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Unread 12-10-2004, 11:06 PM   #1
nightic
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Default DDC reviewed

A couple more DDC 'reviews' have hit the stands.
Even a highly valuable one by those consummate professionals at MadShrimps.


PlexMod (translated)

MadShrimps
(Doesn't seem be directly linkable from within ProCooling.) :shrug:


For those who may have missed the previously-mentioned one:


Cooling-Masters (translated)

Last edited by nightic; 12-10-2004 at 11:17 PM.
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Unread 12-11-2004, 12:36 AM   #2
9mmCensor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightic
MadShrimps
(Doesn't seem be directly linkable from within ProCooling.) :shrug:
There was a wee tiff about a (few) madshrimps articles, being commented on ProCooling members on these forums. Copy and paste.
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Unread 12-11-2004, 12:47 AM   #3
9mmCensor
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If you review a pump, dont go on about a waterblock, just review the pump.

In the end Liquid3D, you sound like a DD spokesmen/women, not a reviewer.

The article in general reads like a POS ad.
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Unread 12-11-2004, 12:57 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9mmCensor
If you review a pump, dont go on about a waterblock, just review the pump.

In the end Liquid3D, you sound like a DD spokesmen/women, not a reviewer.

The article in general reads like a POS ad.
Reminded me greatly of an infomercial style of reviewage.
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Unread 12-11-2004, 01:45 AM   #5
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Well the DD link also included an add referal so...
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Unread 12-11-2004, 05:22 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9mmCensor
If you review a pump, dont go on about a waterblock, just review the pump.

In the end Liquid3D, you sound like a DD spokesmen/women, not a reviewer.

The article in general reads like a POS ad.
Sure he doesnt sound like a cantaloupe?
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Unread 12-11-2004, 10:54 AM   #7
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lol, stupid inline link galore.
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Unread 12-11-2004, 08:58 PM   #8
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What bothers me is that he didn't replumb the system with 3/8" tubing. Using adapters makes the entire test worthless.

That and he still has everything sitting on the floor.
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Unread 12-11-2004, 09:02 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JWFokker
What bothers me is that he didn't replumb the system with 3/8" tubing. Using adapters makes the entire test worthless.

That and he still has everything sitting on the floor.
Next to a window. He just likes the attention.
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Unread 12-11-2004, 11:55 PM   #10
9mmCensor
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Email

To:
dano@dangerden.com

CC:
liquid3d@madshrimps.be
jmke@madshrimps.be

Quote:
Hi Dano,

I am writing to you about the reviews by Liquid3D on the MadShrimps Website.

What concerns me, is not the writing style or even how exactly the testing is conducted (although there is room for improvement). What concerns me is the objectivity. This is something that needs to be present, and if it is not, it does not look well upon the reviewer or the supplier of the products being reviewed. When I see a biased review, I discount the reviewer as an good reviewer, and look unfavourably upon the manufacturer. As a supplier of products to reviewers, Danger Den carries a responsibility to assure that their products aren't being simply promoted, rather than reviewed. Unless of course the company does not want the respect of consumers.

The review that prompted me to write this email is the review of the DDC pump. My issue is that the review has far too much focus on the DD TDX block. Considering that it is a water pump review and that there are two images of the DDC, and three of the TDX, plus one of a GPU block. To me this appears as if there is absolutely a breach of objectivity. It looks like a shameless plug for another product. To me this review reads like an advertisement for Danger Den.

I have no issues with DD advertising its products. But when reviews become advertisements I do have issues. When I read a review to determine weather or not to purchase a product, I want something that is objective, not an advertisement. DD has quality products, and doesn't need to lower itself to reviews like this.

So please advertise, but don't let reviewers advertise in their reviews, as it looks poorly upon both parties, and I think is extremely unprofessional.


- 9mmCensor
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Unread 12-12-2004, 12:05 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9mmCensor
Unfortunatly those three people care more about how they look to the ignorant people that make up the majority of their work/customers.
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Unread 12-12-2004, 12:15 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaydee116
Unfortunatly those three people care more about how they look to the ignorant people that make up the majority of their work/customers.
I dont have personal experiance dealing with DD. I will see how it plays out.

It was an email to DD, the CC to the [M] guys was a curtosey.
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Unread 12-12-2004, 12:26 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9mmCensor
I dont have personal experiance dealing with DD. I will see how it plays out.

It was an email to DD, the CC to the [M] guys was a curtosey.
DD will do nothing is my bet.
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Unread 12-12-2004, 10:30 AM   #14
9mmCensor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnM
Hello 9mmCensor,

Why do you think this review of L3D is an advertisement for DD? Just because
he takes the time to write down in more detail then other sites how the
water block he used for testing works, does not make it an advertisement per
se.

Each review site is free to present data and info to their readers in the
way they see fit, as long as the test results and comments remain valid and
objective. From what I've edited in the past from Liquid3d's submission I
see no reason why he would sound biased. If a product is good then I don't
see the problem to point this out to our readers. If you take a look at
other reviews he has written you will find the same writing style and more
descriptive opinions then most other reviews;

Case review: http://www.madshrimps.be/gotoartik.php?articID=189
Cool Cases CF1 water block:
http://www.madshrimps.be/gotoartik.php?articID=157
Memory review: http://www.madshrimps.be/gotoartik.php?articID=105

Just because YOU don't want to have more info about the water block used in
the Pump review, does not mean other people think the same way. If you are
measuring the effectiveness of a pump by using the CPU temperatures under
load as the performance test, then it's quite essential to point out what
will effect performance with the water block used. If he had the gear to
measure pressure and flow then those temperature tests would not be in focus
that much.

Unfortunately, reviewing is still a time consuming, zero profit hobby, and
while in a perfect world every website can provide each reviewer with
professional testing gear for each product, this is not so in the real
world. If you don't have the gear (yet) to test a pump's pressure/flow then
the next best objective test is temperature difference in a closed water
circuit.

Thank you for reading,

Kind regards,

John M
...........
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Unread 12-12-2004, 10:37 AM   #15
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Sheesh. What I see: "We don't have the equipment or knowledge to do a informative review so we just posted something that looked like it was informative to the ignorant."


Anyway, just look at madshrimps main page. It is nothing more than one big infomercial. Nothing they post is really informative.
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Unread 12-16-2004, 07:21 AM   #16
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What a dickhead.
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Unread 12-16-2004, 10:45 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProBerto
what did you reply to him?
haven't yet been writing an essay :/
gonna this weekend when my exams are done
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Unread 12-17-2004, 07:19 PM   #18
JWFokker
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In other words, he doesn't give a crap because MadShrimps is plugging DangerDen's products and that's free advertisement as far as he's concerned. Enough impressionable morons read that site, I'm sure DangerDen has done quite well by letting the 'reviewer' examine their products.

Despite the ProCooling criticism of MadShrimps reviews, Bill should probably get a 'review' of the entire line of Swiftech products done up by them. I don't think Swiftech has anything to worry about, because every review has been unadultered praise. Morons will buy Swiftech products because MadShrimps says they're the best thing since titties and beer, and the educated will buy Swiftech products because they're well engineered and perform better than DangerDen products (when used in a correctly configured system).
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Unread 12-17-2004, 08:01 PM   #19
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It seems liquid3d will look favourably on anyone willing to give him free products, and unfavourably on those that won't.... (observation based on previous history)
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Last edited by Etacovda; 12-17-2004 at 08:16 PM.
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Unread 12-19-2004, 04:38 PM   #20
Etacovda
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Probably not, as its all been edited out...(by jmke and l3d)

Search liquid3d and you'll find some threads, im sure.
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Unread 12-19-2004, 05:43 PM   #21
jaydee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProBerto
have any proof (links) on this?
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=9710

The thread with all the evidence got pulled from xtreamreaources. JMKE is a little bitch that can't understand he has no business running a site. Note his little pussy ass deleted all his posted because he got owned and then he made all traffic from ProCooling to madshrimps get redirected. click on this and you will see http://www.madshrimps.be

****ing idiot.

Quote:
9mmCensor, jaydee116, phaestus, BillA and Joe caused this white-out for their their lousy attitude. bye bye now. go flame some other site behind their back and ban them from your forums if they try to speak up.

If you have a problem with this, please DO let us know at procooling@madshrimps.be
Our lousy attitude? That dumb shit could speak nothing but complete crap and it is some how our fault for enlightening him on how dumb he is.

There is nothing on that site worth the time to see anyway.
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Unread 12-19-2004, 06:47 PM   #22
9mmCensor
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More emails today (I feel like strongbad).

***
John [M] to me
More options Dec 12

Please have the balls to answer an email instead of just posting it up so
your buddies can continue their flamewar.
***

Next up...
***
9mmCensor to John, dano, liquid3d

Hello
I apologize for not replying earlier, I have been studing for exams,
and haven't had the time to think and properly formulate my responce,
I was also hoping Dan would respond, but it seems he has not.

I don't nessesarily think it is an advertisement, but it is too close
to being one. A review should have factual results, and non baised
opinions. This isn't journalism, there shouldn't be a slant. Here
the issue is there is the preception by the reader that there is a
favourable attitude to the supplier of the review matterial.

"If a product is good then I don't see the problem to point this out
to our readers."
No, that is the idea behind a review. But when you say, hey look this
product is good, and hey look here at these other products, then that
becomes not so good.

"Just because YOU don't want to have more info about the water block used in
the Pump review, does not mean other people think the same way."
I do want information about the block, but I dont want it to appear
like a plug for the supplier.

- 9mmCensor
***

Then Dano replyed. He said DD didn't want to get into this sort of dispute. I respect that.

***
John [M] to me, dano, liquid3d

Hey,

I you send a mail which such content as yours then also be ready have a
reply send your way, posting it on public forum is NOT done, that mail was
send to your address only. If you have the time to go around and post on
forums then I don't see why writing the small reply below would take so much
of your time.

A) our reviewer has been working with Danger Den for a long time and also
with other water cooling mfgr, if we request/receive items which are at the
basics "very good" compared to other material, then it's quite logic that
such a product can be applauded. He compared the small pump versus a known
larger one; the Small DD pump delivers comparable results with the benefit
of its size. If the price is right , then why not recommend it to people
looking for a new pump? That's what he did in the review.

B) you are referring to the WB used, see c)

C) I agree that the WB part is more detailed then it should be, but I don't
see it as a plug for the mfgr; he does not say "BUY THIS BLOCK", he's only
pointing out how it works and how it can benefit from a high flow rate.

I don't have a problem with people critising reviews at our site, I do have
a problem with ungrounded accusations, posting them at biased public forums
where the moderators and administrators only means of communicating is
through name calling and banning then to actually answer or respond in
mature way about any of the replies somebody placed, after reading number #
bashing thread. Funny thing is that they are very much aware that they are
being "*ssholes" and they just love it. I have no respect for these people.
http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=10112

Keith has been slandered on the Procooling from day #1 and he just took for
a loong time without any chance of replying to any of the accusation made,
when he did he just got attacked even more. When I tried to intervene or add
a remark, no matter what, they dumped me over the same fence; when I asked
what I did wrong TO them, they did not give an answer; BillA, Joe and
Phaestus run those forums, but anybody not enough "elite" in their eyes will
just be trashed and banned. I've wasted enough time on their little disputes
and will do no longer so.

Our website (Madshrimps) is not an advertisement for products; anybody
claiming so is sorely mistaken.

- Hide quoted text -

Kind regards,

John M
***
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Unread 12-19-2004, 07:12 PM   #23
jaydee
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Where is that bullshit smilie when you need it.
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Unread 12-19-2004, 07:24 PM   #24
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eh ?
how in the effing hell am I being dragged into this ?
WTF ?
I'm one of the mucky-mucks running this show ?

jeez, come to the party
ya poke around kicking the dogs and then whine when you are bitten
go watch tv
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Unread 12-19-2004, 07:38 PM   #25
pHaestus
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haha I slandered liquid3d. I wonder if I have any of my PMs from over there...
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