Go Back   Pro/Forums > ProCooling Technical Discussions > General Liquid/Water Cooling Discussion > Water Block Design / Construction
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar JavaChat Mark Forums Read

Water Block Design / Construction Building your own block? Need info on designing one? Heres where to do it

Reply
Thread Tools
Unread 02-13-2003, 08:00 AM   #1
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default My single macro fin dual channel waterblock design

hello

basically, im doing a "budget" watercooling system, but that doesnt mean i want crappy performance !

there is a nice big macro fin that runs over the core and continues to help divide the flow of the water

the fin is 2mm high

i will be drilling with a 6mm drill down .5mm all around the channels to help create turbulance

it is bolted to the motherboard straight through the copper block

(its made of copper

the top will be a 10mm perspex top which is screwed down at ~14 places combined with silicon evenly speard over the copper

(this was reccormended by my friend jamicon or m00j )

please let me know what you think !

(i havent finished all the measurements yet obiously )

cheers
Attached Images
File Type: jpg topview_beta2.jpg (48.6 KB, 369 views)
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2003, 08:15 AM   #2
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

also:

the mill i will be using isnt a CNC one ... its the one at my school

i feel abit... wussy with this design ive had a quick look at some of the other very impressive designs and im impressed! i think i will continue to hang around here

i would also like to know 2 other things:

where can i get some 1/2" barbs that wont corrode when used with copper

where can i get some spring bolts for my waterblock/mobo

cheers !
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2003, 08:49 AM   #3
gone_fishin
Cooling Savant
 
gone_fishin's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Da UP
Posts: 517
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Spamz0r
also:

the mill i will be using isnt a CNC one ... its the one at my school

i feel abit... wussy with this design ive had a quick look at some of the other very impressive designs and im impressed! i think i will continue to hang around here

i would also like to know 2 other things:

where can i get some 1/2" barbs that wont corrode when used with copper

where can i get some spring bolts for my waterblock/mobo

cheers !
Your local hardware store will have springs and bolts and nuts. You will be doing more work drilling and tapping 14 holes than is necessary, four will do the job with a thick and stiff top along with a plumbers gasket material. Use brass barbs also found at the hardware store although there are more exotic hose connections you could scour the online stores for. Good luck on your project and post up some pics when your done.
gone_fishin is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2003, 04:05 PM   #4
Blackeagle
Thermophile
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: U.S.A = Michigan
Posts: 1,243
Default

Why not a singel fin, instead of 3-??? the more you have the better the cooling.
Blackeagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2003, 05:21 PM   #5
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

the largest mill bit my school has (widest more like it) is 6mm the channel is 16mm wide so 16 - 6 - 4 - 6 its the best i can do

i was thinking 14 was alittle to much ...

explain the plumbers gasket material ?

and i certainly will have pics

im getting a heatercore this weekend, the copper and perspex block on monday which leaves the tubing and a pump
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2003, 05:50 PM   #6
jaydee
Put up or Shut Up
 
jaydee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
Default

I think this block is totally wrong, and I will tell you my thoughts when I get home tonight. I think you can get better performance with half the milling!
jaydee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-13-2003, 09:23 PM   #7
jaydee
Put up or Shut Up
 
jaydee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
Default

Errrr, maybe I am looking at this wrong? I see a middle inlet, with the water going up, then spliting two ways and then down both sides of the middle and then routed into one outlet? Why not just one big channel in the middle with thre or 4 fins? The core is what you need to cool not the whole block. If you can successfully cool the core with a middle inlet then you need not worry about the rest.

Anyway if you totally disregard my thought, which is fine because I can be, have been, and will be totally wrong, then at least move the out let closer to the inlet so you have more room to seal and more room for the mounting hardware. No reason for the outlet to be so far back. Back just far enough for the water to merge effectively into one.

Good luck, looks like a "cool" project! Keep us posted.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg spamzor.jpg (10.2 KB, 281 views)
jaydee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 01:08 AM   #8
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by jaydee116
Errrr, maybe I am looking at this wrong? I see a middle inlet, with the water going up, then spliting two ways and then down both sides of the middle and then routed into one outlet? Why not just one big channel in the middle with thre or 4 fins? The core is what you need to cool not the whole block. If you can successfully cool the core with a middle inlet then you need not worry about the rest.

Anyway if you totally disregard my thought, which is fine because I can be, have been, and will be totally wrong, then at least move the out let closer to the inlet so you have more room to seal and more room for the mounting hardware. No reason for the outlet to be so far back. Back just far enough for the water to merge effectively into one.

Good luck, looks like a "cool" project! Keep us posted.
i agree about the 90o turns however i would like to do a fin design but my schools smallest milling bitis 6mm wide....

which really sucks

the more i think about it the more i want to pay someone with a CNC to do it....

ill have more of a play with my design

imight end up with a complete cathar clone if i get a CNC machine :shrug:
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 01:21 AM   #9
jaydee
Put up or Shut Up
 
jaydee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Spamz0r
i agree about the 90o turns however i would like to do a fin design but my schools smallest milling bitis 6mm wide....

which really sucks

the more i think about it the more i want to pay someone with a CNC to do it....

ill have more of a play with my design

imight end up with a complete cathar clone if i get a CNC machine :shrug:
You certainly do not need CNC for a Cathar Clone! Those are strait cuts. Shouldn't be a problem. The hard part is getting a end mill that small. I can get them but I don't have a damn collet on my mill small enough yet. Maybe give Cathar a jingle if you havn't already. I think you both are at least on the same continent. He might have some sources for milling stuff and or a good machine shop.
jaydee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 01:45 AM   #10
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

ive twice asked cathar for one of his blocks but twicec cancecld due to... guess what.... lack of money

he lives in melborne, i live in brisbane.... that is a large distance !

so i doubt he would have any contacts in my area

i want to get it CNC'd as i dont want to buy a part to do the block

so i just need to find someone whom will do it for me
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 02:11 AM   #11
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

ok heres a few of my ideas (some obiously stolen :P)
Attached Images
File Type: jpg topview_beta3.jpg (35.5 KB, 260 views)
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 04:32 AM   #12
Blackeagle
Thermophile
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: U.S.A = Michigan
Posts: 1,243
Default

While your school doesn't have the bits you really need, bits are a whole lot cheaper than mills.

Why not buy yourself a couple small 2mm bits. these won't break near as easy as the smaller ones some guys are using now. And would allow a much greater design flexablity and a higher number of channels/fins for better cooling.
Blackeagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 05:01 AM   #13
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Blackeagle
While your school doesn't have the bits you really need, bits are a whole lot cheaper than mills.

Why not buy yourself a couple small 2mm bits. these won't break near as easy as the smaller ones some guys are using now. And would allow a much greater design flexablity and a higher number of channels/fins for better cooling.

well ... ill be paying a company to do it...

its just easier
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 04:47 PM   #14
Cathar
Thermophile
 
Cathar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,538
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Spamz0r
well ... ill be paying a company to do it...

its just easier
If it's a one-off job, expect to pay in the order of $300-500 at the least.

Machine shops are great for doing things, but not cheap. They don't usually carry everything they need to do a job when it comes in. They then order in parts and materials, and then do the job, which requires setup and fairly close manual operation because it's the first job. Basically you pay quite a bit for a one-off job at a machine job. If you then ask for 20 or more, the costs per item will drop dramatically because the setup costs get amortised over the batch.
Cathar is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 06:55 PM   #15
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Cathar
If it's a one-off job, expect to pay in the order of $300-500 at the least.

Machine shops are great for doing things, but not cheap. They don't usually carry everything they need to do a job when it comes in. They then order in parts and materials, and then do the job, which requires setup and fairly close manual operation because it's the first job. Basically you pay quite a bit for a one-off job at a machine job. If you then ask for 20 or more, the costs per item will drop dramatically because the setup costs get amortised over the batch.
i dont know where youve been shopping but i got a quote for around $20... alot cheaper me thinks

although nice to see you here cathar
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 07:07 PM   #16
Cathar
Thermophile
 
Cathar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,538
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Spamz0r
i dont know where youve been shopping but i got a quote for around $20... alot cheaper me thinks

although nice to see you here cathar
A quote to do what exactly? No machine shop will charge just $20 to do milling. $20 won't even buy the mill bit.
Cathar is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 07:23 PM   #17
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

mill it !

my friend had his block milled for $6
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 07:55 PM   #18
jaydee
Put up or Shut Up
 
jaydee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Spamz0r
mill it !

my friend had his block milled for $6
What the?

Quote:
5 Australian Dollar = 2.96180 US Dollar
5 US Dollar (USD) = 8.44081 Australian Dollar (AUD)
They are doing it for less than free? Machine shops around here charge $60an hour.

Quote:
Personal Currency
Converterâ„¢


60 US dollars (noon) = 99.28 Australian dollars
They laugh at people that bring in such small projects. The tooling alone is worth more than the block?

If this place is legit, CATHAR, needs to find it an have his WW's done there!
jaydee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 08:07 PM   #19
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by jaydee116
What the?



They are doing it for less than free? Machine shops around here charge $60an hour.



They laugh at people that bring in such small projects. The tooling alone is worth more than the block?

If this place is legit, CATHAR, needs to find it an have his WW's done there!
i dont know if they advertise the Aus dollar on the news but atm its something like $1 us = 59 Aus cents
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 08:38 PM   #20
pippin88
Cooling Savant
 
pippin88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Australia
Posts: 285
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by jaydee116
You certainly do not need CNC for a Cathar Clone! Those are strait cuts. Shouldn't be a problem. The hard part is getting a end mill that small. I can get them but I don't have a damn collet on my mill small enough yet. Maybe give Cathar a jingle if you havn't already. I think you both are at least on the same continent. He might have some sources for milling stuff and or a good machine shop.
Or just use a slitting saw: http://forums.procooling.com/vbb/sho...&threadid=5781
pippin88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 09:03 PM   #21
jaydee
Put up or Shut Up
 
jaydee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Spamz0r
i dont know if they advertise the Aus dollar on the news but atm its something like $1 us = 59 Aus cents
I used an on-line converter that says it is up to date as of today.

Here is a different one:

Quote:
1.00 USD
United States Dollars = 1.68890 AUD
Australia Dollars
1 USD = 1.68890 AUD 1 AUD = 0.592100 USD
I think this one is right.

http://www.xe.com/ucc/full.shtml
jaydee is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 10:38 PM   #22
Cathar
Thermophile
 
Cathar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 2,538
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Spamz0r
mill it !

my friend had his block milled for $6
I'm sorry, but unless they are doing all of the following:

1) Not charging for machine time
2) Not charging for tools
3) Not charging tax
4) Not charging for labour

There is no way in hell that a professional machine shop will be milling a block for $20 AUD (about $10 USD pre-tax), not unless they are a good friend, in which case maybe they're just asking for a token amount.

The professional machinists I use are charging around $70/hour (Australian dollars) for their time, which includes use of a large 4-axis CNC mill (not that I use all 4), and that excludes ongoing tooling costs. That is cheap. Many machine shops were asking for $100/hr, some up to $200/hr.

The Australian minimum wage is around $10/hour. A machinist typically earns $25-40/hour in wages.

If these guys are doing it for you as a favor, then just say so. The prices you're talking about are simply not realistic by any company interested in putting dinner on the table for themselves, let alone their wife and kids.
Cathar is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-14-2003, 10:55 PM   #23
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

i dont really care if you belive me or not, these arnt mates rates !

compucut is the name of the business
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-15-2003, 01:06 AM   #24
Spamz0r
Cooling Neophyte
 
Spamz0r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Brisbane Austrailia (or where my computer is)
Posts: 86
Default

here is my cathar clone

Attack of the clones ehy cathar ?



this is pretty much your design, if it makes you feel better its for private use only, i may produce another for a friend while he will only pay the cost it costs me (plus some for my time)

but thats all i want to do
Attached Images
File Type: jpg topview_beta4catharclone.jpg (14.1 KB, 202 views)
__________________
[1700+ (1466MHz 1.5v @ 1983MHz 1.975v) 2400+] - [SLK-800 w/50cfm Sunnon] - [Epox 8RDA+] - [256Mb Kingmax PC2100 & 256Mb Crucail PC2100 @ 2:2:2:5:2] - [ GF4 Leadtek 4200 (250/513 @ 300/600)] - [ 12851 3d2001SE]


Hardware :: Modding :: Cooling :: Software :: Games :: Reviews :: Forums :: All at PlanetModz
Spamz0r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02-15-2003, 01:25 AM   #25
jaydee
Put up or Shut Up
 
jaydee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Spokane WA
Posts: 6,506
Default

I want to see you get that milled for $20! It would be cheaper for me to have them do the blocks and ship them to me than it would for a local shop or even myself on my own mill!

I think you may want to look at the new Barton core and adjust the design slightly. They seem to have a wider core.
jaydee is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
(C) 2005 ProCooling.com
If we in some way offend you, insult you or your people, screw your mom, beat up your dad, or poop on your porch... we're sorry... we were probably really drunk...
Oh and dont steal our content bitches! Don't give us a reason to pee in your open car window this summer...