white coating in my tubes

DigitalChaos · 02-20-2002, 01:16 AM

i have this coating that keeps forming in my tubes... so i completely emptied it and washed out the blocks by hookin them straight to the pressure on my house plumbing. i washed the pump and rad out too.
i setup the system again using new tubing (vinyl) and used only distilled water this time. after a few weeks this haze started to form in the tubes. it shows up MUCH more when the tube is left to try. the film feels oily or soapy. its white and it rubs off too. i am using all copper blocks with brass barbs.. WTF IS THIS STUFF???

i was using Redline first... and still got the coating so i thought the oil was somehow condensing on my tubes, and there is no way that there is enough left in my blocks to coat my tubes.

Brad · 02-20-2002, 01:51 AM

its just stuff coming from the water. I'd leave one lot of water in use, and try to get all this stuff out from the water, by cleaning the tubing, blocks, rads a couple of times

DigitalChaos · 02-20-2002, 06:01 AM

its distilled water! wtf is that stuff doing in distilled water?

gmat · 02-20-2002, 08:01 AM

Maybe leftovers of previous setup. Try cleaning everything up. Also make sure the water you put in is well distilled, and that the bottle has not been left open too long, or exposed to sunlight. Leave hot water (even slightly hot, +2°C over ambient) at contact with air, and algae and bacteria will settle there in no time.
I've been using distilled water + redline (and nothing else), and vinyl tubing continuously for 8 months now, without any trace of deposit showing up.
I'll get rid of vinyl tubing soon though, those cannot stand turns - even *light* turns. They tend to pinch or become 'flat' after time.

DigitalChaos · 02-20-2002, 09:11 AM

maybe i should try adding alcohol?
what is a good antibacterial additive?
redline obviously didnt work for me.

even though this stuff does not seem organic im willing to give it a try.

Jim · 02-20-2002, 06:31 PM

Digital-

When I was testing my heater core and copper pipe setup for leaks I ran distilled water through for 24 hours.

After I was finished the water I drained out (no water wetter added) was milky white also.

I don't know where it comes from either. :shrug:

Jim

Joe · 02-20-2002, 07:36 PM

I had the SAME issue with one of the first cooling rigs I made.

1. It was not biological, I ran 10% Isopropyl alcohol in the coolant

2. It wasnt white it was a VERY pale green ( almost white)

What it came down to was corrosion from the Aluminum blocks and the copper radiator. It was galvanic corrosion. I added water wetter, and all was right in the world

Jim · 02-20-2002, 07:44 PM

Hummmm...

No green with my experience, just milky. Also copper pipes and brass/copper heater core. Maybe it is crud in the heater core from manufacturing? Solder flux residue?

Jim

DigitalChaos · 02-20-2002, 08:23 PM

joe i had a greenish brownish coating after i ran a Redline mixture for a few months.... thing was it was copper and brass... no aluminum!!! wtf

heres another thing... i still have those corrosion tests goin... and there is NO residue on the cups... EVEN in a cup with straight tap water containing copper and aluminum.

did your residue feel like an oily/soapy coating?

ill take a pic of my tubes soon for you guys

sunblade · 02-20-2002, 09:07 PM

I had some cloudy stuff come out of my rad when I just got it a week or so ago. It seemed like metal flakes because they sparkled in the light slightly. The particles didn't just come out instantly though, after I left the rad to dry, some water left in the rad had it in it.

Pyrotechnic · 02-20-2002, 10:31 PM

i had that crap forming in my tubes once, i just used some of this castrol superclean desgreaser i had laying around to clean it out, i just sprayed a bunch in each piece of tube, rinsed it out, and the tubing looked like new again.

EMC2 · 02-21-2002, 12:24 AM

Digital - sounds a lot like the bacterial build-up I get in my aquarium hoses.

If it is, an inexpensive and safe way to get rid of it for a water cooling setup is to go to your local pet supply/fish store and get either tetracycline or myacin tablets for treatment of bacterial infections in fish. Costs under $5 and there will be enough to treat at least 30 gallons of water.

Just open the capsules in the one case or crush the tablets in the other to get a very fine powder. Dissolve it in some hot distilled water and add it to your system (after it's cooled down of course). Do this after cleaning out your hoses (to keep it from coming back).

If nothing else, it will eliminate any possibility of it being bacterial if it comes back in a week or so

While at the store, see if they have hose brushes (small cylindrical brush on the end of a long, stiff twisted wire handle). They are great for cleaning out hoses.

gmat · 02-21-2002, 09:42 AM

Yep sounds like bacteria to me as well.
Maybe it's sealant going off... Ya know excess goop that would be in contact with water... Happened to a guy who put too much sealant *inside* his reservoir.

decodeddiesel · 02-21-2002, 01:19 PM

Personally it sounds like some type of calcium from your water. I know it is distilled, however perhaps it would be worth while to pass your coolant through a filter (Britta or what not) then boil it in a clean pot before adding it to your system. I do not believe water is very well filtered before it is distilled and sold as such. Just a thought...

DigitalChaos · 02-22-2002, 11:38 PM

well just to see what happens i dumped isopropyl alcohol into my coolant
the alcohol is actually 91% alcohol and 9% water.
i did NOT clean anything out because this is somewhat of a temp setup and im sick of cleaning it =)
anyway its about.. a 1/4 gallon system, i added probably 4-5 oz of the alcohol
the result= got a bunch of bubbles forming all over, not massive foam but a definate reaction.. much like fresh soda. the reaction stopped after 2 min.

so i have no idea what to expect... or even what really happened so i leave it to you guys to give me some ideas =)

EMC2 · 02-23-2002, 12:11 AM

Was the pump running or was this with the pump shut down? Did you dump the alcohol in or slowly pour it in? Did you put it into a bleeder tube or a res?

DigitalChaos · 02-23-2002, 07:12 AM

dumped it into a res with pump on

EMC2 · 02-23-2002, 02:35 PM

I can't think of what would actually react with isopropyl that way. Is it having any affect on the substance on the pipe walls yet?

DigitalChaos · 05-08-2002, 11:26 PM

bah... i finally figured it out..
just recently i bought a maze3, so i was playin around with my maze2. i took the barbs off and noticed a concentration of the coating in the block (wtf?) then i realized it was the liquid barb sealant some how getting mixed in the water.

the outside of the block had some of the white sealant showing.. and this slowly turned a yellowish brownish green over all the times i got my coolant on it...

so that would explain the slow changing color from white to green to yellow to brown (er whatever it was)

ever since i pulled out the maze2 my tubing has been fine!!

funny thing is, i use liquid teflon to seal some of the block in my system and this problem only happened with the maze2 ??? maybe they just got a bad batch of liquid teflon or something...

Jim · 05-09-2002, 06:56 AM

Digital-
Was this a sealant you applied or was it applied by the manufacturer? My Maze2 didn't discolor my tubing, reason I ask.
Jim

MeltMan · 05-09-2002, 08:33 AM

I had a greasy feeling white build up in my hoses as well, but I think i traced it back to a different spot than everyone else. I just figured that it was lubrication from the new pump's impeller. Must have been something one time, because i replaced all the hoses and im not getting the same stuff again. Scratch that, upon inspecting the hose (just now) I noticed the stuff forming on the hose comming out of the radiator only. Maybe leftover flux from the heater core's making? That would expain the Maze2 as well since they are soldered together.

humm.... its not biological... i run winshield wiper fluid

DigitalChaos · 05-09-2002, 10:28 AM

it was what came with the block jim

DigitalChaos · 05-09-2002, 10:29 AM

meltman.. flux is generally water soluable. so it would stay suspended in the water. not coat your tubes

Jim · 05-09-2002, 11:39 AM

Hey ya know, when I was first building my watercool with the Maze2 I ran the setup for 24 hours without the block connected to the cpu to test for leaks. No water wetter added, just distilled water.

The next day when I drained the system the water came out milky. Must have been what you experienced. At the time I thought it was junk or flux from the Ford heater core.

Gettin' old sucks, you forget things!
Jim

Avatar28 · 05-09-2002, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by decodeddiesel
Personally it sounds like some type of calcium from your water. I know it is distilled, however perhaps it would be worth while to pass your coolant through a filter (Britta or what not) then boil it in a clean pot before adding it to your system. I do not believe water is very well filtered before it is distilled and sold as such. Just a thought...

That what it sounds like to me as well. That's why I'm going to go with deionized water. It's better filtered and more pure. The stuff I'm going to be carrying is lab reageant grade stuff. So it should be exceptionally pure. Only $8/gallon too. I'm trying to convince Danny at D-Tek to carry the stuff. I've already even worked out a better deal with the guy for him. He just has to do it.

02-20-2002, 01:16 AM	#1
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	white coating in my tubes i have this coating that keeps forming in my tubes... so i completely emptied it and washed out the blocks by hookin them straight to the pressure on my house plumbing. i washed the pump and rad out too. i setup the system again using new tubing (vinyl) and used only distilled water this time. after a few weeks this haze started to form in the tubes. it shows up MUCH more when the tube is left to try. the film feels oily or soapy. its white and it rubs off too. i am using all copper blocks with brass barbs.. WTF IS THIS STUFF??? i was using Redline first... and still got the coating so i thought the oil was somehow condensing on my tubes, and there is no way that there is enough left in my blocks to coat my tubes.

02-20-2002, 01:51 AM	#2
Brad Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nuu Zeeelin Posts: 3,175	its just stuff coming from the water. I'd leave one lot of water in use, and try to get all this stuff out from the water, by cleaning the tubing, blocks, rads a couple of times __________________ 2x P3 1100's at 1400, Abit VP6, 2x Corsair 256mb PC150 sticks, 20gb 'cuda ATA-III, 2x 40gb 'cuda ATA-IV in raid 0. 20" Trinitron. No fans 2x 2400+ at 2288mhz (16.0 x 143), Iwill MPX2, 2x Kingmax PC-3200 256mb sticks, 4x 20gb 60gxp in Raid 5 on a Promise SX6000. Asus Ti4200 320/630. Cooled by Water

02-20-2002, 07:36 PM	#7
Joe The Pro/Life Support System Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,041	I had the SAME issue with one of the first cooling rigs I made. 1. It was not biological, I ran 10% Isopropyl alcohol in the coolant 2. It wasnt white it was a VERY pale green ( almost white) What it came down to was corrosion from the Aluminum blocks and the copper radiator. It was galvanic corrosion. I added water wetter, and all was right in the world __________________ Joe - I only take this hat off for one thing... ProCooling archive curator and dusty skeleton.

02-21-2002, 01:19 PM	#14
decodeddiesel Cooling Savant Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: classified Posts: 534	Personally it sounds like some type of calcium from your water. I know it is distilled, however perhaps it would be worth while to pass your coolant through a filter (Britta or what not) then boil it in a clean pot before adding it to your system. I do not believe water is very well filtered before it is distilled and sold as such. Just a thought... __________________ ...i hurt... do me a favor, disconect me... they can re-work me but i'll never be top of the line again ...i'd rather be nothing...

02-23-2002, 12:11 AM	#16
EMC2 Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dark Side of the Moon Posts: 365	Inquiring minds want to know :P Was the pump running or was this with the pump shut down? Did you dump the alcohol in or slowly pour it in? Did you put it into a bleeder tube or a res?

02-20-2002, 06:01 AM	#3
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	its distilled water! wtf is that stuff doing in distilled water?

02-20-2002, 08:01 AM	#4
gmat Thermophile Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: France Posts: 1,221	Maybe leftovers of previous setup. Try cleaning everything up. Also make sure the water you put in is well distilled, and that the bottle has not been left open too long, or exposed to sunlight. Leave hot water (even slightly hot, +2°C over ambient) at contact with air, and algae and bacteria will settle there in no time. I've been using distilled water + redline (and nothing else), and vinyl tubing continuously for 8 months now, without any trace of deposit showing up. I'll get rid of vinyl tubing soon though, those cannot stand turns - even light turns. They tend to pinch or become 'flat' after time.

02-20-2002, 09:11 AM	#5
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	maybe i should try adding alcohol? what is a good antibacterial additive? redline obviously didnt work for me. even though this stuff does not seem organic im willing to give it a try.

02-20-2002, 06:31 PM	#6
Jim Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Illinois Posts: 389	Digital- When I was testing my heater core and copper pipe setup for leaks I ran distilled water through for 24 hours. After I was finished the water I drained out (no water wetter added) was milky white also. I don't know where it comes from either. :shrug: Jim

02-20-2002, 07:44 PM	#8
Jim Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Illinois Posts: 389	Hummmm... No green with my experience, just milky. Also copper pipes and brass/copper heater core. Maybe it is crud in the heater core from manufacturing? Solder flux residue? Jim

02-20-2002, 08:23 PM	#9
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	joe i had a greenish brownish coating after i ran a Redline mixture for a few months.... thing was it was copper and brass... no aluminum!!! wtf heres another thing... i still have those corrosion tests goin... and there is NO residue on the cups... EVEN in a cup with straight tap water containing copper and aluminum. did your residue feel like an oily/soapy coating? ill take a pic of my tubes soon for you guys

02-20-2002, 09:07 PM	#10
sunblade Registered User Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: USA Posts: 156	I had some cloudy stuff come out of my rad when I just got it a week or so ago. It seemed like metal flakes because they sparkled in the light slightly. The particles didn't just come out instantly though, after I left the rad to dry, some water left in the rad had it in it.

02-20-2002, 10:31 PM	#11
Pyrotechnic Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 240	i had that crap forming in my tubes once, i just used some of this castrol superclean desgreaser i had laying around to clean it out, i just sprayed a bunch in each piece of tube, rinsed it out, and the tubing looked like new again.

02-21-2002, 12:24 AM	#12
EMC2 Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dark Side of the Moon Posts: 365	Digital - sounds a lot like the bacterial build-up I get in my aquarium hoses. If it is, an inexpensive and safe way to get rid of it for a water cooling setup is to go to your local pet supply/fish store and get either tetracycline or myacin tablets for treatment of bacterial infections in fish. Costs under $5 and there will be enough to treat at least 30 gallons of water. Just open the capsules in the one case or crush the tablets in the other to get a very fine powder. Dissolve it in some hot distilled water and add it to your system (after it's cooled down of course). Do this after cleaning out your hoses (to keep it from coming back). If nothing else, it will eliminate any possibility of it being bacterial if it comes back in a week or so While at the store, see if they have hose brushes (small cylindrical brush on the end of a long, stiff twisted wire handle). They are great for cleaning out hoses.

02-21-2002, 09:42 AM	#13
gmat Thermophile Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: France Posts: 1,221	Yep sounds like bacteria to me as well. Maybe it's sealant going off... Ya know excess goop that would be in contact with water... Happened to a guy who put too much sealant inside his reservoir.

02-22-2002, 11:38 PM	#15
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	well just to see what happens i dumped isopropyl alcohol into my coolant the alcohol is actually 91% alcohol and 9% water. i did NOT clean anything out because this is somewhat of a temp setup and im sick of cleaning it =) anyway its about.. a 1/4 gallon system, i added probably 4-5 oz of the alcohol the result= got a bunch of bubbles forming all over, not massive foam but a definate reaction.. much like fresh soda. the reaction stopped after 2 min. so i have no idea what to expect... or even what really happened so i leave it to you guys to give me some ideas =)

02-23-2002, 07:12 AM	#17
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	dumped it into a res with pump on

02-23-2002, 02:35 PM	#18
EMC2 Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dark Side of the Moon Posts: 365	Draws a blank, tries to buy a vowel I can't think of what would actually react with isopropyl that way. Is it having any affect on the substance on the pipe walls yet?

05-08-2002, 11:26 PM	#19
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	bah... i finally figured it out.. just recently i bought a maze3, so i was playin around with my maze2. i took the barbs off and noticed a concentration of the coating in the block (wtf?) then i realized it was the liquid barb sealant some how getting mixed in the water. the outside of the block had some of the white sealant showing.. and this slowly turned a yellowish brownish green over all the times i got my coolant on it... so that would explain the slow changing color from white to green to yellow to brown (er whatever it was) ever since i pulled out the maze2 my tubing has been fine!! funny thing is, i use liquid teflon to seal some of the block in my system and this problem only happened with the maze2 ??? maybe they just got a bad batch of liquid teflon or something...

05-09-2002, 06:56 AM	#20
Jim Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Illinois Posts: 389	Digital- Was this a sealant you applied or was it applied by the manufacturer? My Maze2 didn't discolor my tubing, reason I ask. Jim

05-09-2002, 08:33 AM	#21
MeltMan Cooling Savant Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: KS Posts: 374	I had a greasy feeling white build up in my hoses as well, but I think i traced it back to a different spot than everyone else. I just figured that it was lubrication from the new pump's impeller. Must have been something one time, because i replaced all the hoses and im not getting the same stuff again. Scratch that, upon inspecting the hose (just now) I noticed the stuff forming on the hose comming out of the radiator only. Maybe leftover flux from the heater core's making? That would expain the Maze2 as well since they are soldered together. humm.... its not biological... i run winshield wiper fluid __________________ MeltMan Lurker Supreme!

05-09-2002, 10:28 AM	#22
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	it was what came with the block jim

05-09-2002, 10:29 AM	#23
DigitalChaos Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Waukesha, Wi Posts: 698	meltman.. flux is generally water soluable. so it would stay suspended in the water. not coat your tubes

05-09-2002, 11:39 AM	#24
Jim Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Illinois Posts: 389	Hey ya know, when I was first building my watercool with the Maze2 I ran the setup for 24 hours without the block connected to the cpu to test for leaks. No water wetter added, just distilled water. The next day when I drained the system the water came out milky. Must have been what you experienced. At the time I thought it was junk or flux from the Ford heater core. Gettin' old sucks, you forget things! Jim

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