Help with Setup

Semper Fi · 10-20-2003, 11:09 PM

Idling @ 40c with a maze4, dtek procore/shroud/190cfm delta, hydor L30, bayres and about 2-3 feet of tubing. Room temp is about 74 degrees max.

I took my GPU block out of the loop to try to cool the temps but it didnt help anything. Took the 3.2c out and lapped the IHS, dropped the temps a few degrees but nothing remarkable. Placed a BB sized drop of ceramique in the center of the IHS as per Arctic Silvers instructions, but no diff in temps from spreading it paper thin with a razor. I tried screwing down the bolts much tighter then they were before, to the point where its very hard to turn the nuts by hand. That seemed to be the best decrease in temps, dropping me down to 40c and allowing me to get into windows and bench @ 3.8ghz.

I've been told many things, "maze 4 sucks", "you need a better pump", "get a better rad". Other people with the exact same setup are getting 5-15c lower temps than I am @ idle and their ambient temps seem much higher. I am considering buying a Cascade, but is there something else here Im missing?

running a 3.2c @ 1.6v on a MAX3

joemac · 10-20-2003, 11:15 PM

Post a picture of your setup – a picture is worth a thousand words.

BrianW · 10-21-2003, 12:40 AM

What was your cooling and temps before water cooling? How are you getting these temps?

BrianW

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 01:09 AM

Ive always had WC on this rig, never used the 3.2c with air/any other hardware.

The highest Ive ever seen the temps was 55, after prime95 for hours in a hot room.

edit where the best place to host pics?

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 01:12 AM

flow goes pump->rad->cpu->res

joemac · 10-21-2003, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Semper Fi
flow goes pump->rad->cpu->res

The configuration itself is a whole debate in itself. As for your pictures - Just make sure that your pictures are under 75k and add them in here.

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 01:31 AM

waterblock

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 01:31 AM

sideshot

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 01:32 AM

reservoir, whole system is clear of bubbles, this res is just very difficult to cmpletely bleed.

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 01:33 AM

gratuitus 9800 air cooling mod. Going back to Maze4 GPU block soon

joemac · 10-21-2003, 01:47 AM

I think the trouble is with your fan. It should be facing the other way.

:Notice please hold the flames:

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 01:55 AM

pull the air instead of push?

joemac · 10-21-2003, 02:10 AM

No place it on the other side of your rad - The way you have it now it appears that the air flow is restricted by the case. I had one of my buyer (A compunurse) do the same thing after he moved the fan his temps dropped some.

Boli · 10-21-2003, 11:50 AM

I would go pump > CPU > RAD > RES for your setup if anything to help organise that tubing out.

Though whatever possessed you to buy a bayres is beyond me - they are decidedly poo.

~ Boli

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 12:42 PM

You make stupid descisions when you don't know anything about what you're diving into.

Could the bayres be restricting the flow at all?

Boli · 10-21-2003, 01:22 PM

I don't know about the flow restrictions but the main reason people use a res is so filling and bleeding is a lot simpler to deal with and that is what the bayres is useless at.

That sort of res would become more and more useless as the water evaporates (I find you need to top your system up every four weeks or so). The best res are ones that have a good span between top-ups and acts as a air trap such as the dangerden one or the Criticool waterplant one such as I use.

The bay res may look “cool” in your opinion (I don’t think it looks that great) but as a performer pffft.

~ Boli

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 01:54 PM

Where in your case did you put the res?

Im going to be adding my GPU block back into the loop in the next few days, was considering getting a res like yours. This bayres is drivin me nuts. The opening is actually lower then the top wall of the res, making it impossible to completely bleed the system. Very poorly designed. I like the look of the dual bay res they have now at DD, looks like its much better designed as well, but Id rather just get the Criticool waterplant.

V12|V12 · 10-21-2003, 03:27 PM

Hey, that's a nice lil` setup you have there... Okay to the point:

I would: (HC=Heater Core, Rad=Radiator etc)

1) Change the fan so that it's pulling air in, and GUT out the front of the case so that nothing except the plastic front bezel is concealing the Rad/HC. (The post pic is NOT mine, but someone's I saved from the forums. My "duct" is just a simple triangle with a fan on the bottom to exhaust)
*OR if you're a "cutter" like myself, it looks like you might enough room to cut a square in the bottom of your case, and you could make a duct that would allow you to position the fan at the bottom of the square and that way all of that WARMED incoming air will be exhausted OUTSIDE of the case and not adding to increasing case temps, which will increase as the heatload from your CPU increases the water temp... And take note, most people don't seem to think that overall case temps have a SIGNIFICANT effect on cpu temp, since they are water cooling... Well you might notice that your/most peoples HC's are INSIDE a HOTASS box! So the cooler the case temp, the MORE effcient the HC will operate. A hot case not only heats cards etc, it puts more stress on EVERYTHING inside the box... So you're just adding more latent heat to every component by pulling in warmed air from the HC...
*Another thing, fans tend to make more noise when stressed with loads from pushing air Vs. Pulling. AND depending on the other fans in your case, your HC-fan might be working even harder, if it's pushing in more air than the rest of your fans can efficently remove, if not = MORE noise.

2) There have been debates about flow direction--

IE; -->PUMP--HC--CPU--RES--> OR PUMP--CPU--RES--HC etc...

From my experiences, I would go with PUMP--HC, since the pump is dumping heat into the water as it passes it through it, which will preheat the water which is going directly to the CPU! But... "What about increased flow rate from the pump going straight to CPU, doesn't that increase turbulence=better cooling?" I would stay on the side of; if the point of cooling the water as low as possible, so that it will cool the CPU, then I would want the pump going to the HC, THEN CPU since it will be at it's coolest coming from the HC. And since most nice size HC's don't restrict that much, the whole turbulence issue is muted from what I've experimented around with...

That is all for now... I'll wait for a flame from someone, then I'll respond if they caught something I missed, or have contradictory findings, regarding my advice.

V12|V12 · 10-21-2003, 04:01 PM

Forgot pic!

Boli · 10-21-2003, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Semper Fi
Where in your case did you put the res?

I put it inline so the preasure in the system keeps it a nice airtrap. - not an up-to-date pic but that part if still there:

~ Boli

Semper Fi · 10-21-2003, 06:38 PM

You guys kick major azz! Thank you for your time and explanations.

I just dumped 240 into a new Lian Li pc 75b with a window. Should be here on Friday, so I dissasembled everything. Im considering adding my NB cooler back into the loop but will a Hydor L30 be enough to move that much water through 3 waterblocks, that gay bayres and the dtek procore (86 chevette heatercore)?

I was going to buy the criticool, but Im running very low on cash now.

V12|V12 · 10-23-2003, 01:42 PM

Boli: Hey, I LIKE that placement of the res/Pump! I think I might have to do some plumbing of my own, hoping this VIA1300 will fit in my space like that!

Semper: WHOoooW! $240 on a case? Damn, wish I had that kind of bling... anyhow, about that NB cooler... I just don't see the point of water cooling a NB? They don't generate any more heat than a shitty TNT-2 GPU. To me, that's just another tax on your flow rate, more work for pump = heat, And more connections = increase of leaks...! But I am thinking about a GPU cooler, I'll have to make a prototype and decide if it's what I really want or need, being that I have a POS GTS-2, who's damn AGP it's happy with my old 181*10, so now I'm lame at 172*10.5

Semper Fi · 10-24-2003, 03:51 AM

Just got everything completed, spent about 6 hours modding and completely the new case. This thing is turning out much nicer than I thought it would. Ill post pics tomorrow once I get everything completely setup.

10-20-2003, 11:09 PM	#1
Semper Fi Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 24	Help with Setup Idling @ 40c with a maze4, dtek procore/shroud/190cfm delta, hydor L30, bayres and about 2-3 feet of tubing. Room temp is about 74 degrees max. I took my GPU block out of the loop to try to cool the temps but it didnt help anything. Took the 3.2c out and lapped the IHS, dropped the temps a few degrees but nothing remarkable. Placed a BB sized drop of ceramique in the center of the IHS as per Arctic Silvers instructions, but no diff in temps from spreading it paper thin with a razor. I tried screwing down the bolts much tighter then they were before, to the point where its very hard to turn the nuts by hand. That seemed to be the best decrease in temps, dropping me down to 40c and allowing me to get into windows and bench @ 3.8ghz. I've been told many things, "maze 4 sucks", "you need a better pump", "get a better rad". Other people with the exact same setup are getting 5-15c lower temps than I am @ idle and their ambient temps seem much higher. I am considering buying a Cascade, but is there something else here Im missing? running a 3.2c @ 1.6v on a MAX3

10-20-2003, 11:15 PM	#2
joemac Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Dallas Posts: 339	Post a picture of your setup – a picture is worth a thousand words. __________________ www.aquajoe.com

10-21-2003, 12:40 AM	#3
BrianW Cooling Savant Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Desert City in California Posts: 631	What was your cooling and temps before water cooling? How are you getting these temps? BrianW __________________ Water Cooled Inwin Q500 (Dual Rads: Rad1 = DTEK Pro Core \| Rad2 = Blick Ice Estreme, Hydor L30, Dangerden Maze2, Bay Res Typhoon Reservoir, 1/2 " DD Tygon Thick Wall Hose). Flow: Res, Pump, CPU watervlock, Y into both rads, both rads into res independently. Athlon XP 1800+ (@ 1731 - 150mhz fsb.), on a Asus A7N266-c, and a Radeon 9000 *waiting for RMA'd Saphire 9800 ultra from Newegg)

10-21-2003, 01:47 AM	#11
joemac Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Dallas Posts: 339	I think the trouble is with your fan. It should be facing the other way. :Notice please hold the flames: __________________ www.aquajoe.com

10-21-2003, 02:10 AM	#13
joemac Cooling Savant Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Dallas Posts: 339	No place it on the other side of your rad - The way you have it now it appears that the air flow is restricted by the case. I had one of my buyer (A compunurse) do the same thing after he moved the fan his temps dropped some. __________________ www.aquajoe.com

10-21-2003, 01:09 AM	#4
Semper Fi Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 24	Ive always had WC on this rig, never used the 3.2c with air/any other hardware. The highest Ive ever seen the temps was 55, after prime95 for hours in a hot room. edit where the best place to host pics?

10-21-2003, 01:12 AM	#5
Semper Fi Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 24	flow goes pump->rad->cpu->res

10-21-2003, 01:55 AM	#12
Semper Fi Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 24	pull the air instead of push?

10-21-2003, 11:50 AM	#14
Boli Cooling Savant Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Blackburn / Dundee Posts: 451	I would go pump > CPU > RAD > RES for your setup if anything to help organise that tubing out. Though whatever possessed you to buy a bayres is beyond me - they are decidedly poo. ~ Boli __________________ 1800+ @ 2247 (214x10.5) - STABLE, 512MB PC3700 TwinX Cosair RAM, NF7-S v2.0, GeForce3 Ti200 Parallel BIM, 120.1 Thermochill, Eheim 1048, Maze 3, Maze4 GPU, "Z" chipset, 1/2" tubing, PC-70: 5x120mm & 9x80mm fans. Internet Server & second machine (folding 24/7): 512MB DDR RAM, XP2000+

10-21-2003, 12:42 PM	#15
Semper Fi Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 24	You make stupid descisions when you don't know anything about what you're diving into. Could the bayres be restricting the flow at all?

10-21-2003, 01:22 PM	#16
Boli Cooling Savant Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Blackburn / Dundee Posts: 451	I don't know about the flow restrictions but the main reason people use a res is so filling and bleeding is a lot simpler to deal with and that is what the bayres is useless at. That sort of res would become more and more useless as the water evaporates (I find you need to top your system up every four weeks or so). The best res are ones that have a good span between top-ups and acts as a air trap such as the dangerden one or the Criticool waterplant one such as I use. The bay res may look “cool” in your opinion (I don’t think it looks that great) but as a performer pffft. ~ Boli __________________ 1800+ @ 2247 (214x10.5) - STABLE, 512MB PC3700 TwinX Cosair RAM, NF7-S v2.0, GeForce3 Ti200 Parallel BIM, 120.1 Thermochill, Eheim 1048, Maze 3, Maze4 GPU, "Z" chipset, 1/2" tubing, PC-70: 5x120mm & 9x80mm fans. Internet Server & second machine (folding 24/7): 512MB DDR RAM, XP2000+

10-21-2003, 01:54 PM	#17
Semper Fi Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 24	Where in your case did you put the res? Im going to be adding my GPU block back into the loop in the next few days, was considering getting a res like yours. This bayres is drivin me nuts. The opening is actually lower then the top wall of the res, making it impossible to completely bleed the system. Very poorly designed. I like the look of the dual bay res they have now at DD, looks like its much better designed as well, but Id rather just get the Criticool waterplant.

10-21-2003, 03:27 PM	#18
V12\|V12 Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio-State! <--Money Hussle! SUCKS Posts: 292	Hey, that's a nice lil` setup you have there... Okay to the point: I would: (HC=Heater Core, Rad=Radiator etc) 1) Change the fan so that it's pulling air in, and GUT out the front of the case so that nothing except the plastic front bezel is concealing the Rad/HC. (The post pic is NOT mine, but someone's I saved from the forums. My "duct" is just a simple triangle with a fan on the bottom to exhaust) OR if you're a "cutter" like myself, it looks like you might enough room to cut a square in the bottom of your case, and you could make a duct that would allow you to position the fan at the bottom of the square and that way all of that WARMED incoming air will be exhausted OUTSIDE of the case and not adding to increasing case temps, which will increase as the heatload from your CPU increases the water temp... And take note, most people don't seem to think that overall case temps have a SIGNIFICANT effect on cpu temp, since they are water cooling... Well you might notice that your/most peoples HC's are INSIDE a HOTASS box! So the cooler the case temp, the MORE effcient the HC will operate. A hot case not only heats cards etc, it puts more stress on EVERYTHING inside the box... So you're just adding more latent heat to every component by pulling in warmed air from the HC... Another thing, fans tend to make more noise when stressed with loads from pushing air Vs. Pulling. AND depending on the other fans in your case, your HC-fan might be working even harder, if it's pushing in more air than the rest of your fans can efficently remove, if not = MORE noise. 2) There have been debates about flow direction-- IE; -->PUMP--HC--CPU--RES--> OR PUMP--CPU--RES--HC etc... From my experiences, I would go with PUMP--HC, since the pump is dumping heat into the water as it passes it through it, which will preheat the water which is going directly to the CPU! But... "What about increased flow rate from the pump going straight to CPU, doesn't that increase turbulence=better cooling?" I would stay on the side of; if the point of cooling the water as low as possible, so that it will cool the CPU, then I would want the pump going to the HC, THEN CPU since it will be at it's coolest coming from the HC. And since most nice size HC's don't restrict that much, the whole turbulence issue is muted from what I've experimented around with... That is all for now... I'll wait for a flame from someone, then I'll respond if they caught something I missed, or have contradictory findings, regarding my advice. __________________ XP 1600+ AGOIA-Y (GreenLabel, UNLOCKED!@/ NF7-S 2.0/ PC 2700 DDR 10.5*172FSB(1806/ 1991 high), Vcore 1.792...@84.95Watts --86' Chevette Heater Core --1/2" Vinyl tubes --Via1300-Stealth Mod(QUIET!) ---Home made copper-tube block ---PVC small internal res

10-21-2003, 06:38 PM	#21
Semper Fi Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 24	You guys kick major azz! Thank you for your time and explanations. I just dumped 240 into a new Lian Li pc 75b with a window. Should be here on Friday, so I dissasembled everything. Im considering adding my NB cooler back into the loop but will a Hydor L30 be enough to move that much water through 3 waterblocks, that gay bayres and the dtek procore (86 chevette heatercore)? I was going to buy the criticool, but Im running very low on cash now.

10-23-2003, 01:42 PM	#22
V12\|V12 Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio-State! <--Money Hussle! SUCKS Posts: 292	Boli: Hey, I LIKE that placement of the res/Pump! I think I might have to do some plumbing of my own, hoping this VIA1300 will fit in my space like that! Semper: WHOoooW! $240 on a case? Damn, wish I had that kind of bling... anyhow, about that NB cooler... I just don't see the point of water cooling a NB? They don't generate any more heat than a shitty TNT-2 GPU. To me, that's just another tax on your flow rate, more work for pump = heat, And more connections = increase of leaks...! But I am thinking about a GPU cooler, I'll have to make a prototype and decide if it's what I really want or need, being that I have a POS GTS-2, who's damn AGP it's happy with my old 18110, so now I'm lame at 17210.5 __________________ XP 1600+ AGOIA-Y (GreenLabel, UNLOCKED!@/ NF7-S 2.0/ PC 2700 DDR 10.5*172FSB(1806/ 1991 high), Vcore 1.792...@84.95Watts --86' Chevette Heater Core --1/2" Vinyl tubes --Via1300-Stealth Mod(QUIET!) ---Home made copper-tube block ---PVC small internal res

10-24-2003, 03:51 AM	#23
Semper Fi Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento, CA Posts: 24	Just got everything completed, spent about 6 hours modding and completely the new case. This thing is turning out much nicer than I thought it would. Ill post pics tomorrow once I get everything completely setup.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)