Liquid Chiller Help?

ElCoHaulic · 05-28-2002, 10:45 PM

Hi all,
I never noticed this site had awsome cooling forums! You guys Rock!
Ive been using water cooling and pelts for a while now, but I just got my AC tech friend to hook me up this Industrial water fountain chiller that I plan to use on my 1800+ and Ti500 (will probably be vmoding both soon and might use pelts also).

Ill be running it w/o a resivior so I need a TEV. Im pretty sure Ive got the sealing part covered.

Im hoping to reach coolant temps of at least -20c so I need to find the best sub zero coolant that will not harm my Eheim 1250. I read some of your threads. Is methanol/water best? Can I use Isopropyl instead? What is the highest % of alcohol/methanol to water will be safe for my pump? Ive also heard that glysol might be good. Yes/No?
Thanks in advance!

|PuNiSh3R| · 05-28-2002, 10:54 PM

I don't know the answers to your questions.. but if I am right.. that thing will do a hell of a lot more then -20C!!!

ElCoHaulic · 05-28-2002, 11:21 PM

I hope your right. We turned the adj dial up all the way and turned it on w/o a pump and it reached temp within a few seconds. We bypased the dial and in less then 60 sec the water inside froze up.

Even w/ the water pumping and a load on it I think it will still do well because it will be recirculating w/o a res.

|PuNiSh3R| · 05-28-2002, 11:23 PM

u are doing a closed system?

I don't know what TEV is... explain

ElCoHaulic · 05-28-2002, 11:29 PM

Ya, closed (no resivior).

I read about thermal expansion valves in another thread. Here: http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...?threadid=2654

|PuNiSh3R| · 05-28-2002, 11:31 PM

Oh.. TEV thermal expansion valves.. that controls the capilary thinger so the compressor always works at the most efficient way right?

Brad · 05-29-2002, 02:46 AM

Methanol and Water is the way, and make sure you use a high powered pump, simply so the water doesn't freeze. My friend has managed to have a pure water mixture still flowing at -12C, simply due to using a 1200gph pump

|PuNiSh3R| · 05-29-2002, 03:33 AM

Oh yea. as long as you have a strong water flow it's fine..

If you had 2 pumps like 2 400GPH pumps..

Have one push and the other one suck.. it would have to be a closed loop system tho to work right.

TigerOats · 05-30-2002, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ElCoHaulic
Is methanol/water best? Can I use Isopropyl instead? What is the highest % of alcohol/methanol to water will be safe for my pump? Ive also heard that glysol might be good. Yes/No?
Thanks in advance!

I run 40% ethylene glycol in my system and the coolant temps go down to -25C.

The best coolant mix is methanol BUT and I emphasize the but this is a very dangerous thing to use if any kind of open system is planned. Even though the methanol is in water it does evaporate which means that if an open system is used you'll be inhaling it. Methanol is highly toxic leading to fatal and irreversable liver and brain damage with prolonged exposure.
Ethanol (so called alcohol ) and isopropyl alcohol are no more effective than ethylene glycol but because they also evaporate are also a health hazard. I have tried the ethanol route.

Heavy_Equipment · 05-30-2002, 10:08 PM

If you use water/antifreeze, just use a radiator coolant tester. (looks like a turkey baster with a dial on it)

That way, once you know how cold your system can go, you can tailor the mix so you've got the best water:glycol ratio you can get before freezing up.

ElCoHaulic · 05-31-2002, 12:43 AM

I set up 2 tests w/ my foutain chiller.
I ran tap water w/ a tiny bit of water wetter in a bucket w/ a cheap lil pump and it got from 22C to 12C on max setting and 10C after bypassing the temp dial. My digi therm might have been wrong because it seemed to bog/freeze up there. It had been sitting around for a long time and Im not sure the battary is the correct one.
I thawed it out and flushed w/ 91% Isopropyl and ran a closed loop w/ my good pump.

I didnt insulate the hoses because I didnt care about condensation and I figured it would kind of simulate a lite load anyway. The big copper fitting w/ a red lever is the system filler.
It went from 21C(70F) to 15C in 6 minites on the minimum setting (compressor never even had to kicked on), then I turned to max and it went to 11C(52F) in 2 minutes then shut off. After bypassing the dial it went down to -7C in another 16 minites (I figure it would take under 20 min from startup). It finaly got to -8.6C(16F) which seemed to be the best temp I would get. It took another 20 minites because it kept going back up 1C every 5min.

I am going to try doing some tweaks to it and run some more tests.

AllRoy · 05-31-2002, 05:38 AM

Here is a n00b question for you, where is the best place to get any of these coolant additives (methanol, ethylene glycol, etc.)

Cyco-Dude · 05-31-2002, 10:44 AM

well, glycol is in antifreeze, and you can get that at any auto-parts store.

AllRoy · 05-31-2002, 10:50 AM

So I am not retarded...thats what I thought, I just didnt want to say it

ElCoHaulic · 06-01-2002, 07:50 PM

We did some more tweaking on it today and he didnt like the really low flow it was getting from the restricted cooler lines so we opened it back up and un soldered the 1/4 inch line ends to change them to 3/8". We found that the sensor switch tube was installed 6" deep into the coil and was almost completely blocking it!

We removed that and just stuck it to the inside of the coil loop. Its flowing like a champ now!
We set it back up and were getting no better temps, but then I noticed that my homade digital sensor T was collecting air and as soon as we chased the bubbles out it read -23C(-10F)!

The temp went back up a lil and setteled in at around -19C.

This should do fine. Im going to insulate all the lines and hook it into my system soon.
My friend says hes going to find out if he can swap out the R134 refridgerent w/ a stronger one (MP66 I think) so we may try that also.

05-28-2002, 10:45 PM	#1
ElCoHaulic Cooling Neophyte Join Date: May 2002 Location: Venice,CA (W.LosAngeles) Posts: 10	Liquid Chiller Help? Hi all, I never noticed this site had awsome cooling forums! You guys Rock! Ive been using water cooling and pelts for a while now, but I just got my AC tech friend to hook me up this Industrial water fountain chiller that I plan to use on my 1800+ and Ti500 (will probably be vmoding both soon and might use pelts also). Ill be running it w/o a resivior so I need a TEV. Im pretty sure Ive got the sealing part covered. Im hoping to reach coolant temps of at least -20c so I need to find the best sub zero coolant that will not harm my Eheim 1250. I read some of your threads. Is methanol/water best? Can I use Isopropyl instead? What is the highest % of alcohol/methanol to water will be safe for my pump? Ive also heard that glysol might be good. Yes/No? Thanks in advance! __________________ KR7Ar, XP1800+, 1.9/.44 Cable, 40gAta133, CK1100S Case, DD5, Ti500@293/623(pelt&h2o) 3DM2k1: http://service.madonion.com/compare?2k1=3340396

05-28-2002, 11:21 PM	#3
ElCoHaulic Cooling Neophyte Join Date: May 2002 Location: Venice,CA (W.LosAngeles) Posts: 10	I hope your right. We turned the adj dial up all the way and turned it on w/o a pump and it reached temp within a few seconds. We bypased the dial and in less then 60 sec the water inside froze up. Even w/ the water pumping and a load on it I think it will still do well because it will be recirculating w/o a res. __________________ KR7Ar, XP1800+, 1.9/.44 Cable, 40gAta133, CK1100S Case, DD5, Ti500@293/623(pelt&h2o) 3DM2k1: http://service.madonion.com/compare?2k1=3340396

05-28-2002, 11:29 PM	#5
ElCoHaulic Cooling Neophyte Join Date: May 2002 Location: Venice,CA (W.LosAngeles) Posts: 10	Ya, closed (no resivior). I read about thermal expansion valves in another thread. Here: http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...?threadid=2654 __________________ KR7Ar, XP1800+, 1.9/.44 Cable, 40gAta133, CK1100S Case, DD5, Ti500@293/623(pelt&h2o) 3DM2k1: http://service.madonion.com/compare?2k1=3340396

05-29-2002, 02:46 AM	#7
Brad Thermophile Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Nuu Zeeelin Posts: 3,175	Methanol and Water is the way, and make sure you use a high powered pump, simply so the water doesn't freeze. My friend has managed to have a pure water mixture still flowing at -12C, simply due to using a 1200gph pump __________________ 2x P3 1100's at 1400, Abit VP6, 2x Corsair 256mb PC150 sticks, 20gb 'cuda ATA-III, 2x 40gb 'cuda ATA-IV in raid 0. 20" Trinitron. No fans 2x 2400+ at 2288mhz (16.0 x 143), Iwill MPX2, 2x Kingmax PC-3200 256mb sticks, 4x 20gb 60gxp in Raid 5 on a Promise SX6000. Asus Ti4200 320/630. Cooled by Water

05-31-2002, 12:43 AM	#11
ElCoHaulic Cooling Neophyte Join Date: May 2002 Location: Venice,CA (W.LosAngeles) Posts: 10	I set up 2 tests w/ my foutain chiller. I ran tap water w/ a tiny bit of water wetter in a bucket w/ a cheap lil pump and it got from 22C to 12C on max setting and 10C after bypassing the temp dial. My digi therm might have been wrong because it seemed to bog/freeze up there. It had been sitting around for a long time and Im not sure the battary is the correct one. I thawed it out and flushed w/ 91% Isopropyl and ran a closed loop w/ my good pump. I didnt insulate the hoses because I didnt care about condensation and I figured it would kind of simulate a lite load anyway. The big copper fitting w/ a red lever is the system filler. It went from 21C(70F) to 15C in 6 minites on the minimum setting (compressor never even had to kicked on), then I turned to max and it went to 11C(52F) in 2 minutes then shut off. After bypassing the dial it went down to -7C in another 16 minites (I figure it would take under 20 min from startup). It finaly got to -8.6C(16F) which seemed to be the best temp I would get. It took another 20 minites because it kept going back up 1C every 5min. I am going to try doing some tweaks to it and run some more tests. __________________ KR7Ar, XP1800+, 1.9/.44 Cable, 40gAta133, CK1100S Case, DD5, Ti500@293/623(pelt&h2o) 3DM2k1: http://service.madonion.com/compare?2k1=3340396

05-28-2002, 10:54 PM	#2
\|PuNiSh3R\| Foo's Been Banned Join Date: May 2002 Location: Pennsyltucky Posts: 255	I don't know the answers to your questions.. but if I am right.. that thing will do a hell of a lot more then -20C!!!

05-28-2002, 11:23 PM	#4
\|PuNiSh3R\| Foo's Been Banned Join Date: May 2002 Location: Pennsyltucky Posts: 255	u are doing a closed system? I don't know what TEV is... explain

05-28-2002, 11:31 PM	#6
\|PuNiSh3R\| Foo's Been Banned Join Date: May 2002 Location: Pennsyltucky Posts: 255	Oh.. TEV thermal expansion valves.. that controls the capilary thinger so the compressor always works at the most efficient way right?

05-29-2002, 03:33 AM	#8
\|PuNiSh3R\| Foo's Been Banned Join Date: May 2002 Location: Pennsyltucky Posts: 255	Oh yea. as long as you have a strong water flow it's fine.. If you had 2 pumps like 2 400GPH pumps.. Have one push and the other one suck.. it would have to be a closed loop system tho to work right.

05-30-2002, 10:08 PM	#10
Heavy_Equipment Cooling Savant Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Newmarket, Ontario, Canada Posts: 282	If you use water/antifreeze, just use a radiator coolant tester. (looks like a turkey baster with a dial on it) That way, once you know how cold your system can go, you can tailor the mix so you've got the best water:glycol ratio you can get before freezing up.

05-31-2002, 05:38 AM	#12
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	Here is a n00b question for you, where is the best place to get any of these coolant additives (methanol, ethylene glycol, etc.)

05-31-2002, 10:44 AM	#13
Cyco-Dude Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Dayton, Ohio Posts: 836	well, glycol is in antifreeze, and you can get that at any auto-parts store.

05-31-2002, 10:50 AM	#14
AllRoy Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 67	So I am not retarded...thats what I thought, I just didnt want to say it

06-01-2002, 07:50 PM	#15
ElCoHaulic Cooling Neophyte Join Date: May 2002 Location: Venice,CA (W.LosAngeles) Posts: 10	We did some more tweaking on it today and he didnt like the really low flow it was getting from the restricted cooler lines so we opened it back up and un soldered the 1/4 inch line ends to change them to 3/8". We found that the sensor switch tube was installed 6" deep into the coil and was almost completely blocking it! We removed that and just stuck it to the inside of the coil loop. Its flowing like a champ now! We set it back up and were getting no better temps, but then I noticed that my homade digital sensor T was collecting air and as soon as we chased the bubbles out it read -23C(-10F)! The temp went back up a lil and setteled in at around -19C. This should do fine. Im going to insulate all the lines and hook it into my system soon. My friend says hes going to find out if he can swap out the R134 refridgerent w/ a stronger one (MP66 I think) so we may try that also. __________________ KR7Ar, XP1800+, 1.9/.44 Cable, 40gAta133, CK1100S Case, DD5, Ti500@293/623(pelt&h2o) 3DM2k1: http://service.madonion.com/compare?2k1=3340396

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