Heater Cores?

nth1rty · 01-26-2004, 04:39 PM

Hey guys,

Here's a n00bish question for you. Would the benefits of using a heatercore outweigh those of, say, a Black Ice Xtreme II? I know they are cheaper, but do they do a better job at dissipating heat? Also, any suggestions of which heatercores to use are welcome as well.

Also, any ideas what's up with my p4 Temps?

nikhsub1 · 01-26-2004, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nth1rty

Hey guys,

Here's a n00bish question for you. Would the benefits of using a heatercore outweigh those of, say, a Black Ice Xtreme II? I know they are cheaper, but do they do a better job at dissipating heat? Also, any suggestions of which heatercores to use are welcome as well.

Also, any ideas what's up with my p4 Temps?

The BI rads ARE heatercores... they are just small and a bit restrictive. It is all about surface area, but for their size, the BI's do OK. If you have the space for a single pass heater core, that would be ideal but they are like 10" x 6" or so. If not, look into a chevette core which are 6" x 6". Regarding your temps, I would gather your mobo reads the on-die sensor in the CPU which is why it reports higher than most boards which read the insocket thermistor. 51C is fine for air, in fact, when I was on air with this CPU and board (before my WB adapter got here), my load temps were 61C

nth1rty · 01-26-2004, 06:56 PM

Do you think that MBM is reading the temperatures right?

Regarding heatercores, do the inlet/outlets make a difference? Most of them have one larger than the other. Does this present a problem with flow restriction?

Stiffler · 01-26-2004, 07:27 PM

If you check out Airspirit's database, you can prolly find the dimensions your looking for with the inlet/outlets that you want...

Butcher · 01-26-2004, 07:30 PM

Uusually inlet/outlet differences are just for convienience for fitting the core to a car.

AntiBling · 01-26-2004, 07:56 PM

I use an 89 Camaro heatercore, it has a 7x7 surface area. Total cost $22 dollars plus $10 for adhesive and barbs. Heatercores are cheaper than the specialized rads online and probably just as good. Mine was described as having a 5/8 and 1/2 inch outlets, but its really just a 1/2 pipe on both sides with one 1/2 pipe flared out at the end. Look for one that has copper tubing and tanks if you have a copper WB. There is a product called "copper bond" at Lowes or Home Depot that allows you to glue barbs and pipes together instead of soldering if you arent into that. Thats what I used, its leaktight and rock solid.

nth1rty · 01-26-2004, 08:42 PM

Out of curiousity, where do you buy them?

I've seen some at ebay, cap, scrapyards (but i dont want to go that route) websites etc.

Where have you guys found the best deals?

TerraMex · 01-26-2004, 08:59 PM

Mines where from an autoparts shop which gets most of their stuff from scrap yards. The difference is , they've already selected the best

.
Good deals usually are in scrap yards , you can get a box of them , cheap.

Stiffler · 01-26-2004, 09:23 PM

I got mine from a local junkyard. A little bit of Gunk Flush and it's all good...

V12|V12 · 01-27-2004, 01:22 AM

One quick note about the chevette core: If you look into the fins themselves, you'll notice that at each end there's a little lip , then a lip at the start of another plate... THough this is TIME CONSUMING, I decided to test out the air flow Vs turbulence caused by these "lips," which are HIGHLY dust accumulating! And with about 2hrs on my hands, I took a nice pair of scissors and poked through EACH vent opening and flattened them out and the air flow is MUCH better, dust doesn't get caught on the lips and temps dropped significantly for myself! Here's an MS-Paint of it...

Be VERY careful, as the lips are THIN copper, and I'm not too sure just how thick the flat copper tubes are, so you don't want to end up puncturing one and not having a way to repair it, with out messing up a substantial portion of the core... Good luck!

RedPhoenix · 01-27-2004, 05:04 PM

www.partsamerica.com or auto store I got them from both

guandi · 01-27-2004, 05:57 PM

Black Ice Extreme 2 (Cool Metal Blue) $102.00
Dual heatercore from DangerDen = $35

A freind of mine has both of these, the heatercore works perfectly, the BIX2 makes his Eheim 1060 whine a little and makes temps rise about 4'c

Nuff said.

rocketmanx · 01-27-2004, 06:31 PM

'77 Impala HC (with a/c), 12"x5.5"x2". States 1/2" and 5/8" tubes but the 5/8" is a 1/2" when cut down for fittings as it's just enlarged on the end of the pipe.
$17.50 @ Autozone

nth1rty · 01-27-2004, 07:45 PM

Okay, I'll check out CAP sometime this week.

Now what about fittings? How would a novice like me attach them to the heatercore?

nth1rty · 01-28-2004, 12:12 PM

bump? would I find the fittings at a hardware store, or would I have to order them online...

rocketmanx · 01-28-2004, 12:41 PM

Hardware store should have the fittings for either a HC or a BIX, etc...

To attach to the HC you'll have to "sweat" (solder) them top the copper tube. You'll need a paair of 1/2" female (plain female end that slides over the copper tube and is soldered) to a 3/8" fpt (female pipe thread). You'll also need a 3/8" male pipe thread to 1/2" or 3/8" hose barb, whichever size hose you have for the barb. Some teflon tape is needed also for a good water tight seal on the pipe threads.
When soldering the fittings to the HC you need to wrap a soaked towel around the base of the tube you're soldering and fill the HC with cold water. This keeps you from desoldering the other joints on the HC from the heat from the torch.

V12|V12 · 01-30-2004, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocketmanx

Hardware store should have the fittings for either a HC or a BIX, etc...

To attach to the HC you'll have to "sweat" (solder) them top the copper tube. You'll need a paair of 1/2" female (plain female end that slides over the copper tube and is soldered) to a 3/8" fpt (female pipe thread). You'll also need a 3/8" male pipe thread to 1/2" or 3/8" hose barb, whichever size hose you have for the barb. Some teflon tape is needed also for a good water tight seal on the pipe threads.
When soldering the fittings to the HC you need to wrap a soaked towel around the base of the tube you're soldering and fill the HC with cold water. This keeps you from desoldering the other joints on the HC from the heat from the torch.

Well, least with my Chevette core, the water helps, but is not really needed since the electro-brazed Silver's melting temp is around 700F+.... I tested mine out and tried to unsolder the stock fittings and they wouldn't budge at the same flame temp as with what I was usingto melt this safeflo Silver/antimony Mix (415F) But yeah, I would still fill it with water and use the damp sponge trick! Good luck all

PS- anyone got any cheap links to temp level-2 brazing silver?

rocketmanx · 01-30-2004, 04:08 PM

I'll look through all my racing supply resource links V12. In the meantime, you know of any good brass brazing links? I can weld all day long but have never brazed before. Tried it with my torch and it was a nesty looking mess. Definitely not a joint I would ever accept

I made a brass "frame/mount" and fan shroud for my '77 Impala HC and need to braze it to the HC. Have to be able to make a perfect braze first

BTW- what's cheap? Never bought the stuff berfore.

Jim · 01-30-2004, 09:54 PM

I soldered my barbs onto my first two chevette heater cores. This time around I attached them with "JB Weld". I risked no damage to the existing solder joints and came out with leak free results.
Jim

nth1rty · 01-31-2004, 12:50 AM

is all the soldering really necessary?

I have heard others say that they used plenty of 2000lb expoxy to attach the barbs to the hc. Being a high school student and all, I'm not sure I have access to the needed tools and space for soldering.

Butcher · 01-31-2004, 12:18 PM

I epoxy all my barbs, usually with some 2500 psi metal epoxy. It's a lot less hassle than soldering. So far I'm yet to have a leak.

V12|V12 · 02-05-2004, 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Butcher

I epoxy all my barbs, usually with some 2500 psi metal epoxy. It's a lot less hassle than soldering. So far I'm yet to have a leak.

Soldering a hassle? Heat object a little, apply flux, increase temp to ~415F, apply solder or brazing material (requires higher heat) metal melts, bonds, DONE.... 3x stronger and more durable than ANY silly TIME consuming epoxy.... besides epoxy cracks and degrades under certain chemical exposure/pressure and takes a LONG time to FULLY cure (~16-24hrs). My 86 Chevette core has no leaks and it's over 18 YEARS old... try that with some epoxy (save for JB WELD!) DOn't be me wrong, I cannot live w/o my epoxy collection! But for the STRONGEST bond and shortest down time, a quick 10min soldering job is perfect

My $3 bottle of propane has lasted me over a year with frequent soldering/brazing jobs.

The whole kit is about $20 for Nozzle, Propane/MAPP, Silver braze, and flux w/brush!

Plus the torch can be used for other household projects, like making a good Creme Brulee!

trit187 · 02-05-2004, 04:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim

I soldered my barbs onto my first two chevette heater cores. This time around I attached them with "JB Weld". I risked no damage to the existing solder joints and came out with leak free results.
Jim

hey, how much did you get your chevette cores for? they seem pretty simialer to the jr pro core.
also whered you get them from
thanks

Jim · 02-05-2004, 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trit187

hey, how much did you get your chevette cores for? they seem pretty simialer to the jr pro core.
also whered you get them from
thanks

$19.20 with tax at Auto Zone, (brick and motar) store.
Jim

Butcher · 02-05-2004, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by V12|V12

Soldering a hassle? Heat object a little, apply flux, increase temp to ~415F, apply solder or brazing material (requires higher heat) metal melts, bonds, DONE.... 3x stronger and more durable than ANY silly TIME consuming epoxy.... besides epoxy cracks and degrades under certain chemical exposure/pressure and takes a LONG time to FULLY cure (~16-24hrs). My 86 Chevette core has no leaks and it's over 18 YEARS old... try that with some epoxy (save for JB WELD!) DOn't be me wrong, I cannot live w/o my epoxy collection! But for the STRONGEST bond and shortest down time, a quick 10min soldering job is perfect

My $3 bottle of propane has lasted me over a year with frequent soldering/brazing jobs.

The whole kit is about $20 for Nozzle, Propane/MAPP, Silver braze, and flux w/brush!

Plus the torch can be used for other household projects, like making a good Creme Brulee!

Ever tried to solder a brass barb to anodised Al?

01-26-2004, 04:39 PM	#1
nth1rty Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Mass Posts: 23	Heater Cores? Hey guys, Here's a n00bish question for you. Would the benefits of using a heatercore outweigh those of, say, a Black Ice Xtreme II? I know they are cheaper, but do they do a better job at dissipating heat? Also, any suggestions of which heatercores to use are welcome as well. Also, any ideas what's up with my p4 Temps? __________________ Air cooled...and at stock speeds, I may be in the wrong place =) Rig 1: Intel p4c 3Ghz Intel D865GBF 2x512 Mushkin Level I pc3500 (200ddr @ 2-6-3-2) ThermalTake PurePower Butterfly 480watt Aspire X-SuperAlien Rig 2: AMD 2500+ Barton (200 * 10.5) Asus A7n8X Deluxe Retail 2x512 Kingston HyperX pc4000 (200 ddr @ 2.5-7-3-3)

01-26-2004, 06:56 PM	#3
nth1rty Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Mass Posts: 23	Do you think that MBM is reading the temperatures right? Regarding heatercores, do the inlet/outlets make a difference? Most of them have one larger than the other. Does this present a problem with flow restriction? __________________ Air cooled...and at stock speeds, I may be in the wrong place =) Rig 1: Intel p4c 3Ghz Intel D865GBF 2x512 Mushkin Level I pc3500 (200ddr @ 2-6-3-2) ThermalTake PurePower Butterfly 480watt Aspire X-SuperAlien Rig 2: AMD 2500+ Barton (200 * 10.5) Asus A7n8X Deluxe Retail 2x512 Kingston HyperX pc4000 (200 ddr @ 2.5-7-3-3)

01-26-2004, 08:42 PM	#7
nth1rty Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Mass Posts: 23	Out of curiousity, where do you buy them? I've seen some at ebay, cap, scrapyards (but i dont want to go that route) websites etc. Where have you guys found the best deals? __________________ Air cooled...and at stock speeds, I may be in the wrong place =) Rig 1: Intel p4c 3Ghz Intel D865GBF 2x512 Mushkin Level I pc3500 (200ddr @ 2-6-3-2) ThermalTake PurePower Butterfly 480watt Aspire X-SuperAlien Rig 2: AMD 2500+ Barton (200 * 10.5) Asus A7n8X Deluxe Retail 2x512 Kingston HyperX pc4000 (200 ddr @ 2.5-7-3-3)

01-26-2004, 08:59 PM	#8
TerraMex Cooling Savant Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Portugal, Europe Posts: 870	Mines where from an autoparts shop which gets most of their stuff from scrap yards. The difference is , they've already selected the best . Good deals usually are in scrap yards , you can get a box of them , cheap. __________________ "we need more cowbell."

01-27-2004, 05:04 PM	#11
RedPhoenix Cooling Savant Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Florida Posts: 266	www.partsamerica.com or auto store I got them from both __________________ rawr www.mysoarer.com

01-26-2004, 07:27 PM	#4
Stiffler Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Monmouth, OR Posts: 65	If you check out Airspirit's database, you can prolly find the dimensions your looking for with the inlet/outlets that you want...

01-26-2004, 07:30 PM	#5
Butcher Thermophile Join Date: May 2001 Location: UK Posts: 1,064	Uusually inlet/outlet differences are just for convienience for fitting the core to a car.

01-26-2004, 07:56 PM	#6
AntiBling Cooling Savant Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: orlando FL Posts: 147	I use an 89 Camaro heatercore, it has a 7x7 surface area. Total cost $22 dollars plus $10 for adhesive and barbs. Heatercores are cheaper than the specialized rads online and probably just as good. Mine was described as having a 5/8 and 1/2 inch outlets, but its really just a 1/2 pipe on both sides with one 1/2 pipe flared out at the end. Look for one that has copper tubing and tanks if you have a copper WB. There is a product called "copper bond" at Lowes or Home Depot that allows you to glue barbs and pipes together instead of soldering if you arent into that. Thats what I used, its leaktight and rock solid.

01-26-2004, 09:23 PM	#9
Stiffler Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Monmouth, OR Posts: 65	I got mine from a local junkyard. A little bit of Gunk Flush and it's all good...

01-27-2004, 05:57 PM	#12
guandi Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: UK Posts: 174	Black Ice Extreme 2 (Cool Metal Blue) $102.00 Dual heatercore from DangerDen = $35 A freind of mine has both of these, the heatercore works perfectly, the BIX2 makes his Eheim 1060 whine a little and makes temps rise about 4'c Nuff said. __________________ A8N-SLI Deluxe FX55@3ghz 2x TwinX1024-3200XL 2x BFG6800Ultra Audigy2 ZS + Gigaworks S750 2x120gb/4x80gb lots of water/copper/pumpy goodness.

01-27-2004, 06:31 PM	#13
rocketmanx Cooling Savant Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indiana Posts: 127	'77 Impala HC (with a/c), 12"x5.5"x2". States 1/2" and 5/8" tubes but the 5/8" is a 1/2" when cut down for fittings as it's just enlarged on the end of the pipe. $17.50 @ Autozone __________________ "The more I learn the less I know, but I never knew as much as when I was sixteen"

01-27-2004, 07:45 PM	#14
nth1rty Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Mass Posts: 23	Okay, I'll check out CAP sometime this week. Now what about fittings? How would a novice like me attach them to the heatercore? __________________ Air cooled...and at stock speeds, I may be in the wrong place =) Rig 1: Intel p4c 3Ghz Intel D865GBF 2x512 Mushkin Level I pc3500 (200ddr @ 2-6-3-2) ThermalTake PurePower Butterfly 480watt Aspire X-SuperAlien Rig 2: AMD 2500+ Barton (200 * 10.5) Asus A7n8X Deluxe Retail 2x512 Kingston HyperX pc4000 (200 ddr @ 2.5-7-3-3)

01-28-2004, 12:12 PM	#15
nth1rty Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Mass Posts: 23	bump? would I find the fittings at a hardware store, or would I have to order them online... __________________ Air cooled...and at stock speeds, I may be in the wrong place =) Rig 1: Intel p4c 3Ghz Intel D865GBF 2x512 Mushkin Level I pc3500 (200ddr @ 2-6-3-2) ThermalTake PurePower Butterfly 480watt Aspire X-SuperAlien Rig 2: AMD 2500+ Barton (200 * 10.5) Asus A7n8X Deluxe Retail 2x512 Kingston HyperX pc4000 (200 ddr @ 2.5-7-3-3)

01-28-2004, 12:41 PM	#16
rocketmanx Cooling Savant Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indiana Posts: 127	Hardware store should have the fittings for either a HC or a BIX, etc... To attach to the HC you'll have to "sweat" (solder) them top the copper tube. You'll need a paair of 1/2" female (plain female end that slides over the copper tube and is soldered) to a 3/8" fpt (female pipe thread). You'll also need a 3/8" male pipe thread to 1/2" or 3/8" hose barb, whichever size hose you have for the barb. Some teflon tape is needed also for a good water tight seal on the pipe threads. When soldering the fittings to the HC you need to wrap a soaked towel around the base of the tube you're soldering and fill the HC with cold water. This keeps you from desoldering the other joints on the HC from the heat from the torch. __________________ "The more I learn the less I know, but I never knew as much as when I was sixteen" Last edited by rocketmanx; 01-28-2004 at 12:56 PM.

01-30-2004, 04:08 PM	#18
rocketmanx Cooling Savant Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Indiana Posts: 127	I'll look through all my racing supply resource links V12. In the meantime, you know of any good brass brazing links? I can weld all day long but have never brazed before. Tried it with my torch and it was a nesty looking mess. Definitely not a joint I would ever accept I made a brass "frame/mount" and fan shroud for my '77 Impala HC and need to braze it to the HC. Have to be able to make a perfect braze first BTW- what's cheap? Never bought the stuff berfore. __________________ "The more I learn the less I know, but I never knew as much as when I was sixteen"

01-31-2004, 12:50 AM	#20
nth1rty Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Mass Posts: 23	is all the soldering really necessary? I have heard others say that they used plenty of 2000lb expoxy to attach the barbs to the hc. Being a high school student and all, I'm not sure I have access to the needed tools and space for soldering. __________________ Air cooled...and at stock speeds, I may be in the wrong place =) Rig 1: Intel p4c 3Ghz Intel D865GBF 2x512 Mushkin Level I pc3500 (200ddr @ 2-6-3-2) ThermalTake PurePower Butterfly 480watt Aspire X-SuperAlien Rig 2: AMD 2500+ Barton (200 * 10.5) Asus A7n8X Deluxe Retail 2x512 Kingston HyperX pc4000 (200 ddr @ 2.5-7-3-3)

01-31-2004, 12:18 PM	#21
Butcher Thermophile Join Date: May 2001 Location: UK Posts: 1,064	I epoxy all my barbs, usually with some 2500 psi metal epoxy. It's a lot less hassle than soldering. So far I'm yet to have a leak. __________________ Once upon a time, in a land far far away...

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