machines. maybe someday I did see a 5 axis taig.............


yeah, what he did with that thing is some very basic cnc opperations, G1 linear interpolation, G2/3 would make the curves I bet that thing only uses those codes and G0(Rapids) lets just say theres Gs up over 100


Heres some cnc stuff of mine:
http://jfettig.wc101.com/cnc/


Jon

[ToddTheFrog]

Originally Posted by jaydee116

No. The problem is the construction of the mill itself. The MaxNC15 is a much better option for a cheap desktop mill. http://www.maxnc.com/ fixittt used to make batch's of the D-TEK Spiral on one before he gave up.

Still if you plan on anything resembling production save up and get a better mill. This one http://www.flashcutcnc.com/html/mach_9000.html would be the minimal one I would get for even small batch's of copper blocks. I just about bought one a month ago but I didn't like the limited spindle speed of 3000RPM max. I would prefer a spindal speed of 10,000 at least for the smaller end mills. makes thing go ALOT faster.

That maxnc.com 15 has 10,000 rpm w/ a 1/5 hp drill .... that sounds like a very good one, but its hard to believe it has 10,000 rpm's. Did yours have that high of spindle speed?

Todd

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by SysCrusher

Question. How are you doing curves? Rotary table?

It is a 3 axis CNC mill (X,Y,Z).

That maxnc.com 15 has 10,000 rpm w/ a 1/5 hp drill .... that sounds like a very good one, but its hard to believe it has 10,000 rpm's. Did yours have that high of spindle speed?

Todd

Mine does have a 10,000RPM spindle but I need the $75 pully set to get that speed. Stock it is 0-2,800 variable with the turn of a knob. What I don't like about the MaxNC is it doesn't have hand wheels.

[JFettig]

the one thing I do not like about those machines is the HP, mine has 4 times more hp and Im still not satisfied with it. Im looking for a new motor.


I tried running mine at 7000rpm and it didnt have the torque to do much.

Jon

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by JFettig

the one thing I do not like about those machines is the HP, mine has 4 times more hp and Im still not satisfied with it. Im looking for a new motor.


I tried running mine at 7000rpm and it didnt have the torque to do much.

Jon

Mine has plenty of tourque at 2,800 RPM as it broke a 3/8" carbide tin coated endmill once when I pushed it to hard. But I agree, at 10,000RPM on the same motor it will be gutless. That's the main reason I havn't bought the pully set yet.

[Tempus]

From the research i've been doing, I'd pretty much need to drop $2000 ish to get into a light cnc mill to do some prototyping. Does that sound about right?


I'm really looking at VC cooling. Is there a machine that might be better for that (talking "whole card" gpu/vram cooling - both sides. So pretty large items relative to a cpu block.)

Advice on a good starter system? software? bits?

[JFettig]

have you considered tools and stuff for it? end mills, holders vices and whatever else? add at least $500 for that.



Jon

[Tempus]

Yeah, I was figuring on this mill for $1300 and $700 more for end mills, a cooling system, and some lite cnc dos software.

[SysCrusher]

Originally Posted by jaydee116

It is a 3 axis CNC mill (X,Y,Z).

So the table actually moves x,y,z? Not the chuck doing z, right? Pardon my newbness with the stuff but I'm learning as I go here. I have a cheap one where the table only does x,y and thinking about if it's worth my hard earned cash to get a new table or just get a rotary table to go with it.