Sidewinder TC-4 vs Geminicool spiral block - Page 2

schoolie · 03-29-2002, 08:23 PM

I got a TC4 in the mail today. You see, I'm a compulsive water block buyer. It's seriously heavy, maybe heavier than the MAZE2. Nicely lapped, and the barbs don't get in the way of the mounting bolts. Should I try it out?

jaydee · 03-29-2002, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by schoolie
Should I try it out?

Well yeah, kinda defeat the pourpose of buying it if you are not going to try it.

decodeddiesel · 03-29-2002, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by schoolie
I got a TC4 in the mail today. You see, I'm a compulsive water block buyer. It's seriously heavy, maybe heavier than the MAZE2. Nicely lapped, and the barbs don't get in the way of the mounting bolts. Should I try it out?

thats a no brainer...what blocks do you have to compair it to?

schoolie · 03-29-2002, 08:57 PM

I don't have the proper equipment to test the blocks. Just check out my "Innovatek Block" thread and you'll understand

I tried to get a thermal diode reader working, but failed and nearly killed my motherboard. It's a shame because I have MAZE2, Gemini high-flow, TC4, Sidewinder, and Innovatek blocks. I just don't want to publish bogus numbers.

Until I can accurately measure core temps, I'll leave it to people who have the right equipment. Sorry for the tease.

--Rob

pHaestus · 03-29-2002, 09:00 PM

schoolie I think the gist of that Innovatek thread might be that "the right equipment" doesn't exist

Brad · 03-29-2002, 09:08 PM

schoolie, even if you do go by the mobo probe, it should give us some fairly relevant figures

jaydee · 03-29-2002, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brad
schoolie, even if you do go by the mobo probe, it should give us some fairly relevant figures

yes, being they are all tested on the same hardware it dosn't matter if the temps are off 5C as long as they are consistantly off that amount on each block which it should be if all the variables stay the same. That will give us an idea on the temp differences on each block.

schoolie · 03-29-2002, 11:11 PM

I don't have a working Compunurse probe. I did try the TC4 and ran prime95 for about 20 minutes. My water temp read 16.4C in my res and the KR7A CPU probe read 32C. The only other block I could try was my Innovatek block. My readings for that block were water res temp 15.7C and probe temp 30C. I'll try to do a halfway decent test next weekend, including the Gemini block. My CPU was producing about 90W of heat. Sorry, I don't have more time to test all of the blocks.

Anybody reading this, don't compare these results to other waterblock tests. This was just one run for a short period of time, and the CPU temps, I'm sure, are a few degrees off.

--Rob

Brad · 03-29-2002, 11:16 PM

so the gemini is a little better then. now try some of your other blocks please

decodeddiesel · 03-30-2002, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by schoolie
I don't have the proper equipment to test the blocks. Just check out my "Innovatek Block" thread and you'll understand I tried to get a thermal diode reader working, but failed and nearly killed my motherboard. It's a shame because I have MAZE2, Gemini high-flow, TC4, Sidewinder, and Innovatek blocks. I just don't want to publish bogus numbers.

Until I can accurately measure core temps, I'll leave it to people who have the right equipment. Sorry for the tease.

--Rob

That is a shame, still it is respectible you would wait and not post false information. Very cool of you schoolie.

schoolie · 03-30-2002, 12:37 AM

Please keep in mind, the CPU temps are +/- 5C
and this is a total BS test...

CPU H2O Delta
Gemini 32 17 15C
TC4 32 16 16C
Innov 30 15.5 14.5C

pHaestus · 03-30-2002, 12:49 AM

Hey we let our presidential elections stand when the results are within the margin of error; why treat waterblocks any differently?

ablaze · 03-30-2002, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by schoolie
Please keep in mind, the CPU temps are +/- 5C
and this is a total BS test...

CPU H2O Delta
Gemini 32 17 15C
TC4 32 16 16C
Innov 30 15.5 14.5C

but if the margin of error is the same..that means the results are "fairly" comparable right..so what dya think schoolie? gut feeling if you have to: gemini or tc4?

come on more votes please!

Brad · 03-30-2002, 02:15 AM

so the innovatek and gemini are the best, while the tc4 is probably just as good, but they do all perform fairly similar

what about testing a maze2?

pHaestus · 03-30-2002, 02:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ablaze

but if the margin of error is the same..that means the results are "fairly" comparable right..so what dya think schoolie? gut feeling if you have to: gemini or tc4?

come on more votes please!

No. If the margin for error is +/- 5C, then unless the numbers are 11C apart from one another you cannot with certainty say that they are different. If the error overlaps then you can determine nothing. That's why everyone moves towards more sensitive temperature monitoring equipment.

Miss_Man · 03-30-2002, 03:15 AM

Shallow chanels may not be all that bad, especially when you're using the 1060. More turbulence in a shallower block IMO.

ablaze · 03-30-2002, 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Miss_Man
Shallow chanels may not be all that bad, especially when you're using the 1060. More turbulence in a shallower block IMO.

whatcha vote for?

sigh..no end to the choice in sight..gemini or tc4..

Miss_Man · 03-30-2002, 03:32 AM

Between the 2, I would vote for the TC-4 because I'm interested to find out how well the turbulators work being soldered or brazed to the walls and base. Perhaps it should have come with an acrylic top so that you can see the water spiralling through the turbulators. However, a slightly denser coil of turbulators may work better without impacting flow rate much.

ablaze · 03-30-2002, 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Miss_Man
Between the 2, I would vote for the TC-4 because I'm interested to find out how well the turbulators work being soldered or brazed to the walls and base. Perhaps it should have come with an acrylic top so that you can see the water spiralling through the turbulators. However, a slightly denser coil of turbulators may work better without impacting flow rate much.

(did you click on the poll at the top of the page?)

ok..doesn't an acrylic top affect performance? I mean shouldn't an all copper block perform better?

schoolie · 03-30-2002, 09:02 AM

I think both the TC4 and the Gemini are good blocks, ablaze. You can't go wrong buying either. I feel bad putting these bogus numbers on this thread. Even if my measurements were accurate, we're talking a 1C difference.

Good luck with your W/C setup! Remember it's suppposed to be fun

ablaze · 03-30-2002, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by schoolie
I think both the TC4 and the Gemini are good blocks, ablaze. You can't go wrong buying either. I feel bad putting these bogus numbers on this thread. Even if my measurements were accurate, we're talking a 1C difference.

Good luck with your W/C setup! Remember it's suppposed to be fun

how dya think these 2 fellas will compare against the maze3?

Haddy · 03-30-2002, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ablaze

how dya think these 2 fellas will compare against the maze3?

one way to find out =) maybe we can get the good fellas of pro cooling to get all 3 and have a good ole fashion shoot out....

ablaze · 03-30-2002, 12:07 PM

but I can't wait! I need a block NOW to start watercooling!

anyway..the poll shows 4:3 so minus that one that I voted for the sidewinder..that leaves me with an even split of opinions..argh..

ablaze · 03-30-2002, 01:18 PM

more votes please!!

Fixittt · 03-30-2002, 02:53 PM

I think its unfair to put these 2 blocks in a poll like this.

they were designed for each end of the water cooling spectrum.

ABLAZE I think U should first consider what you want you water cooling rig for.

Do you want quiet with a small overclock, then the gemini block would be good for you.

But if you want high heat loads, lots of water flow, and the pelt option later down the road, then between the 2 blocks, the tc-4 is the one for U. Its all a matter of what you want out of the system as a hole.

ablaze · 03-30-2002, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Fixittt
I think its unfair to put these 2 blocks in a poll like this.

they were designed for each end of the water cooling spectrum.

ABLAZE I think U should first consider what you want you water cooling rig for.

Do you want quiet with a small overclock, then the gemini block would be good for you.

But if you want high heat loads, lots of water flow, and the pelt option later down the road, then between the 2 blocks, the tc-4 is the one for U. Its all a matter of what you want out of the system as a hole.

no pelts here for sure. but I definitely want the lowest possible temps on my AXP and noise is NOT a factor!

guess that that puts me in the..latter category? great. nothng like friendly advice from the creater of the infamous spir@l

Fixittt · 03-30-2002, 03:02 PM

also another thing to think about. Is your setup going to in a small case? 1/2 in hoses dont like to bend alot. Where as 1/4 or 3/8 hoses dont mind and wont kink on the hard bends. I know my hoses would kink before I wrapped with with wire ties to keep them open. I to my self have thought about going to 3/8 hoses.

more food for thought.

ablaze · 03-30-2002, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Fixittt
also another thing to think about. Is your setup going to in a small case? 1/2 in hoses dont like to bend alot. Where as 1/4 or 3/8 hoses dont mind and wont kink on the hard bends. I know my hoses would kink before I wrapped with with wire ties to keep them open. I to my self have thought about going to 3/8 hoses.

more food for thought.

half my setup is going to be out of the case. so 1/2" is not a problem for me

Haddy · 03-30-2002, 06:17 PM

i just cant get behind the gemini block...nobody designs a block for low flow with plastic fittings (and a down right aweful busniess tac imo)

jaydee · 03-30-2002, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Haddy
i just cant get behind the gemini block...nobody designs a block for low flow with plastic fittings (and a down right aweful busniess tac imo)

There temps are exellent though. Check this out: http://www.overclockers.com/articles546/

View Poll Results: Which block will perform better on a hi-flow 1/2" setup?
Sidewinder TC-4	39	66.10%
GeminiCool "high flow"	20	33.90%
Voters: 59. You may not vote on this poll

03-29-2002, 09:08 PM	#36
Brad Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nuu Zeeelin Posts: 3,175	schoolie, even if you do go by the mobo probe, it should give us some fairly relevant figures __________________ 2x P3 1100's at 1400, Abit VP6, 2x Corsair 256mb PC150 sticks, 20gb 'cuda ATA-III, 2x 40gb 'cuda ATA-IV in raid 0. 20" Trinitron. No fans 2x 2400+ at 2288mhz (16.0 x 143), Iwill MPX2, 2x Kingmax PC-3200 256mb sticks, 4x 20gb 60gxp in Raid 5 on a Promise SX6000. Asus Ti4200 320/630. Cooled by Water

03-29-2002, 11:11 PM	#38
schoolie Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 120	I don't have a working Compunurse probe. I did try the TC4 and ran prime95 for about 20 minutes. My water temp read 16.4C in my res and the KR7A CPU probe read 32C. The only other block I could try was my Innovatek block. My readings for that block were water res temp 15.7C and probe temp 30C. I'll try to do a halfway decent test next weekend, including the Gemini block. My CPU was producing about 90W of heat. Sorry, I don't have more time to test all of the blocks. Anybody reading this, don't compare these results to other waterblock tests. This was just one run for a short period of time, and the CPU temps, I'm sure, are a few degrees off. --Rob Last edited by schoolie; 03-29-2002 at 11:13 PM.

03-29-2002, 11:16 PM	#39
Brad Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nuu Zeeelin Posts: 3,175	so the gemini is a little better then. now try some of your other blocks please __________________ 2x P3 1100's at 1400, Abit VP6, 2x Corsair 256mb PC150 sticks, 20gb 'cuda ATA-III, 2x 40gb 'cuda ATA-IV in raid 0. 20" Trinitron. No fans 2x 2400+ at 2288mhz (16.0 x 143), Iwill MPX2, 2x Kingmax PC-3200 256mb sticks, 4x 20gb 60gxp in Raid 5 on a Promise SX6000. Asus Ti4200 320/630. Cooled by Water

03-30-2002, 02:15 AM	#44
Brad Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nuu Zeeelin Posts: 3,175	so the innovatek and gemini are the best, while the tc4 is probably just as good, but they do all perform fairly similar what about testing a maze2? __________________ 2x P3 1100's at 1400, Abit VP6, 2x Corsair 256mb PC150 sticks, 20gb 'cuda ATA-III, 2x 40gb 'cuda ATA-IV in raid 0. 20" Trinitron. No fans 2x 2400+ at 2288mhz (16.0 x 143), Iwill MPX2, 2x Kingmax PC-3200 256mb sticks, 4x 20gb 60gxp in Raid 5 on a Promise SX6000. Asus Ti4200 320/630. Cooled by Water

03-29-2002, 08:23 PM	#31
schoolie Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 120	I got a TC4 in the mail today. You see, I'm a compulsive water block buyer. It's seriously heavy, maybe heavier than the MAZE2. Nicely lapped, and the barbs don't get in the way of the mounting bolts. Should I try it out?

03-29-2002, 08:57 PM	#34
schoolie Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 120	I don't have the proper equipment to test the blocks. Just check out my "Innovatek Block" thread and you'll understand I tried to get a thermal diode reader working, but failed and nearly killed my motherboard. It's a shame because I have MAZE2, Gemini high-flow, TC4, Sidewinder, and Innovatek blocks. I just don't want to publish bogus numbers. Until I can accurately measure core temps, I'll leave it to people who have the right equipment. Sorry for the tease. --Rob

03-29-2002, 09:00 PM	#35
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	schoolie I think the gist of that Innovatek thread might be that "the right equipment" doesn't exist

03-30-2002, 12:37 AM	#41
schoolie Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 120	Please keep in mind, the CPU temps are +/- 5C and this is a total BS test... CPU H2O Delta Gemini 32 17 15C TC4 32 16 16C Innov 30 15.5 14.5C

03-30-2002, 12:49 AM	#42
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	Hey we let our presidential elections stand when the results are within the margin of error; why treat waterblocks any differently?

03-30-2002, 03:15 AM	#46
Miss_Man Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 151	Shallow chanels may not be all that bad, especially when you're using the 1060. More turbulence in a shallower block IMO.

03-30-2002, 03:32 AM	#48
Miss_Man Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 151	Between the 2, I would vote for the TC-4 because I'm interested to find out how well the turbulators work being soldered or brazed to the walls and base. Perhaps it should have come with an acrylic top so that you can see the water spiralling through the turbulators. However, a slightly denser coil of turbulators may work better without impacting flow rate much.

03-30-2002, 09:02 AM	#50
schoolie Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 120	ablaze I think both the TC4 and the Gemini are good blocks, ablaze. You can't go wrong buying either. I feel bad putting these bogus numbers on this thread. Even if my measurements were accurate, we're talking a 1C difference. Good luck with your W/C setup! Remember it's suppposed to be fun

03-30-2002, 12:07 PM	#53
ablaze Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Singapore! Posts: 124	but I can't wait! I need a block NOW to start watercooling! anyway..the poll shows 4:3 so minus that one that I voted for the sidewinder..that leaves me with an even split of opinions..argh..

03-30-2002, 01:18 PM	#54
ablaze Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Singapore! Posts: 124	more votes please!!

03-30-2002, 02:53 PM	#55
Fixittt CNC Beyatch Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Tulsa Spell it backwards Posts: 721	I think its unfair to put these 2 blocks in a poll like this. they were designed for each end of the water cooling spectrum. ABLAZE I think U should first consider what you want you water cooling rig for. Do you want quiet with a small overclock, then the gemini block would be good for you. But if you want high heat loads, lots of water flow, and the pelt option later down the road, then between the 2 blocks, the tc-4 is the one for U. Its all a matter of what you want out of the system as a hole. __________________ Creator of the Spir@l Block Longest post ever http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&postid=43808#post43808

03-30-2002, 03:02 PM	#57
Fixittt CNC Beyatch Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Tulsa Spell it backwards Posts: 721	also another thing to think about. Is your setup going to in a small case? 1/2 in hoses dont like to bend alot. Where as 1/4 or 3/8 hoses dont mind and wont kink on the hard bends. I know my hoses would kink before I wrapped with with wire ties to keep them open. I to my self have thought about going to 3/8 hoses. more food for thought. __________________ Creator of the Spir@l Block Longest post ever http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&postid=43808#post43808

03-30-2002, 06:17 PM	#59
Haddy Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mississippi Posts: 434	i just cant get behind the gemini block...nobody designs a block for low flow with plastic fittings (and a down right aweful busniess tac imo)

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