Which heater core do I buy?!!!? so many choices... - Page 3

ablaze · 04-06-2002, 02:12 PM

haha..oh yeah. i guess if we were observant enough we would've noticed that the ATX panel had the ps/2 ports at the BOTTOM instead of the top..lol

edit: oh wait. EVERYTHING in the background is upside down too! haha..what dumbasses we are

Jim · 04-06-2002, 02:15 PM

Here so you guys don't get dizzy:

Jim

Jim · 04-06-2002, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ablaze
haha..oh yeah. i guess if we were observant enough we would've noticed that the ATX panel had the ps/2 ports at the BOTTOM instead of the top..lol

edit: oh wait. EVERYTHING in the background is upside down too! haha..what dumbasses we are

No your not.

I just wanted to get the info out here as quickly as possible. Still can't figure out why the image was chopped.

Jim

ECUPirate · 04-06-2002, 02:31 PM

Here's a question... with a rad that big sitting outside your case, do you even NEED fans? & are you using fans anyway?

How warm is the air coming off of a radiator anyway? My knowledge of physics tells me that the same amount of heat must be dissipated regardless of the method used, but it takes a lot more energy to heat up water than air.
So, air coming off of a HSF should be much much warmer that air from a big rad. It should take longer for the water in the system to heat up, thus giving a passive radiator lots more time to dissipate the small heat difference. Me thinks a passive radiator inside a reasonably well ventilated case would be adequate for most systems.
Your criticism please?

EMC2 · 04-06-2002, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Here so you guys don't get dizzy

Jim - too late for that

LOL

Quote:

Heat rises

Ecu - touche'

Regarding the need for fans on a radiator - the same amount of heat can be removed up to a limit, but the issue is at what temperature this occurs at (thermal equilibrium point). So it depends on the amount of power (thermal energy) you have and how high of a temperature rise you can tolerate in your water.

To get an idea - take a read through this article and look at what air flow rates do to the heat handling capacities of the rads. The Big Momma is a heater core, so you can use it as a point of reference.

EMC2 · 04-06-2002, 03:09 PM

BTW Jim - a silly, serious question (now there is an oxymoron) - why didn't you just clip the top of the pic off? (oh, and glad you got a laugh out of me zanyness

)

If you don't already have it, grab IrfanView for doing quick and easy pic conversion/clipping/rotation/etc.

It's freeware and very good for that sort of thing.

Brad · 04-06-2002, 03:27 PM

heh, it looks much better now Jim.

why not just run 2x 69cfm 120mm panaflo's on it, you'll never hear them

ECUPirate · 04-06-2002, 03:29 PM

Yeah, that's plan B. 2 of those w/ 7/off/12v switch.
Plan A is the comair patriot @ 12v... still wondering how noisy that will be. Maybe I can crank it down to a lower voltage..

mkosem · 04-06-2002, 03:37 PM

patriot is extremely loud at 24v, it is tolerable at 12v tho

--Matt

ECUPirate · 04-06-2002, 03:39 PM

Define tolerable, in relation to Panaflo fans. L1A, M1A, or H1A...?

How is the patriot at lower voltages, and is that even possible?

Jim · 04-06-2002, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brad
heh, it looks much better now Jim.

why not just run 2x 69cfm 120mm panaflo's on it, you'll never hear them

Like this?

These are 86 cfm panaflos, running at 7 volts. They are quiet.
What I need now is a 333 board, and a taller case so I can get it indoors!
Still haven't had time to build my little variable speed LM317 circuit thing. I am going to use the LM350 because the amperage would be too high for the Lm317. No time, always reading on the Forums!
Jim

ECUPirate · 04-06-2002, 03:44 PM

hehe.. check it out... 69 posts..

Brad · 04-06-2002, 03:58 PM

now thats really mature

ECUPirate · 04-06-2002, 04:00 PM

Hey... that's funny... to me. Afterall, I'm only twelve..

Well, I feel twelve sometimes....

mkosem · 04-06-2002, 11:58 PM

I felt 12 once. my patriot @ 12v was about as loud as the pair of panaflow h1a's running in series(math makes 6v each) that it replaced.

--Matt

I feel 12 sometimes too

Brad · 04-07-2002, 04:02 AM

hmm, that isn't too loud at all then.

I felt 12 when I was 12. Interestingly, when I was 13 I didn't feel 12

ECUPirate · 04-07-2002, 01:07 PM

hehe.. Ok, here's a 12 yr. old question for ya...
We've discussed all manner of slowing fans down... switches, rheos... etc. Series. How does that work? got a diagram? let me guess: 12v lead from PSU to Hot line Fan1, then do you take the ground wire from Fan1 and connect to Hot line Fan2, and then ground Fan2 to PSU? & that would give 6v to each fan?
Discuss that vs. parallel. (sp?)

Cougar2k · 04-07-2002, 01:22 PM

In a series circuit, the volts are variable, and amps constant

In a parallel circuit, it's the opposite, volts constant, and amps variable. In a parallel circuit, each resistance unit will cut the total voltage in the circuit according to how strong the resistor/device is. Parallel circuits are notorious for blowing things up, because when you decrease the voltage, the amperage goes up, and that blows stuff up.

ECUPirate · 04-07-2002, 01:24 PM

Would you mind giving a couple of examples w/ numbers?

Cougar2k · 04-07-2002, 01:27 PM

Edit: Hell, I forgot how to use ohm's law right, the explanation I gave you is about as good as I can give, search google or something :shrug:

EMC2 · 04-07-2002, 03:08 PM

Pirate - go look at this thread, last pages. In it you'll find that which you seek

ECUPirate · 04-07-2002, 03:26 PM

emc2... that pertains to flow rates... i'd read it before.
I'm confused about series vs. parallel electrical ciruits.

EMC2 · 04-07-2002, 03:39 PM

Pirate - the last several sheets of that are electronics - has series and parallel circuits - shows Ohm's law, uses Kirshoff's law, and how to calculate both current and voltage in series and parallel circuits

ECUPirate · 04-07-2002, 03:44 PM

I think you posted the wrong link.... there's only two pages there, and none pertain to electronics.

EMC2 · 04-07-2002, 03:51 PM

Nope, right link

Look at "Part 4 of 6" and "Part 5 of 6" (they are PNG images).... with Part 5 of 6 strictly in the realm of electronics (but the concepts in 4 of 6 are applicable too).

04-06-2002, 02:31 PM	#54
ECUPirate Hottest Stank of them All Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington, DC area Posts: 533	Here's a question... with a rad that big sitting outside your case, do you even NEED fans? & are you using fans anyway? How warm is the air coming off of a radiator anyway? My knowledge of physics tells me that the same amount of heat must be dissipated regardless of the method used, but it takes a lot more energy to heat up water than air. So, air coming off of a HSF should be much much warmer that air from a big rad. It should take longer for the water in the system to heat up, thus giving a passive radiator lots more time to dissipate the small heat difference. Me thinks a passive radiator inside a reasonably well ventilated case would be adequate for most systems. Your criticism please? __________________ Does a radioactive cat have 18 half lifes? --Kenny my pimpin' rig: ...previously poorly cooled... 486DX-2 66mhz @ 75mhz, 4Mb ram, shared, 256Mb hard drive Onboard VGA, watercooled, of course 16-color monitor, labtec speakers, 28kbs USRobotics modem Windows XP (think about it) Maze 3, DDen GF3 block, Eheim 1250, econoline van HC, 1/2" hose w/ 5/8" fittings Comair 172mm fan

04-06-2002, 03:27 PM	#57
Brad Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nuu Zeeelin Posts: 3,175	heh, it looks much better now Jim. why not just run 2x 69cfm 120mm panaflo's on it, you'll never hear them __________________ 2x P3 1100's at 1400, Abit VP6, 2x Corsair 256mb PC150 sticks, 20gb 'cuda ATA-III, 2x 40gb 'cuda ATA-IV in raid 0. 20" Trinitron. No fans 2x 2400+ at 2288mhz (16.0 x 143), Iwill MPX2, 2x Kingmax PC-3200 256mb sticks, 4x 20gb 60gxp in Raid 5 on a Promise SX6000. Asus Ti4200 320/630. Cooled by Water

04-06-2002, 03:29 PM	#58
ECUPirate Hottest Stank of them All Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington, DC area Posts: 533	Yeah, that's plan B. 2 of those w/ 7/off/12v switch. Plan A is the comair patriot @ 12v... still wondering how noisy that will be. Maybe I can crank it down to a lower voltage.. __________________ Does a radioactive cat have 18 half lifes? --Kenny my pimpin' rig: ...previously poorly cooled... 486DX-2 66mhz @ 75mhz, 4Mb ram, shared, 256Mb hard drive Onboard VGA, watercooled, of course 16-color monitor, labtec speakers, 28kbs USRobotics modem Windows XP (think about it) Maze 3, DDen GF3 block, Eheim 1250, econoline van HC, 1/2" hose w/ 5/8" fittings Comair 172mm fan

04-06-2002, 03:37 PM	#59
mkosem Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2001 Location: here Posts: 494	patriot is extremely loud at 24v, it is tolerable at 12v tho --Matt __________________ If you can't cool it, blow it up!! http://www.mattkosem.com

04-06-2002, 03:39 PM	#60
ECUPirate Hottest Stank of them All Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington, DC area Posts: 533	Define tolerable, in relation to Panaflo fans. L1A, M1A, or H1A...? How is the patriot at lower voltages, and is that even possible? __________________ Does a radioactive cat have 18 half lifes? --Kenny my pimpin' rig: ...previously poorly cooled... 486DX-2 66mhz @ 75mhz, 4Mb ram, shared, 256Mb hard drive Onboard VGA, watercooled, of course 16-color monitor, labtec speakers, 28kbs USRobotics modem Windows XP (think about it) Maze 3, DDen GF3 block, Eheim 1250, econoline van HC, 1/2" hose w/ 5/8" fittings Comair 172mm fan

04-06-2002, 02:12 PM	#51
ablaze Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Singapore! Posts: 124	haha..oh yeah. i guess if we were observant enough we would've noticed that the ATX panel had the ps/2 ports at the BOTTOM instead of the top..lol edit: oh wait. EVERYTHING in the background is upside down too! haha..what dumbasses we are

04-06-2002, 02:15 PM	#52
Jim Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Illinois Posts: 389	Here so you guys don't get dizzy: Jim

04-06-2002, 03:09 PM	#56
EMC2 Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dark Side of the Moon Posts: 365	BTW Jim - a silly, serious question (now there is an oxymoron) - why didn't you just clip the top of the pic off? (oh, and glad you got a laugh out of me zanyness ) If you don't already have it, grab IrfanView for doing quick and easy pic conversion/clipping/rotation/etc. It's freeware and very good for that sort of thing.

04-06-2002, 03:58 PM	#63
Brad Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nuu Zeeelin Posts: 3,175	now thats really mature __________________ 2x P3 1100's at 1400, Abit VP6, 2x Corsair 256mb PC150 sticks, 20gb 'cuda ATA-III, 2x 40gb 'cuda ATA-IV in raid 0. 20" Trinitron. No fans 2x 2400+ at 2288mhz (16.0 x 143), Iwill MPX2, 2x Kingmax PC-3200 256mb sticks, 4x 20gb 60gxp in Raid 5 on a Promise SX6000. Asus Ti4200 320/630. Cooled by Water

04-06-2002, 04:00 PM	#64
ECUPirate Hottest Stank of them All Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington, DC area Posts: 533	Hey... that's funny... to me. Afterall, I'm only twelve.. Well, I feel twelve sometimes.... __________________ Does a radioactive cat have 18 half lifes? --Kenny my pimpin' rig: ...previously poorly cooled... 486DX-2 66mhz @ 75mhz, 4Mb ram, shared, 256Mb hard drive Onboard VGA, watercooled, of course 16-color monitor, labtec speakers, 28kbs USRobotics modem Windows XP (think about it) Maze 3, DDen GF3 block, Eheim 1250, econoline van HC, 1/2" hose w/ 5/8" fittings Comair 172mm fan

04-06-2002, 11:58 PM	#65
mkosem Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2001 Location: here Posts: 494	I felt 12 once. my patriot @ 12v was about as loud as the pair of panaflow h1a's running in series(math makes 6v each) that it replaced. --Matt I feel 12 sometimes too __________________ If you can't cool it, blow it up!! http://www.mattkosem.com

04-07-2002, 04:02 AM	#66
Brad Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nuu Zeeelin Posts: 3,175	hmm, that isn't too loud at all then. I felt 12 when I was 12. Interestingly, when I was 13 I didn't feel 12 __________________ 2x P3 1100's at 1400, Abit VP6, 2x Corsair 256mb PC150 sticks, 20gb 'cuda ATA-III, 2x 40gb 'cuda ATA-IV in raid 0. 20" Trinitron. No fans 2x 2400+ at 2288mhz (16.0 x 143), Iwill MPX2, 2x Kingmax PC-3200 256mb sticks, 4x 20gb 60gxp in Raid 5 on a Promise SX6000. Asus Ti4200 320/630. Cooled by Water

04-07-2002, 01:07 PM	#67
ECUPirate Hottest Stank of them All Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington, DC area Posts: 533	hehe.. Ok, here's a 12 yr. old question for ya... We've discussed all manner of slowing fans down... switches, rheos... etc. Series. How does that work? got a diagram? let me guess: 12v lead from PSU to Hot line Fan1, then do you take the ground wire from Fan1 and connect to Hot line Fan2, and then ground Fan2 to PSU? & that would give 6v to each fan? Discuss that vs. parallel. (sp?) __________________ Does a radioactive cat have 18 half lifes? --Kenny my pimpin' rig: ...previously poorly cooled... 486DX-2 66mhz @ 75mhz, 4Mb ram, shared, 256Mb hard drive Onboard VGA, watercooled, of course 16-color monitor, labtec speakers, 28kbs USRobotics modem Windows XP (think about it) Maze 3, DDen GF3 block, Eheim 1250, econoline van HC, 1/2" hose w/ 5/8" fittings Comair 172mm fan

04-07-2002, 01:22 PM	#68
Cougar2k Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 2	In a series circuit, the volts are variable, and amps constant In a parallel circuit, it's the opposite, volts constant, and amps variable. In a parallel circuit, each resistance unit will cut the total voltage in the circuit according to how strong the resistor/device is. Parallel circuits are notorious for blowing things up, because when you decrease the voltage, the amperage goes up, and that blows stuff up.

04-07-2002, 01:24 PM	#69
ECUPirate Hottest Stank of them All Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington, DC area Posts: 533	Would you mind giving a couple of examples w/ numbers? __________________ Does a radioactive cat have 18 half lifes? --Kenny my pimpin' rig: ...previously poorly cooled... 486DX-2 66mhz @ 75mhz, 4Mb ram, shared, 256Mb hard drive Onboard VGA, watercooled, of course 16-color monitor, labtec speakers, 28kbs USRobotics modem Windows XP (think about it) Maze 3, DDen GF3 block, Eheim 1250, econoline van HC, 1/2" hose w/ 5/8" fittings Comair 172mm fan

04-07-2002, 01:27 PM	#70
Cougar2k Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 2	Edit: Hell, I forgot how to use ohm's law right, the explanation I gave you is about as good as I can give, search google or something :shrug: Last edited by Cougar2k; 04-07-2002 at 02:00 PM.

04-07-2002, 03:08 PM	#71
EMC2 Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dark Side of the Moon Posts: 365	Pirate - go look at this thread, last pages. In it you'll find that which you seek

04-07-2002, 03:26 PM	#72
ECUPirate Hottest Stank of them All Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington, DC area Posts: 533	emc2... that pertains to flow rates... i'd read it before. I'm confused about series vs. parallel electrical ciruits. __________________ Does a radioactive cat have 18 half lifes? --Kenny my pimpin' rig: ...previously poorly cooled... 486DX-2 66mhz @ 75mhz, 4Mb ram, shared, 256Mb hard drive Onboard VGA, watercooled, of course 16-color monitor, labtec speakers, 28kbs USRobotics modem Windows XP (think about it) Maze 3, DDen GF3 block, Eheim 1250, econoline van HC, 1/2" hose w/ 5/8" fittings Comair 172mm fan

04-07-2002, 03:39 PM	#73
EMC2 Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dark Side of the Moon Posts: 365	Pirate - the last several sheets of that are electronics - has series and parallel circuits - shows Ohm's law, uses Kirshoff's law, and how to calculate both current and voltage in series and parallel circuits

04-07-2002, 03:44 PM	#74
ECUPirate Hottest Stank of them All Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Washington, DC area Posts: 533	I think you posted the wrong link.... there's only two pages there, and none pertain to electronics. __________________ Does a radioactive cat have 18 half lifes? --Kenny my pimpin' rig: ...previously poorly cooled... 486DX-2 66mhz @ 75mhz, 4Mb ram, shared, 256Mb hard drive Onboard VGA, watercooled, of course 16-color monitor, labtec speakers, 28kbs USRobotics modem Windows XP (think about it) Maze 3, DDen GF3 block, Eheim 1250, econoline van HC, 1/2" hose w/ 5/8" fittings Comair 172mm fan

04-07-2002, 03:51 PM	#75
EMC2 Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dark Side of the Moon Posts: 365	Nope, right link Look at "Part 4 of 6" and "Part 5 of 6" (they are PNG images).... with Part 5 of 6 strictly in the realm of electronics (but the concepts in 4 of 6 are applicable too).

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