Please Help Me with My School Project (making waterblocks)

[sn_85]

Originally Posted by spartansith

i got the heater core for free, i think its alumminum, and the Prescott core isnt even out so how do u know its worse than the Northwood, and it has a 1mb cache, it will even reach 5Ghz later with the socket 775, and also its not going to cost $1000, more like $780 for the asus 9800xt and new 3.2 Prescott.

im thinking of just cooling my processor b/c i dont want to fool around with the GPU and its shim/heatsink b/c one of the reasons i chose the Asus' 9800xt is cause of the cooling fan bonus. also my chipset can do without.

i do plan on OCing this my CPU and GPU, the new XTs have a built in sensor for OCing, and my current m/b has a program also to use in Windows, or i could OC in bios, which one do yall think, my mobo is Gigabytes GA-8KNXP!(cost me $240 retail brand new)

thnx, Laney

we'll for starters when the P4 EE came out Intel themselves stated the P4 EE would outperform Prescott. and the EE couldnt even handle the FX-51. A64 has 1mb cache also and not to mention 64bit. Intel is now revamping the prescott for faster speed. why do that? to make it faster to comphensate for its inefficiency. if prescott could beat A64 or the P4 now, then there' wouldnt be any need to revamp the pipeline to 30 stages this close to its release date. obviously they plan to increase clock speeds as fast as they can just as they did to the P4. you can gather a lot on http://www.theinquirer.net/. they might be a bit premature benchmarks and reports they have but it does give you a glimpse of how it preforms.

i really do think that you need to replan this watercooling project out, not only for your class but for yourself as well. you state you are not a noob but you are using an aluminum heatercore? hopefully your not going to cool your prescott with an aluminum heatercore but more importantly hopefully you're not going to use an aluminum heatercore with a copper waterblock. even if you use additives its just not wise to mix metals. if incidents happen with annodized aluminum then its bound to happen with pure aluminum no matter what additives are used. as i said before this a big investment. your computer and your watercooler. if you're going to do it, do it right. dont leave any chance of error happening especially if its your first. barbs leak, pumps fail, corrosion occurs, you never know what will happen. so why skimp on the important stuff.

for the most part this thread has been flame free. i think ur lucky jaydee isnt around. no offense to jaydee, i love reading his posts.

[superart]

Originally Posted by spartansith

i do plan on OCing this my CPU and GPU, the new XTs have a built in sensor for OCing, and my current m/b has a program also to use in Windows, or i could OC in bios, which one do yall think, my mobo is Gigabytes GA-8KNXP!(cost me $240 retail brand new)

now that your only cooling the CPU, and maybe the GPU, are you still going with the 4-outlet style CPU block? If so, what will you do with all the unused outlets?

Also, I wouldn't't go with a 9800XT, go with a 9600XT. Simply because you get only a little more performance with the 9800xt, but a much higher price premium. Also, ATI will start putting out new cards around the time Doom3 comes out, so you might as well save up.

My 8RDA+ also has a program like that. I have some reservations about changing CPU and FSB frequencies while windows is running. Windows has a hard time running stable when nothing is changing, I shudder to think what is going on when all the sudden everything windows knows to be true suddenly changes. I think of it like an earthquake. I'm not saying its good or bad, all I'm saying is I have reservations about fiddling with low-level values while running a high level environment like windows. I do my overclocks in BIOS, and/or jumpers .

Originally Posted by sn_85

i understand that you are getting this watercooler for the CPU, GPU, Northbridge. You also goto a private school and are purchasing a Prescott (which is worse then the Northwood, but i wont get into that), and 9800XT. why are you going to then skip on pump? $40 seems really low considering those 3 components will cost a thousands bucks. are you going to risk using an unrealiable cheap pump on this system? can that pump handle the heat output of your system? the only pump thats around $40 could be the Hydor Seltz L30. or the Via Aqua 1300 but those seem to have impeller issues and quality issues. i suggest you get a cheaper videocard or cheaper cpu and shell out the bucks for an Eheim or a Iwaki pump. it's worth the investment and it will out last your computer. u state your radiator is metal, what kind of metal? make sure you get a copper one

I was telling you the same thing. You can't get a cheep pump with a highly restrictive block design. You would be better off getting cheaper components, and investing more in your cooling system. Components become obsolete within 6 months, no matter how much you spend on them initially. But if you plan your cooling system right the first time, and don't skimp where you're not supposed to, it can last you for a very long time. Get either a nice iwaki pump, or a swifty MC600. And don't use a crappy radiator that someone was planning on throwing away, but decided to give to you instead, because it would save them the trip. Get a nice copper heatercore or radiator. It will be worth it in the long run.

Originally Posted by sn_85

or the most part this thread has been flame free. i think ur lucky jaydee isnt around. no offense to jaydee, i love reading his posts

HeHeHE....yea. Whatever happened to jaydee anyway? I Havent seen him posting here in quite some time

[spartansith]

intel is so much better than amd, but if u go bang for buck then amd is cheaper, im just going for power.

about the heater core, i got mine from a salvage yard, should i get a new one or does it matter alot, so copper and aluminum in a system is bad huh? well looks like another trip but to get a copper one.

thnx, Laney

[superart]

Originally Posted by spartansith

intel is so much better than amd, but if u go bang for buck then amd is cheaper, im just going for power.

Them be fight'n werds

[pelle76]

Originally Posted by spartansith

intel is so much better than amd, but if u go bang for buck then amd is cheaper, im just going for power.

about the heater core, i got mine from a salvage yard, should i get a new one or does it matter alot, so copper and aluminum in a system is bad huh? well looks like another trip but to get a copper one.

thnx, Laney

I guess you have finally managed to break this long lucky streak of nonflaming with the P4 vs AMD statement... Now you gonna get it...
A statement like that shows how little you know. If you claim something, make sure to include facts that support your claim... Otherwise you will get runover.

About the aluminium and the copper: Alot have been said during the years. Some claim that the aluminium will get eaten pretty fast, while others say that they have been running it for years without any signs of corrosion... It gets alot better with water additives like for example WaterWetter. Those additives slow the corrosion down; but they doesn't stop it.
In a cheap setup I would use the cheapest components, many have succeeded building setups with alu-cores because that was the only thing or cheapest around... But in a system like yours; I would not take the chance. Get a copper one (Or rellay its not that often it is pure copper) and maybe not even from the scrapyard. Buy a new one from DD or something like that.
Then the fittings will be right and it won't have holes or alot of crap in it.

[killernoodle]

I'd like to see your $$ P4 outrun my $68 cpu.... Yeah... It cant.
As well as you may think water wetter prevents corrosion, you should look at my old components... I had a single aluminum plug in contact with the loop (the rest of the blocks and the radiator was copper) and it turned all of my waterblocks black and the aluminum plug was almost eaten completely away...All I had in there was water and water wetter because someone told me it would inhibit corrosion.

Antifreeze is actually designed to prevent corrosion in that type of environment. I dont have a single speck of corrosion in my system now and havent lost any performance due to the antifreeze.

Really, waterwetter is designed to be used as an addative to water or a car cooling loop to reduce the surface tension of water and make the molecules stick to components better.

Antifreeze is designed as a corrosion inhibitor.

[pelle76]

Originally Posted by killernoodle

Really, waterwetter is designed to be used as an addative to water or a car cooling loop to reduce the surface tension of water and make the molecules stick to components better.

Antifreeze is designed as a corrosion inhibitor.

OK, I thought that WW also had anticorrosion components...

But hey... antifreeze is designed for... guess what... to prevent iceplugs But its right as you say that they add an anticorrosion component to it...

EDIT: From what I have understood the antifreeze also lowers the surface tension of the fluid.. Is this correct?

[superart]

I don't want to get off on a rant here, but since you are planning on overclocking, you should seriously consider the AMD approach.

I'd be hard pressed to recommend going with an Athlon64 until the new pin package hits the market, but you would be better off, imo, going with an AthlonXP system, nice mobo(Epox 8rd3a+ for example), and very good RAM and ATI9600XT. That way you will have more money to spend on a good cooling system, and you will achieve a MUCH higher overclock.

Then when the new Athlon64s come out, you can get one of those, and a good mobo for that, and a new ATI card (or maybe by that time Nvidia will pick itself out of its slump). The RAM would be compatible, so you could use that. And your cooling system will, of course, still be good.

then you can either buy a cheap stick(s) of RAM and have a second AXP system, or sell off the components, which will still have descent value.


As for Intel having a more powerful chip, the only application it is more powerful is video encoding, and even then, it's not by a lot. When it comes to games, which I assume is your prime application, AMD is by far a more powerful processor.



At this point, an overclocked AXP can run pretty much any game. For some reference, my roommate, who has pretty much the same setup as I have (axp running at 2GHz, 200MhzFSB(400DDR), ATI9700, 512MB RAM) runs the DOOM3 alpha at 30-40fps. That will be more than enough to run any game in the near future, and by the time DOOM3 comes out, there will be plenty of new awesome hardware. You just have to plan it so that you have the money to buy it at that time.

[sn_85]

i think it may be too late for him to go AMD cuz i think he said that he already bought the mobo for $240. so i think he's stuck w/ Intel. When is the project due again? Will prescott even be out by then? or will you be left with Intel giving you a paper launch. at that point you'll have to resort to cooling a toaster for your project instead of a processor. what current system are you running on now? maybe you should just build a block for what you got now instead of putting all your money in a "soon" to be released processor. also the P4 2.4C do a really good overclock. for the most part i see a lot of them reaching 3.2GHz on air cooling. correct me if im wrong on this, Intel initially said that Prescotts would be able to run on the current P4 chipsets but i thought i heard some report or rumor that it may or may not be able to run on current P4 chipsets. not sure if its true tho. but the 2.4C's only run a/b $160 so it will leave you plenty of room to spend on better cooling.

also they are going to release another P4EE (dont know why?) at 3.4GHz in 775 package but that just means that the original P4 core is still faster then Prescott.

[spartansith]

here is my back up : take a look at these benchmarks (and they dont even have the new P4s on there):

http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/2003...charts-22.html

but we are not here to dispute which is better, and i already have my nice mobo, and its a socket 478. take a look at :http://www.giga-byte.com/MotherBoard...s_GA-8KNXP.htm

[spartansith]

k, well my chipset supports the prescott, my current system is a Gygabyte GA-8SG800, P4 2.4, ATI Radeon 9800Pro, 120gb WD special edition, and 7??mb of DDR333

I have my HD, 512mb Corsair DDR400, and my GA-8KNXP so all i need now is my case( http://www.internetishop.com/product...m=CS-ALAUTO-SL ), CPU, and GPU.

[sn_85]

Originally Posted by spartansith

here is my back up : take a look at these benchmarks (and they dont even have the new P4s on there):

http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/2003...charts-22.html

but we are not here to dispute which is better, and i already have my nice mobo, and its a socket 478. take a look at :http://www.giga-byte.com/MotherBoard...s_GA-8KNXP.htm

and they dont even have the new Athlon's on there. well its no wonder why you say Intel rocks. My word of advice, NEVER ever, ever trust or even goto Tomshardware. unless you like biased reviews of course. i think everyone will agree with me on that.

[superart]

Toms hardware is the site people point you to when they want to convince either you or themselves that the piece of hardware they bought is good, or better than something else, when it really isn't.

My roomate's girlfriend tried to point me to Tomshardware to convince me that my Epox 8rda+ "suxored". It was a heated argument, up untill she posted "EPOCH BLOWS" on my fridge. At that point I dropped it b/c I realised it was an exercise in futility to argue with her.

[spartansith]

the case im getting is this one:
http://www.internetishop.com/produc...em=CS-ALAUTO-SL

any ideas on what would be a nice mod for it?


edit:see above link where i posted it, that one works!!
thnx for the notice on that

[Pears0]

Originally Posted by spartansith

the case im getting is this one:
http://www.internetishop.com/produc...em=CS-ALAUTO-SL

any ideas on what would be a nice mod for it?

I have no ides. the picyure never came up!

[spartansith]

see above where i talked on the case

[Pears0]

Its looks pretty good to start with. But a window in the top mayb?
Is that the only colour it comes in, cos u could do a sweet paint job usin car sprays in 1 colour, like come kind of metallic pain???

[spartansith]

well my color scheem is blue and aluminum, i could put in some black or very dark blue also to go along with my sony LCD and microsoft bluetooth desktop, im also thinking of some new speakers, mabe those cool klipch ones, right now i have 2 old harman/kardon ones that came with my old dell. any thoughts?

thnx, Laney

edit:

also i was thinking of doing something to the front sliding panel, like putting my logo on it or something, i dont know if i should paint it, if so what kind of paint and how? also i would mostlikely use a stenle that i print out, is there a program that i could use to make it, i want it perfect and symetrical, if u want to see the logo as it is now it is here: www.freewebs.com/spartansith, this is my clan's site but the logo is blown up on the home page.

thnx again, Laney

[killernoodle]

Originally Posted by spartansith

here is my back up : take a look at these benchmarks (and they dont even have the new P4s on there):

http://www.tomshardware.com/cpu/2003...charts-22.html

but we are not here to dispute which is better, and i already have my nice mobo, and its a socket 478. take a look at :http://www.giga-byte.com/MotherBoard...s_GA-8KNXP.htm

My $68 1700+ is running at 3400+-3500+ speeds, plus the increase in FSB frequency speeds up the ram and other stuff as well....

So it still beats anything by intel. Oh yeah, and did I mention it was $68? Not $1000 like the P4EE's ass that it kicks. And dont trust tom... hes a moron

Back on topic again... Paint with enamel or go to a auto body shop and get it professionally painted. There are plenty of painting guides online. I just used gloss black enamel all over mine.

[superart]

pimprig.com has a couple really good paint guides. They talk about stencils and what paint to use, prep, the whole nine yards. Its a pretty good set of guides.

[nth1rty]

With Intel's dealings, are you even sure that you will HAVE a prescott core by may or june?

edit: lol this was supposed to be posted a few pages back...damn browser cache!

[superart]

Originally Posted by nth1rty

With Intel's dealings, are you even sure that you will HAVE a prescott core by may or june?

edit: lol this was supposed to be posted a few pages back...damn browser cache!

Yea, because they need to compete with AMD, or at least make it look like they are somewhat competative.

[spartansith]

they will be out the first of next month i believe, thats what the preorder on many sites say atleast, that is true, they need to compete with amd's new 64, the prescott is supposto have the ability to unlock as a 64bit cpu for when there are 64bit OSs, i think thats nice, also the prescott core will give off less heat since it uses 90nm instead of the 130nm like the northwood cores, i guess this means it will be able to overclock more(my opinion, im dont actually know but thats what it seems to me)


but lets get off the subject on amd vs. intel, im obviously out numbered so no mater what i say nothing is changed.

so anyone want to give me a nice pump or copper heater core, ill pay for shipping!!!

thnx, Laney

[sn_85]

Originally Posted by spartansith

they will be out the first of next month i believe, thats what the preorder on many sites say atleast, that is true, they need to compete with amd's new 64, the prescott is supposto have the ability to unlock as a 64bit cpu for when there are 64bit OSs, i think thats nice, also the prescott core will give off less heat since it uses 90nm instead of the 130nm like the northwood cores, i guess this means it will be able to overclock more(my opinion, im dont actually know but thats what it seems to me)


but lets get off the subject on amd vs. intel, im obviously out numbered so no mater what i say nothing is changed.

so anyone want to give me a nice pump or copper heater core, ill pay for shipping!!!

thnx, Laney

didnt we already go over this one too? buy a nice heatercore, meaning new heatercore, and a new pump, meaning high quality.

http://www.dangerden.com/mall/Radiators/thermochill.asp

http://www.cooltechnica.com/Merchant...ategory_Code=R

two good rads that u dont need to mod that will prob fit ur case.

the 1250 is good.

http://www.dangerden.com/mall/Pumps/Pump_eheim.asp

its as simple as that.

[killernoodle]

Originally Posted by spartansith

they will be out the first of next month i believe, thats what the preorder on many sites say atleast, that is true, they need to compete with amd's new 64, the prescott is supposto have the ability to unlock as a 64bit cpu for when there are 64bit OSs, i think thats nice, also the prescott core will give off less heat since it uses 90nm instead of the 130nm like the northwood cores, i guess this means it will be able to overclock more(my opinion, im dont actually know but thats what it seems to me)


but lets get off the subject on amd vs. intel, im obviously out numbered so no mater what i say nothing is changed.

so anyone want to give me a nice pump or copper heater core, ill pay for shipping!!!

thnx, Laney

You do realize that it has already been stated that the prescott will pump out 100-130 watts of heat? 90nm doesnt seem to be helping.