Via Aqua 2600 pump

[megalomando]

Hi,

Anyone have any experience with this pump? I am awaiting a Via 1300 and just saw this one. Considering I'm using a fairly large radiator and want to cool a NB as well, it seems as if a larger pump might be a good thing.

Model: 2600

Dimensions: 6.8" x 2.75" x 4"
Max head: 7'
Max GPH: 740
GPH @ 4': 310
Inlet: 3/4"
Outlet: barbed 1/2",3/8"
Watts: 46
Average monthly cost $2.65

Anyone familliar with this pump?

Thanks

[modtheplanet]

no, but i am also looking at getting this pumb.

so many out there i dont know what to get.
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...&threadid=8171

[BrianW]

46watts is quite alot of heat. Do you have a P/Q graph to look at? With a cutoff of 7', i would guess that it would not flow too much more in a restrictive system as a smaller pump. This is just my opinion. I have only used three pumps: Eheim 1250, Lydor L30 and an Iwaki MD15rt. At 0' of head, the iwaki has the lowest flow. But in a water cooled pc cirquit the iwaki will beat em all. (edit: in flow).

BrianW

[ralf_c]

Originally posted by BrianW
At 0' of head, the iwaki has the lowest flow. But in a water cooled pc cirquit the iwaki will beat em all.

hi brian

do you think the iwaki can beat the mcp600

[BrianW]

Well when you say beat, you need to be more specific.

Do I think the MD15rt will have more flow in a restricted system? Yes

Do I think that the difference would be great? Not really. Only in cases of very high resistance systems.

Do I think you will get better temps? Same as above. Maybe even more negative because of the higher wattage use on the Iwaki.

These are all imo only. Not an expert.

BrianW

[modtheplanet]

I can get the ViaAqua 4900 for 38.99, is this a good deal?

here is the Performance Chart

[BrianW]

Thats one hell of a pump! I have ne experience with those pumps. But if they are designed for aquarium use, then they should be pretty reliable. Kinda big.

BrianW

[modtheplanet]

yeah i think its a pretty good pump for only 38.99 i mean 1321 GPH, MH 14 ft that should have no problem pumping though a system.

[megalomando]

Originally posted by BrianW
46watts is quite alot of heat. Do you have a P/Q graph to look at? With a cutoff of 7', i would guess that it would not flow too much more in a restrictive system as a smaller pump. This is just my opinion. I have only used three pumps: Eheim 1250, Lydor L30 and an Iwaki MD15rt. At 0' of head, the iwaki has the lowest flow. But in a water cooled pc cirquit the iwaki will beat em all. (edit: in flow).

BrianW

Hi Brian,

I would like an Iwaki as they really do seem to be built on a superior level. Makes the other pumps look more like toys no matter how well they are constructed. Much too pricey for my blood & most of the ones I see for sale are for 220 volts. I suppose I could get a converter easily enough though.

In another thread someone mentioned the 46 watts of heat and I replied with the following below.

-----------

This is something I've read in the forums but I don't understand the logic and I don't really buy the concept at all. I'll try to explain the reasons for my doubt & why I think it’s more like current folklore & old wives tales that keep getting repeated.


The pump is rated as 46 watts. It takes that much power to run. It’s not a heater and the device does kinetic work. That wattage is expended as kinetic energy (moving water & also a small amount of friction in the pump head & inner bearings) but by far most of the energy is expended as motor heat. The motor heat will be created in the windings as a result of the inductance, eddy currents and current flow within the coils of wire in the motor itself. In one real sense the motor itself is one big intermittent short switching current 60 times a second in the states (the 60hz you see on the motor labels & some countries have different hz ratings like 50hz).

The impeller is magnetically coupled to the rotor, which on most of these pumps is ceramic and as a result has a very low friction and there is no direct connection between the impeller and the rotor, only magnetic force. The heat from the coil does not flow directly into the water. The vast majority of the energy is released in the body of the pump not in the pump head, which is a chamber separate from the motor, and it's as far from the motor as can be. The huge majority of the heat will be expended in the air around the pump motor.

Surely there's going to be some heat that'll get into the pump head & passed on by the water simply because of proximity of the pump head to the body of the motor but nowhere near the 46-watt motor rating of the pump. There will be some heat although very small generated by the motion of water in the system but nothing like the heat from the body of the motor itself.

Look at it like a car, the engine runs & is really hot but that engine heat does not warm the interior of the car unless you intentionally divert the hot water into the cars heater core & then turn on the fan to blow in heat. The car motor running by itself will not warm the interior of the car except for the most minute amount making it negligible.

Same principle.

I don't understand why people keep reflecting the motor rating of pumps with an equivalent amount of heat getting into the water from the pump.

My biggest concern about the pump being high volume is if in some way it will reduce the ability to cool the system because the water is passing too quickly through the radiator.

Time for a beer

[Ewan]

Megalomando:

Unfortunately your ideas are completely wrong. If an engine is rated at a certain effect (100 hp for exampple) then it is assumed that this is the mechanical effect of the engine. The engine will infact use a lot more energy than this (a good engine is about 40% efficient, the remaining 60% being heat that goes out the exhaust).

A pump is however generally rated at it's maximum electrical energy draw, in this case 46W. From the pump curves you can often get the pumps efficiency at the operating flowrate, say 60%. This information isn't generaly provided for small pumps because no one is realy concerned about losing a few watts here and there. It's often provided for industrial pumps where efficiency is important.
The pumps efficency is then calculated by how much power the pump draws compared to how much kinetic energy is added to the pumped fluid. The inefficency is heat, either from impeller friction, or motor inefficency. Electric motors are pretty efficient though (say 90%) so the remaining inefficiency is friction in bearings and impeller friction against the pumped fluid.
Both of these heats will be added to the water. So basicly we have given up 10% of the pumps power to heating the air from the motor, 30% to heating the water from other inefficiancies and the remaining 60% becomes kinetic energy given to the water.

However what does the kinetic energy do?
It can do 3 things:
1) accelerate the water
2) add potential energy (height) to the water
3) create heat

For point 1, we can obviously tell that there is no acceleration going on since the water in the cooling loop flows at the same flow rate all the time, so we're not doing any accerlating.
For point 2, we can see that the water isn't being pumped to a higher point, because it's in a closed loop and comes back again. So we aren't adding potenital energy.
That leaves point 3. All kinetic energy is converted to heat via pipe friction.

So infact the only part of the pumps power that doesn't heat the water is the small faction due to the motors inefficiency.
The pumps sole purpose is to overcome the pipe friction. Its what the restriction is that everyone is talking about. All friction is converted to heat and it pretty much all absorbed by the water.

So your 46W pump will heat the water with about 43 watts.

[BrianW]

Not sure what percentage of heat is being passed to the coolant with my Iwaki, but the casing will get super hot if no air is moving over it. So hot, I can only touch it for 3-6 seconds without having to take my hand off of it. When I put an 80mm fan blowing over it, it did not get that warm.

With my eheim 1250, if I had the cirquit pumping with no fans on the rad, the coolant would rise 3-5 degrees C. So there is quite a bit of heat being dumped into the cirquit.

That is why the MCP600 looks so appealing. At only 10 watts od power used, one would assume less heat dumped into the water. I do not know if the fact that it is DC changes anything though. Any ideas?

My biggest concern about the pump being high volume is if in some way it will reduce the ability to cool the system because the water is passing too quickly through the radiator.

The water cannot move too fast through the radiator. While it is true that at a certian point you get to diminishing returns by increasing flow past the knee of effeciency for a particular rad, with increased flow you will have a lower delta t on the coolant side of the rad. Now if you do not decrease the delta t on the air side ( read: more airflow through the rad), then the increased flow will do little to lower overall coolant temps. However that being said, the increased flow should help to make your blocks more effecient at getting energy into the water via your water blocks.

BrianW

[Althornin]

Originally posted by BrianW

Do I think the MD15rt will have more flow in a restricted system? Yes

BrianW

why do you think this?
From what i remember of the P/Q curves, the swiftech pump is going to offer more flow at higher head.

having reviewed the curves i can find, i am no longer sure of this, so nevermind.

[ralf_c]

but the casing will get super hot if no air is moving over it.

hi all

brian, it gets that hot, DAMNIT. i really want a MD 15r. do you think if i put one of those in my case it will dump a great deal of heat if i have only rad and psu fans blowing?

i just won an MD 10k-nl28 from ebay, i hope it doesn't get too hot.

[BrianW]

It gets hot, because it doesnt seem to radiate it all that well. So things placed right next to it, do not seem to get hot. As long as there is a bit of airflow over it, I believe it runs quite cool.

BrianW

[jovetata]

about the VIAAQUA 4900 pump... it says it uses 122 watts... how badly would this affect the temperatures? if i run it inline, would the heat added to the water be less than if i submerged it?

[BrianW]

Hard to say, but I believe IMO that it would heat up the coolant more if it were submerged.

BrianW

[SexyMF]

Ok I have actually used the ViaAqua2600. I have both a 1300 and 2600. The 2600 does heat up the water more but it also increased my flowrates by 25% (submerged)

The main benefit was that the 2600 did not suffer from the clicking syndrome and doesn't need the impeller afixing to the shaft.

Downside is it is FAR noisier and has a very lage intake diameter. I am waiting for a valve and Freon so I can charge a fridge I'm going to use to cool the coolant. That said, I will then use the 2600 again because the pump will be further encased.

Price wise, its relatively cheap for such high flowrates so I say its worth a try.

Also, the 2600 is physically more robust than the 1300.

The 2600 p/q data is on the normal ViaAqua chart which is a sticky thread in this forum.