Newbie with a system plan but requesting input

[SlipoftheKnife]

Ok so I'm new to liquid cooling but have read loads of information about it. I'm in the middle of building a gaming machine.

A8N32-SLI
AMD Opteron 180
ATI HD 3870 w/ 512 starting off with one but eventually going dual
4 gig PC3200
360gig Seagate SATA HDD 32mb buffer

I'm going with a D-Tek Fuzion waterblock 1/2" barbs. I was going to get a chipset waterblock thinking of both north bridge and a south bridge, overkill? On crazypc's website I noticed a nozzle kit for the waterblock, does this really help or not really? Keep in mind this was going to be an overtime build starting with the essentials first. For my GPU's I was going to go with the Swiftech MCW60-R waterblocks buying them as I purchase each video card. Do they make memory waterblocks for the ATI HD 3870? Next on the list is a Aquabay M4 HDD Waterblock for the hard drive, again is this worth getting or an unecessary purchase? After that is the Thermaltake Aqua RX Series-R1 Memory Liquid Cooling Heatsink eventually 4 for each stick of memory. As for the pump I was thinking the Swiftech MCP655 and a Thermaltake AquaBay M3 for the reservoir. Any input on reservoirs? Does it really matter which kind you use? Should I run two loops or even three for all the cooling blocks? Any ideas on how to set this system up? Anything I should take out that is not really needed or not going to help me that much? Thank you for all your help

[billbartuska]

Originally Posted by SlipoftheKnife

A8N32-SLI
ATI HD 3870 w/ 512 starting off with one but eventually going dual

4 gig PC3200

I'm going with a D-Tek Fuzion waterblock 1/2" barbs.

Check the compatibility of that video card with that motherboard...I don't think they work together, though the card mfgrs may have come up with a patch. Besides, there are very few motherboards that support ATI cards in Crossfire on an AMD platform, nor any ATI cards run in SLI on any motherboard.

With 4 gigs of memory you'll have to run a 64 bit O/S. You'll also have to underclock the memory in order to get 4 sticks to run. Other than video rendering or editing very large photos, there no practical reason to use 4 gigs of memory. No programs/games will use more than 2 gigs. With Vista x64 and a multi core CPU, you may see some improvements in multitasking, but that's about it. Software and O/Ss just are not sophisticated enough to manage multi cores effectively yet.

Yes, the nozzles will help.
The D-tec Fuzion works better with multi core CPUs. But a better choice (in order) would be:
1.) Original Storm
2.) Original Swiftech Storm
3.) Later Swiftech Apogee (a modification of the Swiftech Storm)
4.) Swiftech Apogee GT



No need to W/C the NB/SB/memory/HDDs.
For video card cooling do not get a "full coverage" (i. e. GPU and memory) block. That locks you into a specific card. Use something like an MCW60 and ram sinks. Then you can move the block to a new card.

That's a good pump.

Use a T-line instead of a rez. Yeah, bleeding will take longer, but you only do it once. It's a good idea to add a drain line too.

Go here, read this:
http://www.over-clock.com/ivb/index.php?showtopic=20277

Then go here, read the thread and download the spreadsheet:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=151627

Read these:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...ad.php?t=77260
http://translate.google.com/translat...hl=en&ie=UTF-8
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=178575

....how's that ben333? add anything?

[jman1310]

stay away from anything aluminum
use distilled water
use an additive (antifreeze will do fine) 5 to 10%
don't use non conductive solutions - they cost more and are less effective than water
and use 3/8 hose - the performance difference between the 2 is minimal about 1 degree according to Cather

[jman1310]

i think i should document where the 3/8 statement comes from

so read this

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by jman1310

i think i should document where the 3/8 statement comes from

so read this

That is all well and good for a single water block, but if he adds 1CPU, 1GPU, 1 hard Drive, and however more blocks then that 1/8" more opening gets more and more important.

[ben333]

Originally Posted by billbartuska

....how's that ben333? add anything?

Well bill, I agree that he really has no need to water cool the south bridge, memory or hard drive, etc. But the north bridge is a maybe if he plans some serious over clocking. Slip of the knife, a good way to cool things like ram and hard drives is using quiet fans to blow over them. It helps a lot. Also about t lines, I myself hate them but they do save space and improve flow. I usually use a 1" PVC T and then get three 1" to 1/2" threaded adapters. After that I just get two 1/2" barbs and a 1/2 inch cap. This gives you a compact res with very little flow loss. About the ram 4 gigs is not a bad idea when using a 64 bit OS but with a 32 bit OS is silly because the OS can only see 4 gigs and usually shows up as less (because the video card has ram and you can only have a grand total of 4 GB including video cards (I think)) Thats about it except the computer hardware you've chosen. I think that for most people Intel is a better choice. Especially for the over clocker / gamer. And as bill said, you can not run crossfire on a SLI board. Also I notice you are getting a 320 GB hard drive. Thats fine but I just wanted to let you know that 400 I think it is is the best buy for the money right now (more GB for your dollar)

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by ben333

About the ram 4 gigs is not a bad idea when using a 64 bit OS but with a 32 bit OS is silly because the OS can only see 4 gigs and usually shows up as less (because the video card has ram and you can only have a grand total of 4 GB including video cards (I think)) Thats about it except the computer hardware you've chosen.

This article explains why the 4gig question. http://blogs.msdn.com/hiltonl/archiv...m-problem.aspx

[jman1310]

Originally Posted by jaydee

That is all well and good for a single water block, but if he adds 1CPU, 1GPU, 1 hard Drive, and however more blocks then that 1/8" more opening gets more and more important.

keep reading - in a couple of pages Cather tests with cpu and gpu blocks
posts 83, 87, & 99
~1.5 degree and 280 watts of heat dump

we have suggested not using watercooling for the other components
HD cooling w/ water is just bling anyway
i agree w/ ben333 about the NB - it's a maybe, depending MB and OCing

[SlipoftheKnife]

I was thinking of getting a Swiftech MCR220-QP-RES for my radiator. Is a two fan radiator good enough for a loop with a CPU and two GPU's? Opteron 180 and 2 GeForce 8800GTS?

[ben333]

You could probably do it but if you really want to benefit from water cooling I suggest using at least two 2x120mm radiators or a 3x120mm. Remember, even just those three things is still a lot of heat.

[SlipoftheKnife]

the Swiftech MCR220-QP-RES is a radiator with a reservoir built in and holds two 120mm fans. I was wondering if the built in reservoir is a good idea. I know three 120mm fans would be better but is two enough?

[ben333]

yeah, thats fine if you want to use the res but think about it, those three parts together and overclocked probably put out about 300-400 watts of heat. (A guess but probably close) For the extra $35 you really should consider getting another 220 or bumping your current 220 to a 320.

[SlipoftheKnife]

I've decided on going with a MCRES-Micro reservoir or would the Danger Den 5.25 Inch Bay Reservoir be a better choice? I noticed on the Danger Den res that there are two inlets and was wondering if that helps over the MCRES-Micro with only one inlet? If I did use the Danger Den reservoir would I hook up the CPU to one inlet and then Y connect the two GPU's into one line and hook up to the other inlet? Thank you

[jman1310]

I made my own reservoir because the commercial reservoirs were lacking. I don't like lexon (Plexiglas) because it prone to cracking. Others use aluminum, which anodized or not is a big no no. There are some quality units but they are expensive. Mine is a 18" of 1.5" copper tubing with an elbow at the bottom. My pump attaches at the bottom and the system return is about 3" from the top. Filling is done at the top. I also installed a drain cock at the bottom. I would have liked to use 2" copper but didn't do to cost. You could make a similar unit with PVC very easily. ABS may look better because it's black rather than white.

A reservoir should do 3 things:

1. Most commercial reservoirs are poorly located to be worth while. A res is best located directly at the pump inlet. This ensures there is always positive pressure on the pump. Since we use centrifugal pumps that can not suck water (they only push) this is good for pump life.

2. The res is to small. It must widen the water path enough that water velocity slows considerablely. Slowing the fluid velocity allows bubbles to rise to the surface and promotes bubbles to come out of suspension.

3. Reserve volume. In the ideal reservoir, extra cooling fluid is stored to prevent dry running the pump. This is nice both during initial setup and after long term use. The tubing used in water cooling is not water proof. Ie, very small amounts of fluid are lost via evaporation directly through the tubing. This varies depending on tubing quality, but if you run six months or a year without maintenance it becomes noticeable.

[billbartuska]

Originally Posted by SlipoftheKnife

If I did use the Danger Den reservoir would I hook up the CPU to one inlet and then Y connect the two GPU's into one line and hook up to the other inlet? Thank you

How about posting a sketch. It's kind of hard to visualize what you're talking about "two GPU's into one line...".

[ben333]

Like...

...|
../\
1 2
.| |
..Y
..|
[RES]
..|
..|

1 and 2 being the GPUs?

[SlipoftheKnife]

yes exactly

[ben333]

I've seen it done... it must kill flow a bit but not sure what the pros and cons really are.

[billbartuska]

Due to the lower flow resistance through the rads, parallel rads will give you increaced flow throughout the loop, but just half the flow through each rad.

The higher flow rate through each rad in a series configuration more than compensates to the slight increace in overall flow rate with parallel rads.

The laminar flow areas inside the rad are reduced with higher flow rates.

As for 2 in/1 out - vs - 1 in/1 out with a rez, it really isn't going to affect flow rate enough to make a difference.

[ben333]

Bill I think he was saying he wanted to split the line into the video cards and then back into itself.

[billbartuska]

Originally Posted by ben333

Bill I think he was saying he wanted to split the line into the video cards and then back into itself.

The answer is still series, for the same reasons.

[SlipoftheKnife]

Okay so I'm back from a lull of laziness and with some questions again. I have included pics to help clear things up. First I'm still waiting for plastic hose clamps, a Thermaltake Flow Tx Plus CL-WO138, a set of anti-kink coils, and a flush mount fillport.

First question is what do you think of my reservoir? There is going to be a T at the bottom for an inline draincock to go.

I have also bought an inline fuel filter from NAPA and
thinking about putting it in. Do you think that is good? Bad? There are two sets of pics showing the filter in two different locations. Which do you think would be better or should it maybe go somewhere else?

Here's the pic for the first postion of the filter: http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f3...os1wRad1-1.jpg

Here's the link for the second position of the filter: http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f3...ePos2wRad1.jpg

When I get the Thermaltake flowmeter I was planning on putting it bettwen the output of the last GPU, in the series, and the reservoir. The reason for that would be to know the temp of the loop after it has collected all the heat. I would also like to know the temp of the loop after the radiator to see how cool everything is. Is there a better way, keeping in mind price, to have a flow meter and two inline thermometers?

The connection between the two GPU's is pretty tight so I was thinking of using anti-kinks coils for that and then saw that someone else used copper elbows to make the bend. Which do you think would be better? I'm using 1/2" ID Tygon tubing with a 3/4" OD


Okay that is it, and by the way... PUP DEMANDS ANSWERS!!!!!

[billbartuska]

Originally Posted by SlipoftheKnife

I have also bought an inline fuel filter from NAPA and
thinking about putting it in. Do you think that is good? Bad?

The connection between the two GPU's is pretty tight so I was thinking of using anti-kinks coils for that and then saw that someone else used copper elbows to make the bend. Which do you think would be better? I'm using 1/2" ID Tygon tubing with a 3/4" OD

Pup already knows. Just ask!

[SlipoftheKnife]

bumpity bump