Crazy W/B design

tex707 · 05-04-2003, 05:22 PM

What do you think about this? Hard to be machined, but colud be a good performer?

Balinju · 05-04-2003, 05:32 PM

can't see the inside really well!!!

Any other pic to show us?

tex707 · 05-04-2003, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Balinju
can't see the inside really well!!!

Any other pic to show us?

To be honest, I couldn't find out how to post two screenshots at the time...here it is.

jag_e_fattig · 05-04-2003, 05:41 PM

i think the fins in the middle are more restrictive than anything else. and i thkn that (1) you should fill in the gray area, (2) is just going to be a useless part of the block unless you (3) add an aoutput there...my $0.02

Balinju · 05-04-2003, 05:45 PM

i think those fins are pretty restictive, but i also think that they can cause a high rate of turbulance is a + inpingement is applied.

my opinion is to drop the other walls and change them to pins, or something else to make turbulance and that are not that restrictive.

bigben2k · 05-04-2003, 07:39 PM

You'd do well to get rid of the inner chamber wall: it's only restrictive.

utabintarbo · 05-05-2003, 07:19 AM

You might be better off having the passages line up in the central "pin" area. Would probably ease restriction in addition to making the design more manufacturable (WOW! 6 syllables

).

Bob

tex707 · 05-05-2003, 02:52 PM

About the inner chamber....I've put it there for the purpose of flow restriction...I think that I have read somewhere that redicing the flow velocity could actually improve the convection. Doesn't sound too reasonable, though...

jaydee · 05-05-2003, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tex707
About the inner chamber....I've put it there for the purpose of flow restriction...I think that I have read somewhere that redicing the flow velocity could actually improve the convection. Doesn't sound too reasonable, though...

That may work if the "redicing" is actually in an area that produces heat. Nothing "good" to say about the rest of the design so I will shut up before I get yelled at for critisizing.

winewood · 05-05-2003, 04:28 PM

sorry.. this is off topic. Jaydee, your blocks are on bigben2k's profile http customcooledpc. Do you guys live near each other or work together? I would like to bounce some things off you guys soemtime in person.

Fixittt · 05-05-2003, 04:31 PM

God Jaydee, why dont you shut up!!!! Damn always negative! Is that a bit of Bill rubbin off on you?

LOL just kidding, Why not give constructive, not destructive critisism? isnt that what we are here for?

Come on, you can do it.

I know I would hate to be the one to machine that sucker.

Would break alot of long fluted endmills. Not to mention, would take forever on our machines.

Just jabbin at you jay.

bigben2k · 05-05-2003, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by winewood
sorry.. this is off topic. Jaydee, your blocks are on bigben2k's profile http customcooledpc. Do you guys live near each other or work together? I would like to bounce some things off you guys soemtime in person.

He he, no, it's my temporary home, until I put something up myself.

I'm also a moderator of part of the forum (BTW, it's up and down these days: wassup?).

Speaking of which, I'll also be moderating the air/water cooling forum over at NordicHardware. Now if I could just convince them that an Alu case doesn't make your PC run cooler...

Otherwise, go ahead and either put up your Q in the Forum, or feel free to e-mail me.

tex707 · 05-05-2003, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaydee116
That may work if the "redicing" is actually in an area that produces heat. Nothing "good" to say about the rest of the design so I will shut up before I get yelled at for critisizing.

Well, the center portion is supposed to be the area with the highest temperature, right?

Sorry 'bout "redicing"....happened to be a typo....but you already know that...

The purpose of the discussion is to say what you REALLY think, so please do. Maybe I'll be brave enough to post some more designs anyway....

tex707 · 05-05-2003, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Fixittt

I know I would hate to be the one to machine that sucker.

Would break alot of long fluted endmills. Not to mention, would take forever on our machines.

Wouldn't it be a challenge..??...

An IGES file of this W/B was taken to the workshop...they said it could be done, but with a lot of trouble...so I had to make a simpler model.

jaydee · 05-05-2003, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bigben2k

I'm also a moderator of part of the forum (BTW, it's up and down these days: wassup?).

The host is screwed up at the moment. They are running the site off a dieing computer. They are moving the site over to a Dual Xeon server with 1gig ram. Supposed to already have happened but as you see the Forums are still toast. The problem is the forums are run off a MySQL database, but the MySQL apperently has not been transfered over or they are having problems with getting MySQL to work.

Good thing I backed up the database before it when down.....

Hopefully be up soon or a new host will get my business.

jaydee · 05-05-2003, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tex707
Well, the center portion is supposed to be the area with the highest temperature, right?

Sorry 'bout "redicing"....happened to be a typo....but you already know that...

The purpose of the discussion is to say what you REALLY think, so please do. Maybe I'll be brave enough to post some more designs anyway....

Thought we were bitching about the outter wall part. Well if not then that is what I ment. The inner bunch of.....errrr....pins.....I guess...........are not going to do much for all the extra milling. Could easily do better with a 10minute drill pressed block IMO. Looks like a restrictive, high cost to make, no better than a below agerage commercial block to me. If you going to make some super hard to make block then at least try to make it better than a $40 commercial block. Ok said what I thought.... Flame on....

Fixittt · 05-05-2003, 06:49 PM

flame.

But he is right.

now let me ask a question.

What thought pattern and what if any calcs have you done when you started drawing? IE. What was your insperation?

I can tell you that it is perfectly fine if you just sat down and started drawing. That is how alot of people, even I sometimes do it. Just to see what comes out.

tex707 · 05-06-2003, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jaydee116
Looks like a restrictive, high cost to make, no better than a below agerage commercial block to me. If you going to make some super hard to make block then at least try to make it better than a $40 commercial block. Ok said what I thought.... Flame on....

Oh, you're definitely right about this. Actually, I can't be sure if it would perform worse than a $40 commercial block, but it would surely be much harder to make it. Actually, it was a design meant to be machined for free...

tex707 · 05-06-2003, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Fixittt

What thought pattern and what if any calcs have you done when you started drawing? IE. What was your insperation?

I can tell you that it is perfectly fine if you just sat down and started drawing. That is how alot of people, even I sometimes do it. Just to see what comes out.

No calcs at all, to be honest. The only thing I've had in mind was to keep the cross section area of flow as constant as possible.

I have no software for fluid flow and/or conduction/convection calculations. Do you guys use any?

The block was meant to be manufactured for free, so I did not care much about the complexity of the design. As I've said, it was abandoned and a much simpler design was used.

JCYC5 · 05-07-2003, 07:43 AM

Sorry to be offtopic, but those looks great...

What program did you use for them?

Balinju · 05-07-2003, 08:26 AM

btw very very nice rendering. you have a good cad skill

JCYC5 · 05-07-2003, 09:10 AM

I'm so twiddly with Solidworks... argh.....

tex707 · 05-07-2003, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JCYC5
Sorry to be offtopic, but those looks great...

What program did you use for them?

This was designed with CATIA V5.

tex707 · 05-07-2003, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Balinju
btw very very nice rendering. you have a good cad skill

Thanx.

Actually, these screencaptures are not rendering...this is the default display of the 3D model.....rendering looks better, but it is really not necessary to be used...as obvious..

airspirit · 05-08-2003, 09:55 AM

Actually, I don't think it will do too bad. In order to make it work I would highly recommend going to a dual output design. If you did that and opened up the exits from the central chamber into the sides non-adjacent to the barbs (top and bottom in your picture) a bit more to allow for better load balancing, I think it would work acceptably. This block will not be a WW by any means, but I do feel that it will perform adequately. While everyone else is bashing the positioning of the central pins, I think it will greatly aid the transfer of heat due to the crazy turbulence it will cause. Yeah, it will restrict flow, but I do think that it will also cause the block to be a decent performer under low flow conditions.

I see what you are doing here: you're trying to have a central chamber devoted to containing the fresh slug of coolant and transferring heat as quickly as possible while simultaneously having a low resistance means of removing the used slug to allow for new coolant.

I'd say go for it. I would probably compare the design efficiency to something around a Maze 3 or comparable block if it is completely made out of copper. It may even do better.

As for the rest of you, give the guy a break. Just because somebody doesn't follow your pet design theory doesn't mean that they're on the path to destruction (gawd I can't get that out of my freakin' head!). The only way we can collectively learn is if people such as Tex try to push us in different directions.

05-04-2003, 05:32 PM	#2
Balinju Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Malta Posts: 495	can't see the inside really well!!! Any other pic to show us? __________________ So the bullet proof vest aint a $hit when d laser is pointed to your head Kid

05-04-2003, 05:41 PM	#4
jag_e_fattig Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: SoCal, formerly Sweden. Posts: 110	i think the fins in the middle are more restrictive than anything else. and i thkn that (1) you should fill in the gray area, (2) is just going to be a useless part of the block unless you (3) add an aoutput there...my $0.02 __________________ Tearing it up AER - 05/29/87-10/26/03, I'll never forget.

05-04-2003, 05:45 PM	#5
Balinju Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Malta Posts: 495	i think those fins are pretty restictive, but i also think that they can cause a high rate of turbulance is a + inpingement is applied. my opinion is to drop the other walls and change them to pins, or something else to make turbulance and that are not that restrictive. __________________ So the bullet proof vest aint a $hit when d laser is pointed to your head Kid

05-04-2003, 07:39 PM	#6
bigben2k Responsible for 2% of all the posts here. Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas, U.S.A. Posts: 8,302	You'd do well to get rid of the inner chamber wall: it's only restrictive. __________________ WBTA (Water Block Testing Alliance) Nordic Hardware WC 101

05-05-2003, 07:19 AM	#7
utabintarbo Cooling Savant Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sterling Hts., MI Posts: 496	You might be better off having the passages line up in the central "pin" area. Would probably ease restriction in addition to making the design more manufacturable (WOW! 6 syllables ). Bob __________________ Sarcasm is yet another of the free services we offer!

05-05-2003, 02:52 PM	#8
tex707 Cooling Savant Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Europe Posts: 164	About the inner chamber....I've put it there for the purpose of flow restriction...I think that I have read somewhere that redicing the flow velocity could actually improve the convection. Doesn't sound too reasonable, though...

05-05-2003, 04:28 PM	#10
winewood Cooling Savant Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: in my chair Posts: 574	sorry.. this is off topic. Jaydee, your blocks are on bigben2k's profile http customcooledpc. Do you guys live near each other or work together? I would like to bounce some things off you guys soemtime in person. __________________ -winewood-

05-05-2003, 04:31 PM	#11
Fixittt CNC Beyatch Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Tulsa Spell it backwards Posts: 721	God Jaydee, why dont you shut up!!!! Damn always negative! Is that a bit of Bill rubbin off on you? LOL just kidding, Why not give constructive, not destructive critisism? isnt that what we are here for? Come on, you can do it. I know I would hate to be the one to machine that sucker. Would break alot of long fluted endmills. Not to mention, would take forever on our machines. Just jabbin at you jay. __________________ Creator of the Spir@l Block Longest post ever http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&postid=43808#post43808

05-05-2003, 06:49 PM	#17
Fixittt CNC Beyatch Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Tulsa Spell it backwards Posts: 721	flame. But he is right. now let me ask a question. What thought pattern and what if any calcs have you done when you started drawing? IE. What was your insperation? I can tell you that it is perfectly fine if you just sat down and started drawing. That is how alot of people, even I sometimes do it. Just to see what comes out. __________________ Creator of the Spir@l Block Longest post ever http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?s=&postid=43808#post43808

05-07-2003, 07:43 AM	#20
JCYC5 Cooling Savant Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 102	Sorry to be offtopic, but those looks great... What program did you use for them?

05-07-2003, 08:26 AM	#21
Balinju Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Malta Posts: 495	btw very very nice rendering. you have a good cad skill __________________ So the bullet proof vest aint a $hit when d laser is pointed to your head Kid

05-07-2003, 09:10 AM	#22
JCYC5 Cooling Savant Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 102	I'm so twiddly with Solidworks... argh.....

05-08-2003, 09:55 AM	#25
airspirit Been /.'d... have you? Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Moscow, ID Posts: 1,986	Actually, I don't think it will do too bad. In order to make it work I would highly recommend going to a dual output design. If you did that and opened up the exits from the central chamber into the sides non-adjacent to the barbs (top and bottom in your picture) a bit more to allow for better load balancing, I think it would work acceptably. This block will not be a WW by any means, but I do feel that it will perform adequately. While everyone else is bashing the positioning of the central pins, I think it will greatly aid the transfer of heat due to the crazy turbulence it will cause. Yeah, it will restrict flow, but I do think that it will also cause the block to be a decent performer under low flow conditions. I see what you are doing here: you're trying to have a central chamber devoted to containing the fresh slug of coolant and transferring heat as quickly as possible while simultaneously having a low resistance means of removing the used slug to allow for new coolant. I'd say go for it. I would probably compare the design efficiency to something around a Maze 3 or comparable block if it is completely made out of copper. It may even do better. As for the rest of you, give the guy a break. Just because somebody doesn't follow your pet design theory doesn't mean that they're on the path to destruction (gawd I can't get that out of my freakin' head!). The only way we can collectively learn is if people such as Tex try to push us in different directions. __________________ #!/bin/sh {who;} {last;} {pause;} {grep;} {touch;} {unzip;} mount /dev/girl -t {wet;} {fsck;} {fsck;} {fsck;} {fsck;} echo yes yes yes {yes;} umount {/dev/girl;zip;} rm -rf {wet.spot;} {sleep;} finger: permission denied

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