Which Fan/Shroud setup? Vote!

[V12|V12]

Okay here is what I'm thinking, but I'm not sure if everything will fit, since the picture is off scale, but a general fit... What I'm concerned about are these points:

Pro:
1) Potentually less vibration since the top of case/Resevior suports pump and transfers vibration to rest of case

2) Cooling of pump, since before it's basically in a stagnant area of air

3) Less radiated heat exposure to CPU block/Vid Card, Ram | since the pump currently is near all 3 with little air flow

4) Incoming H20 from pump will be exposed to the coolest region of the HCore (bottom) (not sure if this will produce any noticable temp effect)

Cons:
1) The increased case temps from the incoming extra Hcore heat.

2) Hassle to change jumpers etc... on mobo

3) *Might* not fit? I'm going to check later...

So far this is all I can think of, since I'm planning on going VAPOR-Phase and doing away with all this water non-sense! J/k, yeah I think I could fit a nice Compressor and Condensor in my case, or I'll just move it out the back, but that's a diff forum topic! Thanks all.

[Aardil]

Swiftech MCP 600 pump

I actually have 2 of them ( one for each PC) I just dont have the second one in installed when I took those pics.
I will take a fresh Pic this weekend ( or maybe Monday) Planning on installing the Xp 2000 setup this weekend unless something goes terribly wrong. We shall see My son is supposed to be comming for a visit so that will kill Sunday for sure. Got Honey do work Saturday ( that I can usually get out of) So its either install Saturday or wait till Monday.

Aardil

[Boli]

If you were asking me about Ms paint, they say a picture is worth a thousand words:

Most of them being along the same lines as "Are you sure? It looks like a potato to me".



Anyhow I just had an idea:

We are missing a complete dimention here - you have SIDES as well.

Have a nice curve large ducting coming off but turn it 90* and attach it to the SIDES.

When you take off the side pannel the ducting will come off as well with it and allow full access to the mobo and when its on it'll be the perfect duct - there is no reason for it to go to the bottom.

In fact in its new postion due to the fact it will curve away from the motherboard your size concerns are reduced considerable.

OK it'll be hell to measure and fit but once it works and you close your siade panel you'll have a fully functioning duct - open it and you can get at the moterhboard with no problems.

~ Boli

[Aardil]

But Boli.....
If you duct from the sides then you are missing the point coldest air is at floor level. I know we are splitting hairs here and I really believe that either will work and in V12's case side ducting will probably be more user and space friendly. I had enough room in my scratch build monster to duct from the bottom and exit out the back. Th MB's are are high enough off the floor of the case that I dont have any acccess problems to my MB's. Wish I could say I planned it that way but I would be lying
Aardil

[Boli]

But then you have to increase the "dust factor" to codename:clogs, (i.e. it is more of a problem)

I recon the temparture difference between the bottom and the front/side would be at best 0.5*C, anyhow and if it is done right the case could be easier to work on.

~ Boli

EDIT: Duct TO sides you don't want a moveable rad play hell with the tubing.

[V12|V12]

Aardil...

True the floor has the coldest air, BUT it also has the MOST DUST! And that dust will quickly build up and offset the effects of that position scheme, based not cleaning it often! I have my setup so that it the front bezel ALSO allows it to draw air from the floor too, but just not in the absolute "cold-zone." Dust is a HUGE factor in killing heat efficiency. Not only does it block air flow, it makes for a GREAT insulator! It's got all kinds of pits and pockets which hold in air like a sweater, which traps heat! And looks DISGUSTING... I don't want to have to deal with dust as much.

Boli, you EVIL MAN, loL! You keep coming up with these great ideas and I keep turning them into freak shows of time and size! Ha... actually, with the size of this fan, you can't really make the shroud much smaller...BUT that idea of your's is very tempting, just that I can't afford to play around with cutting the case side panels etc... and then find that it's going to look either like trash, or just not work the way it's intended on paper... but after doing some quick measurements... I THINK I could make a Triangle, BUT have it ported to the non windowed side of my case and well, actually I wouldn't have to make such a steep angled one, since I've got a good 125mm of space between the HCore and the mobo tray and the fans are ~119mm! So the windowed side has lots of space I could make something like this...

It's no AutoCAD but it'll do! I wonder how long this will take to attempt... The last time I spent about 10hrs STRAIGHT, measuring, checking angles, then making a complete cardboard prototype, then trying that out and taping sh!t togeter etc... Then came the drawing up on sheet metal...SOB ---> I don't have ANY left to make this with! I'm going to have to head over to homedepot (CRAP ) It's what 1pm NOW... I could allot say 6hrs MAX for today, since I'm going out tonight Then tomorrow it's up to columbus to H00ter's for the BIG Boxing card!!! Hopkins, Mayorga, Ruiz, Judah is who I'm putting money on! GO GO GO!

[Zogthetroll]

looks nice, actually about what i'm gonna try to do with mine. except the rad will be on the bottom and duct to the side since i've already got an intake in place on the front for a 92 mm fan (figured it'd help cool the hard drive somewhat. plus i've got serious space issues since the case is only 17 in. high!!! definately looking to see some pics of your shroud setup once its made.

[Boli]

Boli, you EVIL MAN, loL! You keep coming up with these great ideas and I keep turning them into freak shows of time and size! Ha... actually, with the size of this fan, you can't really make the shroud much smaller...BUT that idea of your's is very tempting, just that I can't afford to play around with cutting the case side panels etc... and then find that it's going to look either like trash, or just not work the way it's intended on paper... but after doing some quick measurements... I THINK I could make a Triangle, BUT have it ported to the non windowed side of my case and well, actually I wouldn't have to make such a steep angled one, since I've got a good 125mm of space between the HCore and the mobo tray and the fans are ~119mm! So the windowed side has lots of space I could make something like this...

Well at least you got my sex right in another foru they were half convinced I was top heavy. :d

Nice to know you are continuing thinking using my ideas - I did say it would be harder to do but it also should give you a bit more room to play with. I hop you do "go for it" with the side panel though I would like to see some images of it in action.

~ Boli

[kusojiji]

I'd go with the 172 or 120 straight through. The heat picked up from the radiator will not be much and the air will help cool the pci cards and motherboard. You could then get rid of that lower 92 mm inlet fan. I don't know how many pci cards you have, but I stagger my cards to keep slots open in the rear of the case to allow air to escape. If all the slots are full, then I'd turn the lower 92 around to suck the hot air out. Let the upper 92 get cold air in to cool the chipset and the back of the video card.

Of course, this all depends on how strong that 172 or 120 is. I have a 120 x 38 mm AC fan that really pulls air with a steel rotor and blades. It has a lot of momentum and will cut a finger without slowing! It is also very quiet.

[Gooserider]

V12: Hey might you MS-Paint us some pics of your shroud?

MS WHO? This is a LINUX box, not a virus catcher... I know that I got a whole slew of drawing programs (with source code) along with my distro, but I've never figured out how to make them work, or how to do file attaches with this board program. (and I don't have a website to host pix w/ pointers...) I prefer ASCII art...

              Water out]
                   /|R|
                  / |A|
               [F]|S|D|
 air out       [A]|H|I|  FRONT of case
 (mobo)        [N]|R|A|  (air in)
               [ ]|/|T|
                  /O|O|
                 / U|R|
                /  D| |
_______________|FAN | |

 Bottom of case (air out)

This should give you a rough idea, note that the shroud is wider, and the angles aren't as sharp as the picture shows, but the idea is OK. In actual practice the top section of shroud is about 1.5" from the inner rad face to the fan blades. The bottom shroud starts 1/2 way up the face of the rad, and at the far end the metal is about 1/2" above the fan. The angle drops the top fan down so that it's top edge is about 3/4" below the top edge of the rad face.

The bottom fan is offset towards the center wall of the case, so that the inlet hose can run next to it, and the top fan is offset towards the outside wall to give a bit more clearance to the copper manifold pipe that runs off the top of the rad parallel to the tank. The rad has 4 quick disconnects, 2 feed the waterblocks w/ 1/2" hose, and 2 feed the auxillary blocks (currently four drive blocks and a flow detector).
-------------------

As to the question of blowing out the sides of the case - This could probably work from a cooling standpoint, but you might want to think about noise issues... In general, you want to direct any outlets out the back so as to get the noise pointed away from you as much as possible....

------------------------
In terms of sucking in from the bottom vs. a side or the front - From a noise stand point, bottom sucking is probably best, followed by side, and finally front, with the idea once again being to keep any openings facing away from you as much as possible. This is especially true if using intake fans...

Bottom suction would probably be the worst for picking up dust however, though it's debateable how much worse a bottom inlet would be compared to a side / front inlet near the bottom of the case....

I doubt that there would be much air temp difference between a bottom inlet and a close to the bottom inlet however. Indeed, depending on your room's airflow and heating, it is possible that the air immediately closest to the floor might be warmer than the air a few inches up - for instance if you had a ceiling fan that blows hot air down to the floor, or if you have radiant floor heating....

Gooserider

[V12|V12]

Gooserider:

At 1st I was like WTF is that?! Then it came to light, I see what you mean, a dual fan/split shroud... sounds interesting, but I don't think that I have the room for it and it would just add more complexness... yeah the side angle noise could be a prob... DEPENDING on which side I have my case on... If I have it on my left it will be facing me, but if I set case on the right, it'll be away... Hrmm I might just stick with this bottom setup OR go back to the 172mm fan and test out the case temps and CPU temps... I'm being lazy over the holidays, so hrmm... I'll get back with folks, thanks for the replies and PLEASE even if you don't post a reply, plz vote, I need more votes

[Gooserider]

At 1st I was like WTF is that?! Then it came to light, I see what you mean, a dual fan/ split shroud... sounds interesting, but I don't think that I have the room for it and it would just add more complexness...

It is a little complex, but not as bad as it seems. It is a bit of a mixed bag on space, but again not to terrible.
Side to side, it's as wide as the rad, but that usually isn't a problem. Front to back is a bigger issue, alot depnds on how much clearance you have in the case to play with, and where your mobo ends up. At the bottom it is about as deep as the fan frame (4.5" for a 120mm fan) but it's about an inch less on the top section where the upper fan sits.

In my case, this is a bit of a squeeze, but I was able to make it fit with a bit of Dremel work. First thing I did was to cut the front metal of the case out so that the rad would stick mostly into the area between the front metal of the case itself and the plastic of the front bezel. This gained me about an inch of space on the inside of the case. There was about 5" of space between the front case metal and the front edge of the mobo tray (which is designed to support full length legacy AT sized cards) where it wrapped up to hold the card guides. The mobo tray also sits about an inch off the bottom of the case, so I found that I just had to trim the lower corner of the card support on the mobo tray by about 1/8" so that it would clear the shroud enough to get the tray in all the way. It is a really nice fit, everything clears, but there is no waste space.

Gooserider

[V12|V12]

Uuugh! I just unlocked and am testing out a spare XP2000 (pal) and temps are LAME! I switched back to the massive 172mm and boy does it PULL AIR at 5v! But temps are crap right now... something's NOT right:

XP2000+ (1.667)@1.172 (10*172) Vcore: 1.792 (CPU default jumper setting!)= ~78W Case temp 34C, CPU 41C Room ambient... eh not too sure, but it's not that warm and I have my space heater on near me... still... temps are lame.... Might have to go back to the triangle

[V12|V12]

Well folks the decision is MADE! After checking my AsusProbe temp logs... I've determined that actually running a Totally independant fan exhaust for your HCore IS physically better for temps... that extra heat added, as someone put it, DOES matter! At least in my case... I checked back over a few days/weeks from when I had the triangle and I notice that the case temp and the idle/max loads of my CPU were VERY CLOSE! Pre 172mm I was getting around a 3-6C temp diff between Case and CPU idle and max.... With the 172mm I'm seeing more like 6-8 Idle Max, which isn't too bad, but I'll stick with as LOW as I can get!

Oh BTW- The 172mm Pic is with the XP2000 at 1720mhz@1.792Vcore

The 120mmTriangle is XP1600 at 1806@1.774Vcore

The hotter 1600+ putting out MORE max wattage still runs cooler than the less wattaged XP2000 when using the Triangle! Case isolation DOES matter folks, Least I've SEEN the results and about about to switch back... Anyone wanna buy a 172mm Comair Rotron 300CFM@4500RPM 12volts? haha

[bigben2k]

[edit]Never mind, I found page 1, and this is old.

[V12|V12]

Originally Posted by bigben2k

[edit]Never mind, I found page 1, and this is old.

BB2k.... ROOOOOOOOOOAARRRRRRRRRR! WHO HAS AWAKENED ME FROM MY SLUMBER?!!!! YOU! BB2K, why have you awakened me? And couldn't even say Hello? FOR SHAME!!!!

[bigben2k]

Eh sorry... "poll" threads keep picking up votes, no matter how old they are... My CPU socket chopping Q still comes up!

Hi V12|V12, how ya doing?