I finally made my own CPU block - Page 2

G33k · 02-06-2003, 09:28 AM

Nice work, as usual Bladerunner

I was especially imoressed with the milling there - good job!

One thing you might want to think about; You have four outlets to distribute flow "evenly" - have you tested to see how restrictive the various paths are? I only ask because if you have one or two paths that are more restictive than others, the water will favour the paths of less resistance. You may find that one or more channels receive virtually no flow as a result. Was that one of the points you were trying to get at msv (albeit in a rather cryptic manner

)?

BladeRunner · 02-06-2003, 10:27 AM

msv

Ohhh now that's a "how long is a piece of string" type of question so I'll do my best not to give a "twice as long from one end to the middle" type answer

No one solution will be the best in every situation, it's the same with just about everything, like what is the best car, well it depends, an F50 is fast but uncomfortable and not too good off road, for instance.

This is the way I see it as far as system flow configuration goes in my system, (and I'm not for one minute suggesting It's the best or only way for everyone's set-up as mine is different to most). Assuming good pump flow, (I'm using an Eheim 1060), a CPU block cooling a hot XP will add no more than 0.5ºC to the temp of the coolant as it passes through the water block, (probably less). All the blocks in my system together add about 0.8ºC to the coolant temp in one pass when the PC is under full load, (that's the average difference between input temp to output temp in one pass through my Current CPU block and split to VGA VPU, VGA Ram x2, NB, HDD, & PSU.)

With this, and the fact I'm using coolant at around 12C, I decided that the only block that it's really important to give the most flow rate to is the CPU, all the other items don't produce enough heat on their own for high flow to make a noticeable difference. To ensure the flow rate stays good overall the CPU block gets the input directly from the rad, ("bomb" tank in my system), at full flow rate, then after that it is Split to everything else, which will get the coolant at no more than 0.5ºC warmer than the CPU block, but at reduced flow dependant on the tube size / it's flow restrictions etc. This works well and keeps the overall system flow rate up.

There are many other options, including more complex multi pump etc, but sticking to the more normal ones they are either split the flow before the CPU block, or run it through each block in series. Series would be very inefficient in my set-up, and require much larger non restrictive blocks on everything, very impractical. The trouble with splitting flow before the CPU block is you've possibly halved the flow rate of the most important block. In real world performance it may not make any difference as it depends on many other additional factors of a particular system.

To split the flow I made the splitter manifolds from acrylic and designed them to be non restrictive, (no 90° angle changes), they appear to work well in my system. The new CPU block will remove the need for one of these splitters, (although additional splits of the 8mm new block outputs maybe required for the 6mm blocks I have like VGA ram etc)

Better details on how I made the manifolds will be on my site when I get around to it. I use push fit connectors from the Festo range on both manifolds and all blocks other than CPU inflow, this made the Radeon 9700 Cooler a simple swap over from the previous Gf4, taking about 15 mins including bleed down and refill.

So to sum up when you get to more than two or three additional blocks in a system, It may be better to think of splitting to keep overall system flow up, as each additional block in line with the CPU block will restrict flow unless it's a particularly low restriction (read large), block.

I guess number four is closest to my way of thinking, with a little edit.

4. Who cares? It´s only the CPU WB that really needs high performance cooling anyway, all the other blocks, (assuming Tec's are not used), don't require anything as sophisticated as a CPU waterblock or anywhere near it's flow rate to perform well enough.

G33k

Thanks for the kind comment, It amazes me what can actually done with a decent mill, after using my crappy home made mill in the beginning.

You make a valid point however, and it may take some balance, but as long as the overall pump flow is good enough all paths should receive flow all be it at possibly reduced rates depending on blocks tube size restrictions etc.. At the moment with my splitter manifolds the PSU and HDD, (and mini R9700 plate cooling / v mod block), are on one of the 6mm loops and this is the most restrictive loop. It flows slower than the others but is still more than sufficient to cool the items, lending more weight to my belief the additional water-cooled stuff, (assuming sound design and application), like HDD waterblocks, PSU waterblocks etc, don't require enormous flow rates, or large coolant tubes and channels to work well. In some ways difference in the flow restrictions of each spit is wanted so that the VPU gets the second best after CPU, but as long as they all receive some flow, (which is easy to see when the system self bleeds on first run), it will be fine. Of course my cooler than normal coolant wont hurt in this respect either of course.

With this in mind I can only see the new CPU block assisting overall flow, by being less restrictive and including the splitter manifold in it's design, but I guess the proof of the pudding is in the eating. I'll try to get it done and test it out asap

gone_fishin · 02-06-2003, 03:07 PM

That looks great and it's nice to see another four outlet block on this planet.

gmat · 02-06-2003, 03:51 PM

(applause)
Wow ! (that's all i can think of right now)

Don't forget to tell us how it performs compared to your previous CPU block...

dima y · 02-06-2003, 04:23 PM

Quote:

I have a prototype for FX but can't do more until I can finally get hold of a card.

Hmmm i have something coming up as well!

finally Nvidia gets it right with the mounting holes through the PCB!

so much easier to make the block(s)

btw are you going to go with 2 blocks or more?

Bose-Einstien Condensate · 02-06-2003, 04:24 PM

here is the silver fitting you need.
http://www.highspeedpc.com/Merchant2...y_Code=Fitting

BladeRunner · 02-06-2003, 04:44 PM

dima y

The FX build is mostly likely going to be in conjunction with other parties, so I'm not elaborating on it anymore atm

, save to say the pin holes around the ram are definitely a welcome addition.

Bose-Einstien Condensate

Thanks for that but they are a different thing, compression fittings. I'm using push fits that are just that, push the tube in, pull it back to lock and that's it. They work well zero leaks so far, I'm just not keen on the blue plastic top part, it don't go with the copper colours.

morphling1 · 02-06-2003, 04:46 PM

Another incredible work BadeRunner,I always enjoy your beautiful photos waterblock construction articles. You must realy be one incredibly patient man just loving his hobby.

BladeRunner · 02-06-2003, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by morphling1
You must really be one incredibly patient man just loving his hobby.

You got it

(not sure about the patient part however). I do love your mill btw, commented about it in the mill thread

morphling1 · 02-06-2003, 07:39 PM

Not sure about the patient part

The man who goes through your kind of detailing, hand filing, mirror finnish lapping and finaly coating got to be on patient dude, or you're some kind of photo shop master, and just make everything apperar beautiful

#Rotor · 02-06-2003, 10:41 PM

"hhhmmmm, The Force is strong in him."

omniphallic · 02-07-2003, 04:50 PM

Awesome fittings selection: Legris

ChrioN · 02-07-2003, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by omniphallic
Awesome fittings selection: Legris

good one!

G33k · 02-08-2003, 12:28 AM

Favour for a fellow overclocker (taken from this thread).

Quote:

WalkerIV : Can someone with a procooling account do me a favour?
I cant seem to get mine activated for about a month now...

So anyways could you suggest BR to paint the blue plastic connector part with silver model glue. Shouldn't be that bad looking with a proper amount of time put into it.

WinFlex · 02-13-2003, 12:29 PM

Bladerunner, could you be so nice and explain the exact procedure that you follow in order to get those brilliant surface finishes? From you webpage, I have learned that you use silicone sandpaper and then some sort of sealant to prevent corrosion. It would be awesome if you could list some specific details regarding those beautiful finishes you have on your blocks.

Thanks, I admire your work,

Felix

Blackeagle · 02-13-2003, 02:45 PM

Quote:

"hhhmmmm. The Force is strong in him."

#Rotor said it best.

Very beautiful looks, and a pinned base for cooling. VERY NICE

BladeRunner · 02-16-2003, 11:01 AM

argggghh....... haven't forgotten this thread but I'm just so busy atm. On top of working all hours including Sunday

, and also talking and cooling projects with a couple of graphics card companies, I'm still recoving my O/S and programs.

Most of the finishing details can be found on my site, it you follow the front page news link to the Gainward GF4 liquid cooling article, I detail what is used and the methods with links during the three part build .

I did try painting the blue plastic fitting tops with silver model paint but it didn't look that good, (could do if it were spray applied). The main problem however is the plastic used is a waxy type, (like those small model soldiers), so the paint doesn't bond too well.

Said it before, but repeating it is worth... #Rotor is my Yoda

G33k · 02-16-2003, 09:21 PM

I couldn't see any prices on the Legris site, but Thorite are about the cheapest i've seen for fittings / tubing.

pokpok · 02-16-2003, 10:39 PM

nice shiny blocks..as always

and for those fittings w/the blue ring on the top..what are those called?

G33k · 02-16-2003, 10:40 PM

They're Push-Fit fittings. Here's an example of Thorite's offerings :

Rather nice don't you think?

pokpok · 02-16-2003, 10:53 PM

wheres the bl00 ?

WinFlex · 03-12-2003, 08:21 AM

anyone have good sources for various fittings over in the USofA?

pokpok · 03-12-2003, 10:10 AM

http://becooling.safeshopper.com/29/cat29.htm?584

or here

http://www.portagespecialty.com/custom/BrassHose.html

W1zzard · 03-12-2003, 01:34 PM

anybody know of a supplier for barbs/fittings in continental europe preferably germany?

MadDogMe · 03-13-2003, 05:21 AM

The Thermaltake 1U P4 heatsink would make an excellent base if it was 'carefully' crosscut to pins instead of fins, MUCH more dense 'finage' surface area for cooling. Those pins look to far spaced to me

. I'd have them a little lower as well, will heat travel all the way up them?, it'd boost H2o pressure if it was lower as well...

With the pin base you have I'd drill loads of shallow holes in the surface as well to add to the turbulance/area...

Booteful

job as allways though Bladerunner!...

PS, LINK to 1U P4 HSF @ theoverclockingstore.co.uk ...

Volenti has posted some threads where he modded one for H2o use, they are an excellent base!...

02-06-2003, 09:28 AM	#26
G33k Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Bristol [UK] Posts: 73	Nice work, as usual Bladerunner I was especially imoressed with the milling there - good job! One thing you might want to think about; You have four outlets to distribute flow "evenly" - have you tested to see how restrictive the various paths are? I only ask because if you have one or two paths that are more restictive than others, the water will favour the paths of less resistance. You may find that one or more channels receive virtually no flow as a result. Was that one of the points you were trying to get at msv (albeit in a rather cryptic manner )? __________________ "Success is 99% Failure"

02-06-2003, 10:27 AM	#27
BladeRunner Cooling Savant Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Chesterfield Uk Posts: 459	msv Ohhh now that's a "how long is a piece of string" type of question so I'll do my best not to give a "twice as long from one end to the middle" type answer No one solution will be the best in every situation, it's the same with just about everything, like what is the best car, well it depends, an F50 is fast but uncomfortable and not too good off road, for instance. This is the way I see it as far as system flow configuration goes in my system, (and I'm not for one minute suggesting It's the best or only way for everyone's set-up as mine is different to most). Assuming good pump flow, (I'm using an Eheim 1060), a CPU block cooling a hot XP will add no more than 0.5ºC to the temp of the coolant as it passes through the water block, (probably less). All the blocks in my system together add about 0.8ºC to the coolant temp in one pass when the PC is under full load, (that's the average difference between input temp to output temp in one pass through my Current CPU block and split to VGA VPU, VGA Ram x2, NB, HDD, & PSU.) With this, and the fact I'm using coolant at around 12C, I decided that the only block that it's really important to give the most flow rate to is the CPU, all the other items don't produce enough heat on their own for high flow to make a noticeable difference. To ensure the flow rate stays good overall the CPU block gets the input directly from the rad, ("bomb" tank in my system), at full flow rate, then after that it is Split to everything else, which will get the coolant at no more than 0.5ºC warmer than the CPU block, but at reduced flow dependant on the tube size / it's flow restrictions etc. This works well and keeps the overall system flow rate up. There are many other options, including more complex multi pump etc, but sticking to the more normal ones they are either split the flow before the CPU block, or run it through each block in series. Series would be very inefficient in my set-up, and require much larger non restrictive blocks on everything, very impractical. The trouble with splitting flow before the CPU block is you've possibly halved the flow rate of the most important block. In real world performance it may not make any difference as it depends on many other additional factors of a particular system. To split the flow I made the splitter manifolds from acrylic and designed them to be non restrictive, (no 90° angle changes), they appear to work well in my system. The new CPU block will remove the need for one of these splitters, (although additional splits of the 8mm new block outputs maybe required for the 6mm blocks I have like VGA ram etc) Better details on how I made the manifolds will be on my site when I get around to it. I use push fit connectors from the Festo range on both manifolds and all blocks other than CPU inflow, this made the Radeon 9700 Cooler a simple swap over from the previous Gf4, taking about 15 mins including bleed down and refill. So to sum up when you get to more than two or three additional blocks in a system, It may be better to think of splitting to keep overall system flow up, as each additional block in line with the CPU block will restrict flow unless it's a particularly low restriction (read large), block. I guess number four is closest to my way of thinking, with a little edit. 4. Who cares? It´s only the CPU WB that really needs high performance cooling anyway, all the other blocks, (assuming Tec's are not used), don't require anything as sophisticated as a CPU waterblock or anywhere near it's flow rate to perform well enough. G33k Thanks for the kind comment, It amazes me what can actually done with a decent mill, after using my crappy home made mill in the beginning. You make a valid point however, and it may take some balance, but as long as the overall pump flow is good enough all paths should receive flow all be it at possibly reduced rates depending on blocks tube size restrictions etc.. At the moment with my splitter manifolds the PSU and HDD, (and mini R9700 plate cooling / v mod block), are on one of the 6mm loops and this is the most restrictive loop. It flows slower than the others but is still more than sufficient to cool the items, lending more weight to my belief the additional water-cooled stuff, (assuming sound design and application), like HDD waterblocks, PSU waterblocks etc, don't require enormous flow rates, or large coolant tubes and channels to work well. In some ways difference in the flow restrictions of each spit is wanted so that the VPU gets the second best after CPU, but as long as they all receive some flow, (which is easy to see when the system self bleeds on first run), it will be fine. Of course my cooler than normal coolant wont hurt in this respect either of course. With this in mind I can only see the new CPU block assisting overall flow, by being less restrictive and including the splitter manifold in it's design, but I guess the proof of the pudding is in the eating. I'll try to get it done and test it out asap __________________ Zero Fan Zone Last edited by BladeRunner; 04-19-2004 at 03:42 AM.

02-06-2003, 04:44 PM	#32
BladeRunner Cooling Savant Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Chesterfield Uk Posts: 459	dima y The FX build is mostly likely going to be in conjunction with other parties, so I'm not elaborating on it anymore atm , save to say the pin holes around the ram are definitely a welcome addition. Bose-Einstien Condensate Thanks for that but they are a different thing, compression fittings. I'm using push fits that are just that, push the tube in, pull it back to lock and that's it. They work well zero leaks so far, I'm just not keen on the blue plastic top part, it don't go with the copper colours. __________________ Zero Fan Zone

02-06-2003, 04:46 PM	#33
morphling1 Cooling Savant Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Slovenia Posts: 468	Another incredible work BadeRunner,I always enjoy your beautiful photos waterblock construction articles. You must realy be one incredibly patient man just loving his hobby. __________________ [My ftp, with lots of pics, hope to be home page someday

02-06-2003, 07:39 PM	#35
morphling1 Cooling Savant Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Slovenia Posts: 468	Not sure about the patient part The man who goes through your kind of detailing, hand filing, mirror finnish lapping and finaly coating got to be on patient dude, or you're some kind of photo shop master, and just make everything apperar beautiful __________________ [My ftp, with lots of pics, hope to be home page someday

02-06-2003, 03:07 PM	#28
gone_fishin Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2002 Location: Da UP Posts: 517	That looks great and it's nice to see another four outlet block on this planet.

02-06-2003, 03:51 PM	#29
gmat Thermophile Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: France Posts: 1,221	(applause) Wow ! (that's all i can think of right now) Don't forget to tell us how it performs compared to your previous CPU block...

02-06-2003, 04:24 PM	#31
Bose-Einstien Condensate Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 84	here is the silver fitting you need. http://www.highspeedpc.com/Merchant2...y_Code=Fitting

02-06-2003, 10:41 PM	#36
#Rotor Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dione, sector 4s1256 Posts: 852	"hhhmmmm, The Force is strong in him." __________________ There is no Spoon....

02-07-2003, 04:50 PM	#37
omniphallic Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Sacramento, Ca Posts: 1	Awesome fittings selection: Legris

02-13-2003, 12:29 PM	#40
WinFlex Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Boston, MA, USA Posts: 51	Surface finish Bladerunner, could you be so nice and explain the exact procedure that you follow in order to get those brilliant surface finishes? From you webpage, I have learned that you use silicone sandpaper and then some sort of sealant to prevent corrosion. It would be awesome if you could list some specific details regarding those beautiful finishes you have on your blocks. Thanks, I admire your work, Felix

02-16-2003, 11:01 AM	#42
BladeRunner Cooling Savant Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Chesterfield Uk Posts: 459	argggghh....... haven't forgotten this thread but I'm just so busy atm. On top of working all hours including Sunday , and also talking and cooling projects with a couple of graphics card companies, I'm still recoving my O/S and programs. Most of the finishing details can be found on my site, it you follow the front page news link to the Gainward GF4 liquid cooling article, I detail what is used and the methods with links during the three part build . I did try painting the blue plastic fitting tops with silver model paint but it didn't look that good, (could do if it were spray applied). The main problem however is the plastic used is a waxy type, (like those small model soldiers), so the paint doesn't bond too well. Said it before, but repeating it is worth... #Rotor is my Yoda __________________ Zero Fan Zone

02-16-2003, 09:21 PM	#43
G33k Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Bristol [UK] Posts: 73	I couldn't see any prices on the Legris site, but Thorite are about the cheapest i've seen for fittings / tubing. __________________ "Success is 99% Failure"

02-16-2003, 10:39 PM	#44
pokpok Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: rsm,ca Posts: 87	nice shiny blocks..as always and for those fittings w/the blue ring on the top..what are those called?

02-16-2003, 10:40 PM	#45
G33k Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Bristol [UK] Posts: 73	They're Push-Fit fittings. Here's an example of Thorite's offerings : Rather nice don't you think? __________________ "Success is 99% Failure"

02-16-2003, 10:53 PM	#46
pokpok Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: rsm,ca Posts: 87	wheres the bl00 ?

03-12-2003, 08:21 AM	#47
WinFlex Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Boston, MA, USA Posts: 51	anyone have good sources for various fittings over in the USofA?

03-12-2003, 10:10 AM	#48
pokpok Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: rsm,ca Posts: 87	http://becooling.safeshopper.com/29/cat29.htm?584 or here http://www.portagespecialty.com/custom/BrassHose.html

03-12-2003, 01:34 PM	#49
W1zzard Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Stuttgart, Germany Posts: 25	anybody know of a supplier for barbs/fittings in continental europe preferably germany? Last edited by W1zzard; 03-13-2003 at 05:26 AM.

03-13-2003, 05:21 AM	#50
MadDogMe Thermophile Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Just shut up ;) ... Posts: 1,068	The Thermaltake 1U P4 heatsink would make an excellent base if it was 'carefully' crosscut to pins instead of fins, MUCH more dense 'finage' surface area for cooling. Those pins look to far spaced to me . I'd have them a little lower as well, will heat travel all the way up them?, it'd boost H2o pressure if it was lower as well... With the pin base you have I'd drill loads of shallow holes in the surface as well to add to the turbulance/area... Booteful job as allways though Bladerunner!... PS, LINK to 1U P4 HSF @ theoverclockingstore.co.uk ... Volenti has posted some threads where he modded one for H2o use, they are an excellent base!...

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