Ever tried looking in a bus?

Danger-Darryn · 01-13-2003, 04:57 PM

GAWD!!!!!!! Another heatercore...............

...........but this time it looks like it's copper!!!

Just testing it on a NB Atlantis block in a closed loop (PUMP-BLOCK-RAD-PUMP) and looking for the distilled water to crap up (hopefully it wont discolour) and I'll leave it on for a few days with no additives.

It's out of a Leyland bus, 13 channels x 5 deep = 65 passes
The fin area is 7.5"x7.5"x2.5" and weighs a ton. Also the unit is pretty new too, just as well 'cos the bus was 25 years old! But is this a first? HC from a bus?

BTW, if it turns out to be any good, I'll try and get a few more and/or find the supplier. Does anyone else in the UK have such a problem finding copper HC's or is it just me?

Danger-Darryn · 01-13-2003, 04:59 PM

O, forgot the pic.

mfpmax · 01-13-2003, 05:16 PM

Sure would if I had Bus Yards that were easily accessable

Danger-Darryn · 01-13-2003, 05:29 PM

Well busses are a part of what I do in the yawning hours (9-5) but if you follow them (and try not to look like a spotter geek

) for long enough you will find their yard/garage. Around here, if you go to them after midnight and talk to the garage staff you'll be supprised what hey'll do for £10, but if your in the know

then freebees are good. Most of the old busses are getting scrapped all the time so happy picking.

O, if your lucky enough to get in a scrap one, they are sooooooo easy to get at (took me less than 2 mins), they are mounted on the floor under the seat, and have the blower and shroud removeable with just 2 bolts.

I had a look at the primary HC used to heat up the passenger areas and the measure up at around 3ft x 3ft x 4" with the barbs at 2in ID, a bit overkill for us me thinks.

Blackeagle · 01-13-2003, 06:39 PM

It looks to have a pretty high fin count per inch as well, that would also make for better cooling. Interesting how it doesn't have the folded fins that most cores have, but full width ones instead. Also looking at the bottom of the rad you can see how the tube rows are off-set to keep them all in the air flow. A neat design.

Be interesting to see how well it cools. You may have a real strong performer there, good luck to you with it.

Blackeagle · 01-13-2003, 07:02 PM

Anyone know how this sort of design compares in performance with the reguler heater core types?

mfpmax · 01-13-2003, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Danger-Darryn
Well busses are a part of what I do in the yawning hours (9-5) but if you follow them (and try not to look like a spotter geek ) for long enough you will find their yard/garage.

Our folks are kinda uptight about that, so any old busses get auctioned off.

MadDogMe · 01-14-2003, 04:13 AM

Sod the heatercore!, I want the D/D BUS!!!, man I'd love to live in a double decker bus, you could have a decent gravity shower and an upstairs bedroom

...

Do they scrap for the usual £1000 price?...

Danger-Darryn · 01-14-2003, 12:18 PM

Well, you'd better get to one before it's broken up for spares! Damm cheap ba$tards will keep running them things into the ground and all because they won't pay out £100,000 for a new 'un.

Anyway, back to the subject........the water hasn't discoloured after 24 hours of use (see above) it's absoluty clear, I have done a top flushing job on it. Can someone releve my stress and tell me it's not aluminum PLEASE!!!!!!

I'd hope to see some change in the water if it was after 1 day of running if it was.

edit/

Now I've got pictures of of an overclocker driving his LAN bus (nice name!!) looking like Cliff Richard singing.......

We're all going on a summer holiday.
No more working for a week or two.
Fun and laughter on a summer holiday.
No more worries for me and you.
For a week or two.........

Sad.

/edit

bigben2k · 01-14-2003, 12:27 PM

It's hard to tell... but if the tubing is copper, and the fins are copper... I think it safe to assume that the rest is copper too!

Scratch the paint off.

Nice find, m8!

How big is it, really?

Danger-Darryn · 01-14-2003, 12:50 PM

Don't know exactly (using the CD = 120mm method at the mo) but I'd say 250mm x 200mm or 10" x 9" approx. I don't want to scratch the paint off at all.

It came with a fan and shroud already mounted. Can't tell much by it other than it's made by Delanair, part# D201/387A serial# 0000003 (3rd one ever!!??) @ 24v

edit.

Just tested it at 12v, man is powerful. I haven't got my dB sound meter here but I'd say around 36-42dB, not bad for a dirty old fan in need of a strip down and rebuild.

bigben2k · 01-14-2003, 01:03 PM

Well, I'm not talking about a deep/wide scratch! Just enough to sample!

See pic.

Red: sampling point
Green: that's the tank, so it might be brass.

Danger-Darryn · 01-14-2003, 01:22 PM

Darn......looks silverish & shiny. Aluminum I guess :shrug: Water is still good though.

bigben2k · 01-14-2003, 01:25 PM

Could be stainless steel, but I doubt it's aluminium: these things are probably built to last.

Danger-Darryn · 01-14-2003, 01:28 PM

But is this (SS) good news or bad?

bigben2k · 01-14-2003, 01:43 PM

It would be good, certainly better than aluminium!

As for the performance, it's going to depend on the design: could be good, could be bad.:shrug: but given it's size, it should at the very least perform as well as a 6 by 7 heatercore.

Danger-Darryn · 01-14-2003, 01:49 PM

Well that would account for the weight, it's a hell of alot heavier than the other core I have here, probably x2, and it's only 1/3 the size.

bigben2k · 01-14-2003, 01:56 PM

'been googling again... It seems that the Delanair Engineering co was bought out by Valeo in 1989, a chinese outfit with a big office in France, it seems. It looks like it changed hands a few times, because VolksWagon might have owned it at one point.

The Ammanford (South Wales?) plant lost a big contract with Ford, 20 years ago, resulting in 200 layoffs.

Easy to find history, hard to find facts...

Danger-Darryn · 01-14-2003, 02:08 PM

Sorry, should have said.........been there, done that and came up with the same answer, Delanair Engineering are really pre-WWW. It's a "proper" fan though, designed to be stripped and cleaned. I'll give it a go tomorrow when I remember to pick up tools from work.

OT: Anyone tried ultrasonic cleaning for the WC bits, I have a small unit where I work for PCB cleaning. Great for those imposible to reach places & 100% non-damaging. Any thoughts???

Blackeagle · 01-14-2003, 05:23 PM

Hey BigBen,

Ever seen a core like that one is set up? Just to look at it I'm wondering if it would outperforme the normal cores. But most likly more expensive to make, thus we don't have them in cars.

Will be real interesting to see how it goes.

Danger-Darryn · 01-14-2003, 05:49 PM

How many paralell passes do other run of the mill rads have, ie. Chevey, BIX, etc....... 65 is alot IMO. I'll have this up and running soon, just waiting for some more bits to arrive from Jess. Problem is that I don't have anything to compare it to.

But yea, if it turns out to be any good I'll try and get some more. ( What the hell, I'll get some more anyway

)

bigben2k · 01-16-2003, 10:12 AM

I dunno!

The thickness of the stainless steel will be the biggest factor in this thing's performance.

The good thing is that given its size, you might be able to get away with:
a) a low coolant pressure drop
b) a slower(and quieter) fan.

Danger-Darryn · 01-16-2003, 12:23 PM

This comming weekend I'll try and find some more. What I want to do is find a scrap one to cut up and investigate what it's constructed from. I really would like to get one of these units to someone else for testing against other HC's and rads, 13mmID barbs are going to be soldered on soon instead of the 3/4" ID tubes.

Anyway, lets see if I can get anymore. If so, anyone interested in testing it in the UK? You arrange the delivery and it's yours.

edit.

It's been on test for over 60+ hours and still zero signs of discolouration in the water (distilled with no additives)

-Eheim-AtlantisCPU-RAD-
|_____________________|

01-13-2003, 05:16 PM	#3
mfpmax Cooling Savant Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Rockledge,FL,US Posts: 731	Sure would if I had Bus Yards that were easily accessable __________________ My old and retired watercooling setup. Watercooled K6-2 450 at 600 Also Retired - Watercooling an XP1800@1782MHz

01-13-2003, 05:29 PM	#4
Danger-Darryn Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Liverpool, UK Posts: 40	Well busses are a part of what I do in the yawning hours (9-5) but if you follow them (and try not to look like a spotter geek ) for long enough you will find their yard/garage. Around here, if you go to them after midnight and talk to the garage staff you'll be supprised what hey'll do for £10, but if your in the know then freebees are good. Most of the old busses are getting scrapped all the time so happy picking. O, if your lucky enough to get in a scrap one, they are sooooooo easy to get at (took me less than 2 mins), they are mounted on the floor under the seat, and have the blower and shroud removeable with just 2 bolts. I had a look at the primary HC used to heat up the passenger areas and the measure up at around 3ft x 3ft x 4" with the barbs at 2in ID, a bit overkill for us me thinks. __________________ P4 1.8a @ 2888MHz 1.85v CPU Load/Idle 55/36oC 256meg PC2100 (generic crap) 2.5-5-3-2 2.65v Abit BE7 RAID (R.I.P BD7-II) CPU:MEM 1:1 160MHz Cheapo Coolmaster HSF Full Atlantis system under construction

01-13-2003, 06:39 PM	#5
Blackeagle Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: U.S.A = Michigan Posts: 1,243	It looks to have a pretty high fin count per inch as well, that would also make for better cooling. Interesting how it doesn't have the folded fins that most cores have, but full width ones instead. Also looking at the bottom of the rad you can see how the tube rows are off-set to keep them all in the air flow. A neat design. Be interesting to see how well it cools. You may have a real strong performer there, good luck to you with it. Last edited by Blackeagle; 01-13-2003 at 06:48 PM.

01-14-2003, 12:18 PM	#9
Danger-Darryn Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Liverpool, UK Posts: 40	Well, you'd better get to one before it's broken up for spares! Damm cheap ba$tards will keep running them things into the ground and all because they won't pay out £100,000 for a new 'un. Anyway, back to the subject........the water hasn't discoloured after 24 hours of use (see above) it's absoluty clear, I have done a top flushing job on it. Can someone releve my stress and tell me it's not aluminum PLEASE!!!!!! I'd hope to see some change in the water if it was after 1 day of running if it was. edit/ Now I've got pictures of of an overclocker driving his LAN bus (nice name!!) looking like Cliff Richard singing....... We're all going on a summer holiday. No more working for a week or two. Fun and laughter on a summer holiday. No more worries for me and you. For a week or two......... Sad. /edit __________________ P4 1.8a @ 2888MHz 1.85v CPU Load/Idle 55/36oC 256meg PC2100 (generic crap) 2.5-5-3-2 2.65v Abit BE7 RAID (R.I.P BD7-II) CPU:MEM 1:1 160MHz Cheapo Coolmaster HSF Full Atlantis system under construction

01-14-2003, 12:27 PM	#10
bigben2k Responsible for 2% of all the posts here. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas, U.S.A. Posts: 8,302	It's hard to tell... but if the tubing is copper, and the fins are copper... I think it safe to assume that the rest is copper too! Scratch the paint off. Nice find, m8! How big is it, really? __________________ WBTA (Water Block Testing Alliance) Nordic Hardware WC 101

01-13-2003, 07:02 PM	#6
Blackeagle Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: U.S.A = Michigan Posts: 1,243	Anyone know how this sort of design compares in performance with the reguler heater core types?

01-14-2003, 04:13 AM	#8
MadDogMe Thermophile Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Just shut up ;) ... Posts: 1,068	Sod the heatercore!, I want the D/D BUS!!!, man I'd love to live in a double decker bus, you could have a decent gravity shower and an upstairs bedroom ... Do they scrap for the usual £1000 price?...

01-14-2003, 01:22 PM	#13
Danger-Darryn Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Liverpool, UK Posts: 40	Darn......looks silverish & shiny. Aluminum I guess :shrug: Water is still good though. __________________ P4 1.8a @ 2888MHz 1.85v CPU Load/Idle 55/36oC 256meg PC2100 (generic crap) 2.5-5-3-2 2.65v Abit BE7 RAID (R.I.P BD7-II) CPU:MEM 1:1 160MHz Cheapo Coolmaster HSF Full Atlantis system under construction

01-14-2003, 01:25 PM	#14
bigben2k Responsible for 2% of all the posts here. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas, U.S.A. Posts: 8,302	Could be stainless steel, but I doubt it's aluminium: these things are probably built to last. __________________ WBTA (Water Block Testing Alliance) Nordic Hardware WC 101

01-14-2003, 01:28 PM	#15
Danger-Darryn Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Liverpool, UK Posts: 40	But is this (SS) good news or bad? __________________ P4 1.8a @ 2888MHz 1.85v CPU Load/Idle 55/36oC 256meg PC2100 (generic crap) 2.5-5-3-2 2.65v Abit BE7 RAID (R.I.P BD7-II) CPU:MEM 1:1 160MHz Cheapo Coolmaster HSF Full Atlantis system under construction

01-14-2003, 01:43 PM	#16
bigben2k Responsible for 2% of all the posts here. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas, U.S.A. Posts: 8,302	It would be good, certainly better than aluminium! As for the performance, it's going to depend on the design: could be good, could be bad.:shrug: but given it's size, it should at the very least perform as well as a 6 by 7 heatercore. __________________ WBTA (Water Block Testing Alliance) Nordic Hardware WC 101

01-14-2003, 01:49 PM	#17
Danger-Darryn Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Liverpool, UK Posts: 40	Well that would account for the weight, it's a hell of alot heavier than the other core I have here, probably x2, and it's only 1/3 the size. __________________ P4 1.8a @ 2888MHz 1.85v CPU Load/Idle 55/36oC 256meg PC2100 (generic crap) 2.5-5-3-2 2.65v Abit BE7 RAID (R.I.P BD7-II) CPU:MEM 1:1 160MHz Cheapo Coolmaster HSF Full Atlantis system under construction

01-14-2003, 01:56 PM	#18
bigben2k Responsible for 2% of all the posts here. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas, U.S.A. Posts: 8,302	'been googling again... It seems that the Delanair Engineering co was bought out by Valeo in 1989, a chinese outfit with a big office in France, it seems. It looks like it changed hands a few times, because VolksWagon might have owned it at one point. The Ammanford (South Wales?) plant lost a big contract with Ford, 20 years ago, resulting in 200 layoffs. Easy to find history, hard to find facts... __________________ WBTA (Water Block Testing Alliance) Nordic Hardware WC 101

01-14-2003, 02:08 PM	#19
Danger-Darryn Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Liverpool, UK Posts: 40	Sorry, should have said.........been there, done that and came up with the same answer, Delanair Engineering are really pre-WWW. It's a "proper" fan though, designed to be stripped and cleaned. I'll give it a go tomorrow when I remember to pick up tools from work. OT: Anyone tried ultrasonic cleaning for the WC bits, I have a small unit where I work for PCB cleaning. Great for those imposible to reach places & 100% non-damaging. Any thoughts??? __________________ P4 1.8a @ 2888MHz 1.85v CPU Load/Idle 55/36oC 256meg PC2100 (generic crap) 2.5-5-3-2 2.65v Abit BE7 RAID (R.I.P BD7-II) CPU:MEM 1:1 160MHz Cheapo Coolmaster HSF Full Atlantis system under construction

01-14-2003, 05:23 PM	#20
Blackeagle Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: U.S.A = Michigan Posts: 1,243	Hey BigBen, Ever seen a core like that one is set up? Just to look at it I'm wondering if it would outperforme the normal cores. But most likly more expensive to make, thus we don't have them in cars. Will be real interesting to see how it goes.

01-14-2003, 05:49 PM	#21
Danger-Darryn Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Liverpool, UK Posts: 40	How many paralell passes do other run of the mill rads have, ie. Chevey, BIX, etc....... 65 is alot IMO. I'll have this up and running soon, just waiting for some more bits to arrive from Jess. Problem is that I don't have anything to compare it to. But yea, if it turns out to be any good I'll try and get some more. ( What the hell, I'll get some more anyway ) __________________ P4 1.8a @ 2888MHz 1.85v CPU Load/Idle 55/36oC 256meg PC2100 (generic crap) 2.5-5-3-2 2.65v Abit BE7 RAID (R.I.P BD7-II) CPU:MEM 1:1 160MHz Cheapo Coolmaster HSF Full Atlantis system under construction

01-16-2003, 10:12 AM	#22
bigben2k Responsible for 2% of all the posts here. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas, U.S.A. Posts: 8,302	I dunno! The thickness of the stainless steel will be the biggest factor in this thing's performance. The good thing is that given its size, you might be able to get away with: a) a low coolant pressure drop b) a slower(and quieter) fan. __________________ WBTA (Water Block Testing Alliance) Nordic Hardware WC 101

01-16-2003, 12:23 PM	#23
Danger-Darryn Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Liverpool, UK Posts: 40	This comming weekend I'll try and find some more. What I want to do is find a scrap one to cut up and investigate what it's constructed from. I really would like to get one of these units to someone else for testing against other HC's and rads, 13mmID barbs are going to be soldered on soon instead of the 3/4" ID tubes. Anyway, lets see if I can get anymore. If so, anyone interested in testing it in the UK? You arrange the delivery and it's yours. edit. It's been on test for over 60+ hours and still zero signs of discolouration in the water (distilled with no additives) -Eheim-AtlantisCPU-RAD- \|_____________________\| __________________ P4 1.8a @ 2888MHz 1.85v CPU Load/Idle 55/36oC 256meg PC2100 (generic crap) 2.5-5-3-2 2.65v Abit BE7 RAID (R.I.P BD7-II) CPU:MEM 1:1 160MHz Cheapo Coolmaster HSF Full Atlantis system under construction

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