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Water Block Design / Construction Building your own block? Need info on designing one? Heres where to do it |
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#26 |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: VA Tech
Posts: 111
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Arcturius, do you mean that your core wore out exposing the actual chip? and it still works? are you using just distilled water with nothing added?
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#27 |
Thermophile
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Just shut up ;) ...
Posts: 1,068
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I'm not getting any pics in your third post JD, are they on a different server than the second posts pic?. How about a link to a relevant thread somewhere (pimprigs?) as I missed the original 'round'
![]() ![]() What is the score with AMD's 'not being waterproof'? I can't make out if people mean it's the 'organic substrate' (which is obvious) or the silicon core wafers themselves? or the edges where the wafers are 'stacked'? (which could be sealed as aforementioned)... PS, welcome back! ![]() |
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#28 | |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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![]() Quote:
![]() Non of it is really water proof but the biggest issue is where the body of the cpu meets the die. The peices are not bonded together and they use somekind of sealant around that. If you look close you will see a greenish sealant that looks as if it was poured on over the die and it seaps onto the body of the CPU. ![]() As for the the thread I pulled those quotes from it was all one sided on their site. I never said a word in that thread nor will I ever think about joining that rediculous site. The guy was just bent out of shape because he got questioned on his testing methods after he posted his article here that had rediculous temps with no water or air temps shown and he claims his overclock is the determining factor for how good it is. He started a thread there to hear is ignorant followers praise him for something they don't really understand. This alone is why I stopped posting my projects at other sites. Here I know most people can understand and really appriciate the work I do for the most part. Arcturius: Interesting that the die is visably eroding. Just proves that sooner or later it will wear through. Well I woke up a freaking 5am this morning for some reason. It is 5:50am now and I still need to test the Duron to make sure it works so I will do that now before I got to work. If it does work I will be testing out what my Lemon Block can do and then the maze 4 and then the direct die block. The reason for the other two blocks is I need a comparision on the same rig and I am making an article about this whole project for my website. I want to cover as many bases as I can before posting an article. |
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#29 |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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Duron works! typing this on the very computer it is working on. Run nice and cold to with this Lemon Block. Going to see if my pencil trick is holding up and see if I can OC this thing before going to work.
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#30 |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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Well overclocking with the multi is a no go. I guess I need a better pencil! Will work on that after work. I had it up to 1250mhz stable and 1300mhz not so stable at one time on the older Epox 8K7A. Once I get the multi unlocked it should go up to those levels again. I got it at 1150mhz at 115FSB right now. Once the multi is unlocked I can drop the multi down the 7.5X at 133FSB to get 1000mhz and will work my way on up to 1300 or so.
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#31 |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: San Mateo, CA, USA, Earth
Posts: 433
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Good looking DDC block there Jaydee... I especially like your reliefs for the various components on the top of the CPU.
As for the hardheaded and blind responses from that "other" forum, I would chalk that up to ignorance. They obviously are content to use "133t" tricks such as putting their radiator outside for colder air to cool their water as opposed to actually making a water block/DDC block that is an excellent performer. I have yet to see a shred of evidence that shows that they "pwnd" you. All they show is that they have what they BELIEVE is an excellent direct die cooling setup that "must" outperform anything out there because they can "0C the 5h1t" out of it. I personally don't give a damn if they think you are right or not. I've been very impressed with your creative work so far as well as your very strict proceedures for testing. Such as... keeping the room tempretures level and "normal". I can only imagine the variances that guy gets with the radiator hanging outside. ![]() ![]() Keep up the good work Jaydee... "Nuthin' but luv for yah!" ![]() ![]() ![]()
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#32 |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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Thanks MMZ!
Bad news though. I got home, found a good pencil, unlocked the Duron. Slapped on an air cooler I had laying around (because it is a pain to mount the water block just to find it still needs unlocking), Set it to 1333mhz and it was stable in windows air cooled! SO, I took the air cooler off and was tightening down the Lemon Block and CRACK!. Chipped the corner and killed it. I knew I should have put those 4 pads back on first.... Damn... Well this puts a halt to this project. The block is designed for a Duron1gig-1.3gig but they are like $35 new at the egg. Not sure I want to buy one just for this. Would almost rather wait a while untill I can afford a new XP1700+ and build a new Direct Die block for it. goingto check e-bay for cheap Durons.... |
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#33 |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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![]() Code:
CPU AMD|DURON 1.3GHZ % 1 $35.00 Subtotal $35.00 Tax $.00 Shipping and Handling charge .00 Total $35.00 Step 5 of 5 ![]() |
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#34 |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Utah
Posts: 160
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Now wait a minute, you were air cooling your CPU without those pads on there? Does it help performance taking off the pads? I've never heard of this before...
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#35 |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: May 2003
Location: In a box
Posts: 221
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Yeah, take off pads and put on thermal paste.
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"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit" |
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#36 | |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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#37 |
Cooling Neophyte
Join Date: May 2002
Location: S. F. Bay Area
Posts: 8
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JayDee you have mail.
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#38 | |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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#39 |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Willmar MN/Fargo ND
Posts: 504
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hey jaydee, thanx for reminding me about my 2 duron 850s I have
![]() I gotta make a direct die block for one of those sometime. One thing you could do is cut holes for the pads and not take them off. Thats one thing I think I would do. So far, it looks good. I really didnt look at the pics that thouroughly. though. That duron have a squair core? Mine dont.... One thing that you have to remember is the offset in the socket. Also, in order to get your cpu out, your gonna need to take the waterblock off. The cam lever will get in the way. Thats always a pain in the butt. The way I solved that on my old direct die block was I just made a 2x2 block and a hold down. Jon |
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#40 | |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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#41 |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: in a nice cool spot
Posts: 427
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Regarding the core erosion issue, after my p4 died after 4 months of direct die (exact cause unkown since other extreme mobo mods we're in place as well) link it had...marks on the core that corosponded to the impact points of the jet's, but they we're so faint that a wipe over the core removed them, mabie a deposit build up of some kind.
I have plans in place for a T-bred direct die exprimental block (quite similar to your approach actually) that also will try and address the porus core sealant issue.
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#42 |
Cooling Neophyte
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Belgium
Posts: 83
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About those jets:
Will more jets get you lower temps? Otherwise it could be possible to make them more narrow and have more of them, hitting more surface with their (smaller) beams. This is a large forum, and the word jet is used a lot here ![]() So i couldn't find anything that tasted which is better and why ...
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#43 | |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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#44 | |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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I just can't get over this. Been laughing my ass off all morning.
Quote:
![]() For some reason the guy is of the opinion that he has all rights for direct die cooling. All he has is rights for the designs his company has made and patented. Hope he comes across this thread. ![]() Anyway no progress yet. CPU is still in route. Should be here tomorrow or Thursday. Also bretb was kind enough to send a T-Bird 1200 for this. Once that gets here it will be direct die project #2! I can't wait to get this block up and running. Giving me a whole new reason to carry on in this water cooling game. Once I get back on my feet money wise I am going to build a water chiller and run cold water through the direct block. ![]() |
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#45 |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
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#46 | |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: May 2003
Location: In a box
Posts: 221
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"If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit" |
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#47 |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Houston, TX, USA
Posts: 221
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I still think lack of surface area will make a DD block perform worse than the "best" regular WB....
The only question is, will it perform enough worse to overcome the fact that it has no crappy TIM (and thus lose) or will it win out...and will a better TIM (like that carbon black stuff) cause DD to lose again? |
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#48 |
Thermophile
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,538
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Good work jaydee.
If you're interested, I'll see if I can dig up a reject Cascade middle plate. Some come off the machine with a few tubes split - if more than 2 are split then I reject the plate, however I may be able to find one where the damage is restricted to some outer tubes and should be easy enough to work around. All you need to do then is make up some templates that block off the top entrances to the jets that don't touch the CPU die, and basically you can re-use the one plate across a variety of dies by doing this. Let me know and I'll find a middle and top plate to send your way if possible. Just make up a bottom plate to stand the jets away from the CPU die and to seal to the CPU and you're in business. BTW, I have tried the Cascade with 1C water (ice blocks in an esky) and picked up an extra 100MHz out of the CPU. I was running my XP2800+ Barton at over 2800MHz without worries. |
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#49 |
Cooling Savant
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Desert City in California
Posts: 631
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Whats an esky? A portable insulated storage box, which we call a cooler here in the states?
BrianW
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Water Cooled Inwin Q500 (Dual Rads: Rad1 = DTEK Pro Core | Rad2 = Blick Ice Estreme, Hydor L30, Dangerden Maze2, Bay Res Typhoon Reservoir, 1/2 " DD Tygon Thick Wall Hose). Flow: Res, Pump, CPU watervlock, Y into both rads, both rads into res independently. Athlon XP 1800+ (@ 1731 - 150mhz fsb.), on a Asus A7N266-c, and a Radeon 9000 *waiting for RMA'd Saphire 9800 ultra from Newegg) |
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#50 |
Put up or Shut Up
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
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Yes, Cathar I would be interested in that. I think I could make good use of that on the TBird core as if I remember right they are fairly large. I can cap off the uneeded pipes.
I think the biggest gain this might have over a standard block is the +-8C gain from having no TIM joint. If I can get the volocity high enough through the jets it should work well. Water shouldn't have any problem cooling the die as long as it is moving fairly quick. Anyway I will test it against my Lemon Block and the Maze 4. And then I will let it run for a few months 24/7 or until something breaks. ![]() ![]() |
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