Pump Survey

[icel0rd]

Ok gang, I just was curious about the type of pumps you all are using. I was thinking of going with a danner that you can get from petsmart, which is fully submersible.

http://www.petsmart.com/products/product_770.shtml

I would still need to get a reservoir though. I just need to conserve space in my system and I need to make sure that everything fits, and looks good in my black mid tower. I'm a fashion whore, so it has to look good.

Oh, and I was hoping to get some feedback on what is REALLY necessary and what is not going to cut it from that list off of that link.

The caption reads the following:


Supreme Mag Drive Pumps by Danner
Energy efficient - pays for itself in savings. Safe for fresh, saltwater or pond use. Uses half the power of conventional pumps. Only one moving part means there aren't any seals to wear out. Models 1 and 1.5 are fully submersible, but are not designed for in line use. Models 2, 3, 5, 7 and 12 are fully submersible and do have in line capability. Approved for indoor or outdoor use.

Why would you submerge an inline pump?? Just an appealing option for areas where you would not otherwise have a choice or added flexibility? Is it necessary to submerge it so that it can draw water to pump from your reservoir? I gather that you can either get one that MUST be used submerged and the other one is optional.

I was thinking Supreme Mag Drive Pump Model 2 - 250 gph for $35.89.

[DigitalChaos]

rio 1100 (420gph at 0') modified into an inline... it performs GREAT and is SILENT... but if it gets too much back pressure, usually from flatened lines, it tends to make a little noise.
you can get the rio for ~ $20 at graystonecreations... then spend a few bucks on brass fittings if you want it inline


but i just bought a ehiem 1250 for the shielding and known reliability in my new project

[Brad]

most people like Eheims (but hate the price) or Danners. Typically very few people like Rio's

[Triton]

Eheim 1250. I just read to many good things about the Eheims. You don't want to sacrifice on your components if you can afford it.

[WebMasta33]

I have a danner 3. I haven't used it on a watercooling rig yet, but it shoots a column of water around 2 feet into the air when the tip of the outlet is about 5" underwater.

If you guys want, I'll post a pic of it.

[melvyn]

I've got Danner Magdrive model 2 pumps in my systems. Both needed the pump chamber sealing with silicone sealant to stop water and air leaks, but the first one I bought has been running 24/7 uninterrupted for ten months, with no leaks or noise. The second one has yet to run in anger, but I expect the same level of performance from that one.

[Brad]

yeah, danners are known for leaking, yet once they are siliconed up, no one has a problem with them

[beav]

my danner is pretty reliable without any sealing but then again i don't have much pressure buildup in my system. I also have a Hydrothruster

[gmat]

Eheim - if you can afford it.
Hydor - run hotter than Eheims but are lighter on your wallet. And they are just as reliable. I just don't know if you can find them outside Europe...

[decodeddiesel]

You really don't want to get cheap on what is to be the heart of your cooling system!! I have used a Danner Model 5 (leaks, and has bad EMI but is a solid pump), RIO 1100 (ugh what a total POS), a OCWC pump (small weak loud), and finally an Eheim 1250. The only pump I can recomend is the Eheim. It is deffiniatly worth the extra money (I had to eat Hot Pockets and Ramen for a week so I could afford it!!) and is a gem of German engineering. I am totally in love with my Eheim.

[DigitalChaos]

i have been running the rio for months now.. i have even been abusing the hell out of it by turning it on and off about 3 times a day...

still runs silent on my series loop of: maze2, becooling video AND chipset cooler, and BlackIce Extreme.

im bettin that the rio1100 will perform damn near the Eheim 1250 that should be here soon..

and for $20 you cant complain about that

if your worried about reliability... take your extra $ and get a DigitalDoc... put a sensor on your cpu... and a relay hooked inline with your PowerGood signal on your PSU... if your pump dies... the block will heat up in about a min or 2...(i tried it) (not real fast cause there is still water in the block.. and the copper to absorb heat..) but anyway... the heat will trigger the circuit on the DigitalDoc... and the DigitalDoc will trip the relay... and kill power to your box.. no harm done

honestly i would feel safer with that setup than with just an eheim and NO DigitalDoc

[decodeddiesel]

Reliability of RIO pumps: http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...&threadid=1505

Nothing personal, but it is very foolish to believe a RIO even holds a candle to an Eheim. I had that pump die with NO WARNING after being used for barely 30 days. You get what you pay for in a pump and the RIO is cheaply made, poorly designed garbage. First of all these pumps are NOT designed to be run inline, as stated right on the pump. They are submersible only and it really shows in the design. The fittings are compression based (ie no threads at all) and will leak like a sive unless you take major steps to seal them up. The pump is designed to be cooled by the water in the reservoir, it runs hot and loud inline. Every RIO I have seen will rattle unless you superglue the impeller down to the drive magnet...oh and forget about low EMI, these things are horrible with EMI. Worst quality of all is the reliability, or lack there of it PLEASE don't leave this thing alone with your system. I made the mistake and paid for it. I am glad you are happy with your RIO, but after what happened with mine I feel it necessary to share my experiences. Let me tell you, the smell of charred silicone is about as bad as the smell of charred flesh, and nothing is to blame with what happened other than that RIO. Honestly I was stoked about only paying $25 for mine upfront, but then replacing the $500 in parts it destroyed kinda defrayed that cost saving.

[DigitalChaos]

gotta take percautions =) the DD5 is a good one for any system regardless of the pump... and yes the rios have some emi on monitors...

but also the bigger rios like the 1100 do have threaded seals... its kinda hard unless i take some pics...
but also the bigger ones are real easy to make inline.. they even have a rubber gasket around the only seam

[Brad]

I know that decoded hates rios because of personal failure, and they do have a higher failure rate than other pumps, but there is a huge price differance, and that is why there will always be people buying rio's because of the huge price differance

[icel0rd]

Ok, thanks for the advice gang. Can someone enlighten me on inline submerged pumps, vs outside of the water inline pumps? You guys have lectured before about res pumps and heat, etc, but I really dont understand enough about the pumps that they say are BOTH inline and submerged..... What's the story with that option?

I just want to conserve space in my mid tower and I need something that is not ugly as hell. One other thing though is that because I want to pack everything really neatly in my case, I would prefer a reservoir with a submerged pump in it.

I have yet another question regarding radiators. First of all, I would imagine that they are very necessary in most cases, or you would otherwise see your water circuit gradually continue to heat until it no longer cooled. I was wondering what is the smallest unit you think I could find out there to serve as my radiator? The BIX is overpriced in my opinion, but they look nice.

Anyone know how small a heater core for something like a motorcycle is ? I imagine that a heater core for a 4 wheel vehicle will be too big and ugly to put in my case. I'm seriously trying to avoid the ghetto look in my case. I just wanted to avoid BIX prices though and from what I hear they are not much better than heater cores anyway.

Well, as usual, I appreciate you all sharing your experience.

[Pinkster]

i know a couple of peeps that use two rios (with inline mod) in parallel... they both love them, cause they havebt had any problems with them, they are silent and in parallel powerful too... but if you got the cash to spare get an eheim... they simply dont break down, where the others do, not particulary often, but they do.

[PetDMC]

how about a ViaAqua Model 1300 pump???

is this a good pump???

[DigitalChaos]

you look into a normal black ice?

[webmedic]

Not sure about that model of via aqua pump but I have tried rio 600 and 800, hagen 402, ehiem 1250, rena 450gph, and a harbor pump. All but the ehiem and rena were used submersed.

The rio's run a couple degrees hotter than the others but all the rest ran the same temps. Right now I have some via aqua pumps to try and will be able to state more about them latter.

The main thing to remember is that all the pumps that are sold as submersable are that way for a reason. They need the water for proper cooling. The way they are designed requiers submersion. But don't let this fool you, the inline pumps also cool themselves with the water they just have channels inside of the sealed chambers to allow water to flow arround in the pump for cooling.

I've by no means done the most extensive testing yet but the main thing to remember is that allot of things that go around forums is here say and the only way to know for sure is to try it out your self.

Three last things. 1) Anyone that uses any rio or any other submersable pump as an inline pump deserves to have it burn up on them. 2) The danners always leak eventually. 3) Bilge pumps and live bait pumps will die in about two months if used continuously. They are only intended for occasional use.

[resago]

Swallow hard and put down the $75 for the eheim and then forget about it.

Danners SUCK!

[Brad]

thats the most important thing about bilge pumps, they have very high gph, and are very cheap.

They are designed to be run for short periods of time only

[icel0rd]

My system component gathering phase is nearly complete.

I have the k4.1 block on the way from Germany
I have PVC tubing (more on that in a moment)
I have a Black Ice Rad (non-extreme edition) on the way

I still need:

pump + reservoir
advice on tubing

I am with you all on the Eheim suggestion, but what size reservoir do I need to get a decent eheim inside? I am really not sure how much power I need in my pump. The 1250 just sounds like overkill to me. All I am doing is cooling 1 t-bird 1100. I want a pump that fits in a reservoir that doesnt take up too much room in my case. Of course that would mean that it has to be submersible. It has to fit in a mid tower neatly. No ghetto-ness.

One other thing I'm not very certain of is the type of tubing to use. Is PVC going to be ok? Or do I really need that seemingly overpriced silicon tubing ?

Thanks gang. I am finally seeing my little watercooling scheme materialize now.

-Ice-

[Butcher]

For just a cpu the 1048 will do fine. As for a res, you can run the eheim inline you know If you want to submerge in a res I'd recommend an electrical junction box - you get get watertight ones. PVC tubing owrks, but silicone is easier to work with as it;s a lot more flexible and kinks less when going round corners.

[mashie]

Originally posted by Butcher
For just a cpu the 1048 will do fine. As for a res, you can run the eheim inline you know If you want to submerge in a res I'd recommend an electrical junction box - you get get watertight ones. PVC tubing owrks, but silicone is easier to work with as it;s a lot more flexible and kinks less when going round corners.

My 1048 has absolutely no problem to get the water around the loop with a Heater Core, seven 90 degree bends, CPU-, GPU- and NB-block. Everything is 1/2" though.

The XP1800 running at default speed are 29C idle and 34C load and that with only one fan running at 7V cooling the rad...

[webmedic]

Silicone tubing Doesn't collapse as easy as vynil tubing and can take the heat better. I heard of some eone that had a pump failure and the cpu got so hot it melted the block and water got everywere. Anyway the silicone tubing was unharmed.