noob's first thoughts

[Crobe]

All right, I have just begun to think about water cooling and I'm trying to stay on the middle ground as far as price vs. performance goes. My first thoughts are:

Inline system contained in my Inwin Q500 case....

Pump - I'm looking at this one. It's the one in the Procooling frontpage deals and it's like 25 dollars after shipping with the deal. It seems powerful enough, and it's a hell of a lot cheaper than the Eheims everyone seems to be getting. Do you think it is good enough?

Radiator - I'm looking for a heatercore, which one I get will depend on where i put the radiator. I have room for something in the 6.5" x 6.5" range at the bottom front of the case and something like 8" x 6.5" at the top. Trying to find something with 5/8" barbs. Problems here are how to go about mounting the thing? and making/buying a shroud for the fan?

Waterblocks - I want one for the CPU (Socket A) and the GPU (Geforce 3). Both fans I have presently are driving me nuts and quietness is the driving force behind this project.

Any suggestions for a cheap water block that can handle an Athlon XP? I am willing to spring for a Maze 2/3 but wouldn't mind finding a cheaper alternative. The cheapest I have seen the Maze's for is 40 bucks... And they seem to be priced about the same as each other.

And for the GPU I may just pick up whatever I can find at a site where I buy some of my other stuff. I haven't seen many differences between different GPU blocks. Anyone have any recomendations?

Airtrap - possibly make my own? I'd like to do something more advanced than a T junction. Maybe using an acrylic tube and a couple barbs... I have seen similar ones built around here. I'd like it to be in the case though and still keep it above the radiator if I decided to mount it at the top.

I would appreciate anybody's thoughts on this.... I'm not going for looks or the absolute best performance just something decent that is QUIET. Thank you for taking the time to read this.

[ECUPirate]

HI Crobe. I have the Q500 case, and I just watercooled mine, so lemme help. It is a big case, but surprisingly hard to fit things in.. You could mount a rad over the PSU, but space is very limited. Some of the black ice rads will fit, but double check the width. You could mount it to the top panel, but it must be just under 6" wide, so you probably aren't going to use a regular cheap heater core. (the rails that the top panel sits on get in the way...) There's also the bottom front of the case, but the HDs interfere. It just depends on the size of your rad.
I took everything apart and went crazy w/ a jigsaw. I moved the PSU and the HDs, and cut a huge hole in the metal at the bottom front of the case. I found a cardboard box that fit my rad, and installed the rad on one side and the fan on the other... then I set the whole unit in the case. The pump occupies 2 CDROM bays. The eheim 1250 is quite large, so that's the only place I could put it. Dunno about the ViaAqua. Silicon hose sux... it's porous and allow some of the coolant to evaporate through. No leaks, but you can smell the water wetter. Tygon is better.
Fan: get a 120mm L1A panaflo or papst or some other quiet fan. I have a 172mm comair and it's noisy. I'm going to take all of my cooling stuff out and put it in a separate enclosure. You may not want to do that. ..yet.

[webmedic]

Take a look at this and let me know if it's like what you are looking for.

http://community.webshots.com/album/35111553UecmAe

[ECUPirate]

This looks alot like my fan shroud, only mine's cardboard. http://community.webshots.com/photo/...36851669KArMET

[Haddy]

welp for the water block u can always get an una block (una is one of the staffers here @ procooling) http://becooling.safeshopper.com/6/117.htm?885 not too shabby for 15 bucks

[ECUPirate]

Icksnay on that idea. Copper and Aluminum don't mix too well. Best to stick w/ one or the other, and since most rads are copper, better get a copper waterblock.

[Haddy]

water wetter = good.......good = no battery affect

[ECUPirate]

none? I didn't know WW was a fix-all.

[Crobe]

wow, thanks for the responses. Some good info...

ECU I have thought often about moving my PSU. My question is how is it supported up there? Why didn't you put the hard drives above the PSU? Cable length issue? I'll have to see how my radiator compares to a the fan size before i can determine whether a simple cardboard box would do the trick. otherwise some adjustments to a box would probably work... as i said i'm not too concerned about looks, as long as it's stable. Tygon is still a little pricey.... but I may splurge. I will be buying a quiet 120 mm fan as well as an 80 mm one for my PSU. I was hoping my pump would fit on the floor of my case but I do have room in the CD rom bays so that is a good back up. I like your set up very much.. good use of the space the Q500 gives you. Do you happen to have any photos? especially of your airtrap? I will take some more measurements of my case when I get home. You've given me a lot to think about though, thanks.

webmedic - if you are able to sell it at a reasonable price in the next couple weeks then I will consider it

Haddy - I have seen that block, I'm still waiting for some details on it's performance. Of course the mixing of non-like metals does disturb me a bit....

[Crobe]

Oh and I forgot..... ECU do you have an estimate of how much the barbs, bushings, and piping for the air trap cost you? Did you get it from the Home Depot or something like that? I will be stopping by there after work which is why I'm asking.

[ECUPirate]

PSU: cut the big hole out, Drill 4 mounting holes, and screw. No further support... It can't fall far, it's too crowded in there.
HD: I rounded my cables, which made them a tad shorter. Even full length, it would have been a difficult reach. I kept the HD bracket intact, and just laid it horizontally where the PSU was. Now my bottom PSU fan helps cool my HDs.

you can mod the PSU fan to make it quieter. just unplug the psu fan from inside the PSU, or from the mobo if you're lucky, add some wire to the leads, and run it through a rheostat to lower the fan speed. You could also run it at 7v by simply using the 5v rail as the ground, and the 12v rail as the hot wire.

no photos, but this should help...

[ECUPirate]

It's PVC...it's cheap. 3/4" is even cheaper, but I don't feel that the internal volume would be sufficient to bleed the air quickly. I got my stuff at Lowe's.

[Cyco-Dude]

you could mount your hdds above the PSU; an 18" cable should reach just fine (at least it does in my case; i have the AOpen HX08, which is very similar to the Inwin Q500). plus that blowhole will help cool the hdds.
to mount a heater core is simple, just get some thin bolts that are 2 1/2" long (i got mine from Ace Hardware, as Lowes or Home Depot didnt have any the right length. its also cheaper at Ace Hardware as well). thread the bolts thru the rad, and bolt to chassis.
for the res, you could just use a weather-proof electrical box. check in you case; you might be able to fit a heater core at the lower front (thats where i mounted mine). the heater cores DDen and Dtek Customs sells measures 6 1/8" by 7 1/2".

to ECU: WW is certainly not a "fix-all", but it was specifically designed to prevent corrosion in engine coolant systems, many of which have different metals for the various components (most, if not all, car rads are made of aluminum now)

[ECUPirate]

If you round the 18" cables like I did, and they are plugged into the RAID ports towards the bottom of the mobo, the cables won't reach the second hard drive. If you only have one, you should be fine. However, the bottom PSU fan sucks air over my HDs, keeping them cool.

[Crobe]

I had another post but it seems to be missing.... anyways I'm at home now with my tape measure and moving the hard drives looks better and better... I can reach without having to move the PSU (I still might for asthetic reasons but for now less cutting is good) Moving the hard drives does give me a ton of extra room to play with. Thanks for the idea.

I have some parts to a baybus I made a while back so controlling fan voltage won't be a problem I'll check my present PSU fan to see if it's tolerable at lower voltages.

That air trap is pretty much exactly the type of thing I was looking to try... I didn't make it to the hardware store to check out the parts though.

Thanks for the mounting tip Cyco-Dude, I still need a shroud though... I might buy some sheet metal and form one myself.

Anyone know the best place to get silicon tubing and hose clamps?

A little more experimentation and research tomorrow and then I'll begin ordering parts.

Thanks for all the help.

[ECUPirate]

the cardboard box trick worked perfectly... very easy to work with. I used 6" threaded rods (very thin) and stuck them through the rad and attached them to the fan. (vice versa, actually) The fan is a little over an inch away from the rad, and the airflow is quite good. (using a comair rotron 172mm 24v fan at 12v.- I would not recommend this fan due to its noise. Get a panaflo or a papst.)

zip ties are a must have...

get tygon... silicon sucks. I used less than 5' of hose for the setup pictured... results may vary. Actually, I wouldn't mind getting rid of the other 5'+ of hose (I bought 10')... it's 1/2" thick wall.

clamps: Lowe's or HD.

[Cyco-Dude]

i bought my clamps from an auto-parts store. and you're right ECU, some MoBos have the hdd connectors @ the bottom of the MoBo (mine is @ the top - Abit KT7a-RAID).

you could try making a shroud out of acrylic. or, go to a pet store and see if they happen to have a small square fishtank the size of your rad. that could make a decent shroud. any box will do; hell, you could make it out of cardboard and duct tape if you dont care about looks (and even if you do, you could use it until you get your 'real' shroud just so you can get the system up and running faster).

[ECUPirate]

Duct tape is great for making ducts...

I used it...

[Brad]

what about putting the psu where the 80mm exhaust fan is, above the cpu. I know this place sucks, it isn't too hard to just plug the psu in last....and it gives you a ton of room

[ECUPirate]

it won't fit there.. this case is more narrow than you think.

[Brad]

it will, my friend has his psu there

[Crobe]

Does he have the Inwin Q500?, because it doesn't look like it will even come close to fitting without some heavy modding. Like not using the AGP slot or something.

Latest update on my stuff is that my cables are not able to reach both my hard drives if I move the hard drive cage above the PSU so I am planning on suspending the hard drives in cd rom bays with rubberbands similar to another thread i saw around here. I plan on having the pump on the floor of the case. I will have to cut up the front of the case to get air to the radiator but that is the only cut's to the case I foresee right now.

I bought the via aqua pump off the front page 25$ after shipping and handling. I bought a ford escort heatercore from autozone for 18$. Still considering waterblocks, I could get the Maze 3 for 42$ and the Danger Den Geforce Block for 35$ from www.cooltechnica.com. I'm strongly considering Tygon, I'm still looking for a good price on 7-10' of thick walled 1/2" ID though. My airtrap will probably be similar to ECU pirate's just because space restrictions are forcing it to be that shape.

[ECUPirate]

I have less than a 1/2" of hose connecting my airtrap to the pump intake... I tried using a two sided threaded connector, and making the pump/res assembly one piece, but that caused leaks... don't know why. Maybe too much weight resting on the pump. I'd move the HD bracket to where the PSU is, etc. (like mine). It helps keep the cables from bunching up in the bottom part of the case. I've got 6 rounded cables connected to my mobo/sound card (I rounded my SBAudigy Platinum cable ), and they are completely out of the way.
If you put the pump in the floor, you won't need the elbow at the exhaust at the bottom of the res. Just get a female/female 1" connector, a 1" to 1/2" bushing, and the brass fitting.

Note* cutting the case is a pain in the arse, primarily because you must take EVERYTHING out of the case. Plan carefully, and do it all at once.
Also, the mobo tray in that case is big enough for an extended ATX mobo, and then some. I cut the excess off... it gave me several extra inches to play with. (my girlfriend appreciates the extra inches, too. ) If you mod the tray, you can also shorten the track it slides back in forth in. Just pull it out of the bottom of the case and go to town.
I have my pump in the bottom two CDROM bays, so I cut back the excess metal on the cage to where the mounting screw holes start. ...gave me over an inch more space.
I cut a big, 6" square hole in my front bezel. I used a box knife, and took it out in one piece. I can put the piece back into place if I want, and it still fits snuggly.

[Crobe]

right the airtrap doesn't have that elbow, but it's very similar to yours.

With the hard drives in the cd-rom bays the only things going from the lower half of the case to the top are the ide and floppy cables, the main mobo power, and the airtrap.

I plan on having the radiator pushed foward into the gap between the bezel and the frame and even out the front of the case a quarter inch (the radiator is 2 inches deep). this leaves it protruding into the main case an inch or less. I'm trying to avoid cutting the mobo tray just because I like it nicely rounded the way it is. I will slice it if I must though. I was also considering using a box knife on the bezel, good to know it works cleanly

cutting up the cd rom cage is a great idea though, i didn't even consider that... I will now. Did you cut out the base of the cd rom cage back to that point too?

[ECUPirate]

nope.. didn't need to. Kind of wish I had though... just in case.. could use the extra room to rout hose/wires...

the razor on the bezel is a clean cut, but use great caution. don't lose a finger. Also, if you slip, you'll slice the front farther than you want. To start, score the case lightly using a straightedge. You can freehand cut from there.