A good waterblock that is easy to mill.

crxy_sasquatch · 12-05-2003, 12:49 AM

I can gain access to a manual milling machine. I was inspired by Jaydee's lemon waterblock designs, but unfortuntely, it's way too difficult for me to even try.

I came up with these designs similar to jaydee's:

http://members.shaw.ca/bokinator/waterblock.htm

I haven't really decided on what dimensions to used especially for the square pins due to my lack of experience. Can you guys give me any insights/tips/suggestions for milling this out as efficiently as possible?

Khledar · 12-05-2003, 01:29 AM

Heya fellow BC'er

It really depends on how much milling experience you have (unless you're going CNC). Material is a big issue, milling 1st time with Cu might be.... discouraging, I did quite a bit of work on a lathe and mill with stainless steel and Al before startign on Cu. But starting with Cu isn't impossible, just the results aren't so quickly awesome.

Try to start simple, your design looks good to start with. Regarding pin size, try to base it on tool size(for easy milling), if you have an endmill that's 1/4" D then maybe your channel size should be 1/4" - you can do multiple lateral passes for channel sizes that are not the same as any tool you have, but it's more work - quick results at first are nice, complexity comes with practice.

Regarding best pin size for heat transfer and performance there is so much info on the baords already I'm sure you can find some, failing that someone will probably give you some numbers - but it depends on a lot of things.

crxy_sasquatch · 12-05-2003, 03:15 AM

I just drew this one

The gap in between each square pin is 1/16" (I'm not sure if there is even such a small milling bit) And each square is .15" big. I chose .15 because it's each turn on the milling machine is 0.2 inches, so I can just turn it 3/4 each time.

The cut between the pins and the inside cut is 1/4"

Khledar · 12-05-2003, 03:34 AM

If you have two inlets, I fear the more recent design is too restrictive in the middle, and not restrictive at all at the sides, hence the flow following the path of least resistance will mostly go around the edges bypassing the hottest zone altogether.

However if you plan on having a central inlet make sure the top plate does not leave much room between the pin tops and itself, you want to force the water into the pins since the channels are quite small.

And yes 1/16" endmills exist, depending on what the shop does they may or may not have endmills of that size. There are certain concerns when using such small endmills on a material such as copper. Copper becomes very 'gummy' when its hot and seems to almost stick to endmills, lubrication will be key when working with such small endmills & copper.

Regarding design, question the relevance of the channels perpendicular to the "overall flow" (inlet to outlet). Are you creating good turbulence? Or are you unnecessarily reducing flow?

I hope you don't think I'm being too critical, I really am not trying to be I'm just trying to suggest things to think of rather than tell you how I would make the perfect simple block - partly because I don't really know.

It's good to get experience on the mill - so go spend a few hours have some fun, feel the raw power in your hands, yeah CNC is cool - but there's nothing like controlling a beast that makes all the beasts.

jaydee · 12-05-2003, 10:29 AM

I have been trying to keep things simple on my pin blocks. 1/8" wide channels and 1/8" pins. I make the pins 3 times higher than the base thickness. Sure 1/16" endmills exist, broke a couple last weekend.

They also make 1/32" endmills.

The design you have above the pins need to be smaller. With that thin of channels your not going ot romovethe heat from the center of the pins. I have had good luck keeping the channel width and the pin width the same.

crxy_sasquatch · 12-06-2003, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaydee116
I have been trying to keep things simple on my pin blocks. 1/8" wide channels and 1/8" pins. I make the pins 3 times higher than the base thickness. Sure 1/16" endmills exist, broke a couple last weekend. They also make 1/32" endmills.

The design you have above the pins need to be smaller. With that thin of channels your not going ot romovethe heat from the center of the pins. I have had good luck keeping the channel width and the pin width the same.

What are the sizes of your pins?

oh yeah, how do you make the slot for the O ring?

jaydee · 12-06-2003, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by crxy_sasquatch
What are the sizes of your pins?

oh yeah, how do you make the slot for the O ring?

Pins are in beteen 1/16" and 1/8".

This is the milling process I used for the Lumpy Channel Block and the Pin Block.

Drilling the holes with a 1/8" drill bit.

----------------
Milling the ends for water to merge/spread before entering and exiting through the barbs.

----------------
milling the O-ring groove.

crxy_sasquatch · 12-06-2003, 11:23 PM

the picture right now has slots and pins that are 1/8" The pins touch the very top of the top plate to help distribute the waterflow around the waterblock.

how about the two outlet holes and the inlet holes. What size should they be?

and is there a simple way to mill out the O ring with a manual milling machine

jaydee · 12-07-2003, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crxy_sasquatch
the picture right now has slots and pins that are 1/8" The pins touch the very top of the top plate to help distribute the waterflow around the waterblock.

how about the two outlet holes and the inlet holes. What size should they be?

and is there a simple way to mill out the O ring with a manual milling machine

If they were both 1/8" then the slots would be as wide at the pins? Inlet in the center 1/4" NPT threaded hole, two outlets holes on each side the same.

O-ring groove is easy. Just make a square.

Attached is what I would start with on a manual mill.

Qwertyiopisme · 12-19-2003, 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaydee116
....milling the O-ring groove.

[/b]

Um... n00b question, how do you mill the groove with nice rounded corners, if you milled a square in a mill you would get sharp inside corners, whereas there you have corners round on the inside... :confuzed:

(OF course you could try to do it by hand by lessening the amount of feed on one axis and increasing on the other slowly but it wouldnt be accurate...)

Khledar · 12-19-2003, 02:36 AM

Even if you mill an o-ring groove as a square it will end up with rounded corners because the endmill is spinning and will not cut a perfectly square inside corner, it just isn't possible. The outside corner is another matter all together, but is fairly easily rounded as you mentioned with the feed, even a 45deg angle on the outside corner would prolly do her.

12-05-2003, 12:49 AM	#1
crxy_sasquatch Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: B.C Canada Posts: 13	A good waterblock that is easy to mill. I can gain access to a manual milling machine. I was inspired by Jaydee's lemon waterblock designs, but unfortuntely, it's way too difficult for me to even try. I came up with these designs similar to jaydee's: http://members.shaw.ca/bokinator/waterblock.htm I haven't really decided on what dimensions to used especially for the square pins due to my lack of experience. Can you guys give me any insights/tips/suggestions for milling this out as efficiently as possible?

12-05-2003, 01:29 AM	#2
Khledar Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: North Vancouver BC Posts: 234	Heya fellow BC'er It really depends on how much milling experience you have (unless you're going CNC). Material is a big issue, milling 1st time with Cu might be.... discouraging, I did quite a bit of work on a lathe and mill with stainless steel and Al before startign on Cu. But starting with Cu isn't impossible, just the results aren't so quickly awesome. Try to start simple, your design looks good to start with. Regarding pin size, try to base it on tool size(for easy milling), if you have an endmill that's 1/4" D then maybe your channel size should be 1/4" - you can do multiple lateral passes for channel sizes that are not the same as any tool you have, but it's more work - quick results at first are nice, complexity comes with practice. Regarding best pin size for heat transfer and performance there is so much info on the baords already I'm sure you can find some, failing that someone will probably give you some numbers - but it depends on a lot of things. __________________ "mooooo" said the cow. ERTW - UBC P4 2.4B @3.01Ghz 167FSB :: Abit IC7 :: 2x256MB HyperX PC3700 :: ASUS 9600XT :: WD Raptor 2x36GB RAID0

12-05-2003, 03:34 AM	#4
Khledar Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: North Vancouver BC Posts: 234	If you have two inlets, I fear the more recent design is too restrictive in the middle, and not restrictive at all at the sides, hence the flow following the path of least resistance will mostly go around the edges bypassing the hottest zone altogether. However if you plan on having a central inlet make sure the top plate does not leave much room between the pin tops and itself, you want to force the water into the pins since the channels are quite small. And yes 1/16" endmills exist, depending on what the shop does they may or may not have endmills of that size. There are certain concerns when using such small endmills on a material such as copper. Copper becomes very 'gummy' when its hot and seems to almost stick to endmills, lubrication will be key when working with such small endmills & copper. Regarding design, question the relevance of the channels perpendicular to the "overall flow" (inlet to outlet). Are you creating good turbulence? Or are you unnecessarily reducing flow? I hope you don't think I'm being too critical, I really am not trying to be I'm just trying to suggest things to think of rather than tell you how I would make the perfect simple block - partly because I don't really know. It's good to get experience on the mill - so go spend a few hours have some fun, feel the raw power in your hands, yeah CNC is cool - but there's nothing like controlling a beast that makes all the beasts. __________________ "mooooo" said the cow. ERTW - UBC P4 2.4B @3.01Ghz 167FSB :: Abit IC7 :: 2x256MB HyperX PC3700 :: ASUS 9600XT :: WD Raptor 2x36GB RAID0

12-06-2003, 11:23 PM	#8
crxy_sasquatch Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: B.C Canada Posts: 13	the picture right now has slots and pins that are 1/8" The pins touch the very top of the top plate to help distribute the waterflow around the waterblock. how about the two outlet holes and the inlet holes. What size should they be? and is there a simple way to mill out the O ring with a manual milling machine Last edited by crxy_sasquatch; 12-07-2003 at 04:13 PM.

12-19-2003, 02:36 AM	#11
Khledar Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: North Vancouver BC Posts: 234	Even if you mill an o-ring groove as a square it will end up with rounded corners because the endmill is spinning and will not cut a perfectly square inside corner, it just isn't possible. The outside corner is another matter all together, but is fairly easily rounded as you mentioned with the feed, even a 45deg angle on the outside corner would prolly do her. __________________ "mooooo" said the cow. ERTW - UBC P4 2.4B @3.01Ghz 167FSB :: Abit IC7 :: 2x256MB HyperX PC3700 :: ASUS 9600XT :: WD Raptor 2x36GB RAID0

12-05-2003, 03:15 AM	#3
crxy_sasquatch Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: B.C Canada Posts: 13	I just drew this one The gap in between each square pin is 1/16" (I'm not sure if there is even such a small milling bit) And each square is .15" big. I chose .15 because it's each turn on the milling machine is 0.2 inches, so I can just turn it 3/4 each time. The cut between the pins and the inside cut is 1/4"

12-05-2003, 10:29 AM	#5
jaydee Put up or Shut Up Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 6,506	I have been trying to keep things simple on my pin blocks. 1/8" wide channels and 1/8" pins. I make the pins 3 times higher than the base thickness. Sure 1/16" endmills exist, broke a couple last weekend. They also make 1/32" endmills. The design you have above the pins need to be smaller. With that thin of channels your not going ot romovethe heat from the center of the pins. I have had good luck keeping the channel width and the pin width the same.

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