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Water Block Design / Construction Building your own block? Need info on designing one? Heres where to do it

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Unread 04-25-2003, 10:54 AM   #126
leejsmith
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thanks maddog. will get that sent as soon as i can but i am not happy with the inlet / pipe .

i had some bad news today as my office was closed and all staff made redundant. i was not as i am the group IT manager but was expedted to travel 100 miles round trip to the closest office. This is not an option for me as i have whiplash from an accident and driving aggrivates it so after some talks with the directors as of the end of this month i will also be redundant but with enough money to do nothing for about 8 months. As long as i dont go mad and cut back on some of the nice things (well i can try) I should be Ok.

my plan is do nothing for about a month so expect lots of progress and fine tuning on the project.

I have also spoke to akasa uk regarding this project and i am going to buy some bases direct from them. It's a shame they dont make the bases themselfs and also dont have any RnD in the uk.

Hope to get some of the thermaltake bases soon too.

I also plan to build a test rig and get a comercial block to work againts.

Lee
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Unread 04-26-2003, 03:32 AM   #127
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Man that is so shit, 100miles a day is'nt comuting, it's frikin voyaging!...
I'm pretty much an unemployable bum and am toughtened to some of Lifes 'inequities', but even so , when I see someone whos gone out and gotten a job and made something of it only to get 'the great kick in the balls of Life', it saddens me. It's just not fair...

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I think the TT bases have more promise, they have a closer fin pattern I think, and no gap in the centre. I'd try taking the fins down to 4mm and the base to 2mm or less. carefully on a belt sander if a mill is'nt available...
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Unread 04-26-2003, 06:19 AM   #128
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadDogMe
Man that is so shit, 100miles a day is'nt comuting, it's frikin voyaging!...
I'm pretty much an unemployable bum and am toughtened to some of Lifes 'inequities', but even so , when I see someone whos gone out and gotten a job and made something of it only to get 'the great kick in the balls of Life', it saddens me. It's just not fair...

__________________________________

I think the TT bases have more promise, they have a closer fin pattern I think, and no gap in the centre. I'd try taking the fins down to 4mm and the base to 2mm or less. carefully on a belt sander if a mill is'nt available...
what do you think to hoots version he made it look so simple. If he cut the channels and had the jet to add water velocity i am sure it would be almost as good as it can get.Looking at the base he used it does look like the fins are spaced out more that the akasa one.






i agree with thining the base to about 2mm but i would still cut the channels 1mm into the base too.

i make everything in my kitchen. i dont have a drill press or mill so it's prity much hand made. That was one of the points i wanted to stress with the block it can be made with a vice , good hand saw with small teath and a hand drill with 0-3000rpm (mine cost £20).

7 years i have worked for this company 2 years with the current owners. i am realy looking forward to doing nothing for a while
but want to continue the microsoft msce work i have started i just need to do a bit more work on exam 70-215 and i will take it.

some times life just isnt fair but thats life and you have to make the best of what crappy hand you are delt.
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Unread 04-28-2003, 04:04 AM   #129
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The pics hav'nt come out, I'll check out the thread though it's at o~clockers is'nt it?...

If the base is thin enough you don't need to deepen the channels though do you?. I though the TT was closer than the Akasa! , but I hav'nt looked that closely so I bet you're right. I can't remember what Cathar said he thought the best ratio of Cu~H2o was, can you?. BB would know!! ...

I use an old Black & Dekker 'adaptor' to convert a normal drill into a (wobbly) benchpress drill. I also have a handheld belt sander that is good enough to sand off a base to a flatness that's a good enough starting point for hand lapping...

___________________________________________

I'm glad you're not really bombed out about the job, it sounds like you were well ready for a change anyway. I was more concerned about whether you're married and have the resposibilties and commitments inherrant, 2.5 & a mortgage . If you have alot of pressure through comitments it can be a real body~blow. I've always steered away from to much responsability myself. I like to travel light ...
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Unread 04-28-2003, 10:02 AM   #130
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadDogMe
I can't remember what Cathar said he thought the best ratio of Cu~H2o was, can you?. BB would know!!
Copper to water: between 0.75 and 1.5

The ratio is different in air, but I can't remember if it's 5:1 or 8:1, air to copper.
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Unread 04-28-2003, 01:21 PM   #131
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadDogMe
The pics hav'nt come out, I'll check out the thread though it's at o~clockers is'nt it?...

If the base is thin enough you don't need to deepen the channels though do you?. I though the TT was closer than the Akasa! , but I hav'nt looked that closely so I bet you're right. I can't remember what Cathar said he thought the best ratio of Cu~H2o was, can you?. BB would know!! ...


they are both about 3.5mm i think.

i have 2 of the tt bases on the way from a friend in the states.

i will try a 2mm base with 1mm channels first i think.

Quote:
I use an old Black & Dekker 'adaptor' to convert a normal drill into a (wobbly) benchpress drill. I also have a handheld belt sander that is good enough to sand off a base to a flatness that's a good enough starting point for hand lapping...
i forgot the trust dremel and the router bench.
picked up a belt sander and a miter saw this weekend.

___________________________________________

Quote:
I'm glad you're not really bombed out about the job, it sounds like you were well ready for a change anyway. I was more concerned about whether you're married and have the resposibilties and commitments inherrant, 2.5 & a mortgage . If you have alot of pressure through comitments it can be a real body~blow. I've always steered away from to much responsability myself. I like to travel light ...
i do have a mortgage but have paypent protection that will pay it for me while i am redundant and my girlfriend still lives at home with her family so i am not that botherd.
I was also thinking about selling my flat as i should make about £20,000 and then renting for a bit or working in the sunshine for the summer but i wouldnt like to come back to nothing.

just want to finish my notice as soon as possible so i can start work on the water block full time.

i sent the amd version to you today you should get it tomorrow.
is has a 3mm base with 1mm channels. the pipe inlet works very well and fits very nice onto 1/2inch silicon tube.

i plan to use the 1/2 inch inlet from now on instead of barbs.

Lee
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Unread 04-30-2003, 03:07 AM   #132
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Woot!, I got it!. The bad news is it fell apart in postage . NOT!! . Sorry it's too early for me ...

I hav'nt installed it yet, but I've ran my current block for two hours under Prime95 to try and stablise the max temp reading. The max loaded was 38.5DegC @ 22DegC room temp. I get a much higher reading from this mobo, my KX7 would of been 35DegC or under, and both these mobos are from the same manufacturer . This is from a thoroughbredB at 2gig @1.65V by the way, not a 'hot' chip...

I'll do the installment of your block later today unless something unforseen happens...
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Unread 04-30-2003, 10:16 AM   #133
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There's a slight problem with the bolts/holes not lining up properly, do you want me to drill them out to fit?...
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Unread 04-30-2003, 12:36 PM   #134
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hi maddog,
yes do what ever you need to the block.
sorry about the holes i didnt have a socket a mobo to test it with.

Lee
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Unread 05-01-2003, 01:44 PM   #135
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hi maddog any luck with the mount holes ?
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Unread 05-02-2003, 03:14 AM   #136
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Yep, drilled them out (can't remember what size). It's on there doing the job now...

It does'nt seem to perform any different from my maze3 so far, they both read (Load)38.5DegC (which has no bearing on reality, this and my last mobo are 5Deg out between them)with room temp at (approx)22degC. But!, I never gave the mounting much notice cause I wanted to be sure it was fitted down properly. I'll whip it off and do the artic silver properly today...
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Unread 05-02-2003, 04:32 AM   #137
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do you know the c/w of the maze 3 is the maze 3 a good performer ?

i guess thats good news as i didnt spend much time on the channels on that one you have and the base is to thick.

so i have plenty of room to improve it.

what pump are you using ?


ben / cathar (if you ever look at this thread)

do you have any way of working out the base thickness and fin height based on fin thickness and spacing ?

as i am using a heatsing base the fin thckness and spacing will be constant so i can only change the height.

thanks maddogme

Lee
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Unread 05-02-2003, 05:20 AM   #138
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I don't know the C/W of the maze3, and I'd trust no~one but BillA for it!. AFAIK the main selling blocks all perform pretty much the same within a degree of each other, I 'think' the new swifty is better though...

I'm using an Ehiem 1250 pump...

I'd like to see the BP thinner, also the fins shorter maybe?. Also I'd like to optimise the inlet if possible so there's a slot 2~3mm wide the width of the fins, there's no impingment happening at all at the moment...

Would you like me to send you the maze3 block?. You'd have to bodge a hold down for it though, should be easy enough, just an ally(even wood!!) plate with a slot/holes cut out for the inlet/outlet and holes drilled for the P4 mounting holes. IIRC the P4 holes clear the body of the maze3 anyway, the poly top usualy overhangs the body and the holes are in that...

I can let you have a peice of ally plate as well to use if you hav'nt got any...

PS, you'd have to make sure the maze3 clears the sockets 'lip', the inlet has to go to the right, the outlet to the left(or the side with the lever)...
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Unread 05-02-2003, 05:30 AM   #139
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Like I said before, take no notice of the 38.5DegC, it's probably 2~3DegC out at the least!!. It's the fact that so far both blocks perform the same that's of interest. I'd like for you to test them as well though for more input and to test your P4 version of the block...

I'd be surprised if this design/mod does'nt beat the Maze3 by a degree or two though. If it does'nt then the fin~area/impingment is'nt doing it's job, it'll be relying on minimal surface area like the maze does...

PS. Just a snippet of info, the maze3 uses a 3mm BP as well IIRC...
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Unread 05-02-2003, 05:51 AM   #140
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if your happy using my block i would be intrested to test the maze 3 on my main rig.
I am building a test rig and have a a7v mobo plus 1gig thunderbird on the way from ebay (thats if he contacts me by the end of this week.) So i can test amd as well as p4.

the inlet on the block is not that good but i have been playing with some 1/2 tube.

I have some ideas on a hold down for amd blocks to fit in the akasa hold down that comes with ak360 heatsink so i dont have to take my mobo out of my case when i change it.

do you still have my address on the back of the parcel i sent you ?
i will pm you anyway.

like you said the actual bios temp reading is not that important the fact that it gives the same temp as the maze 3 is what counts.

i was thinking of getting an atlantis water block from overclockedpc but the have stoped trading at the moment.

the main thing about the atlantis is bill has tested it and also it comes with a very nice amd hold down for p4 mobos that would allow me to use any amd water block.
his raiting was 0.26 so i would have a known target to hit.
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Unread 05-02-2003, 08:17 AM   #141
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I liked that block because it has modding potential as well, it'd probably benifit from a 'jet' inlet and there's a bit of work about the fins I have a few ideas on, if it really is how I imagine it to be. I've never seen a picture of the insides of a retail version of the Atlantis...

Shame he's stopped trading. I hope he pulls through it...

I got your address ...
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Unread 05-02-2003, 08:24 AM   #142
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i finish work at my office today but i am still on standby at home until the 16th yipee

i picked up this cavalier heater core from the vauxhall scrap yard 2 mins from my flat. it's even bigger than the nova one i currently use. it cost £25.

also i have a aqua bee 1000 l/h pump too.

this test rig is gonna rock.



maddog if you want to make any changes to the block feel free.

Last edited by leejsmith; 05-02-2003 at 09:45 AM.
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Unread 05-02-2003, 09:44 AM   #143
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here is the 1/2 pipe squashed to make a jet.



one is 1/2 pipe and the other as a 1/2 coupler.
the coupler gives a wider jet as it is a couple of mm bigger.


here with not jet

here with the 1/2 pipe


and the coupler


the only problem is there not wide enough to cover a p4 heat spreader which is 30mm these are only 22 for the pipe and 25 for the coupler.
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Unread 05-03-2003, 02:05 AM   #144
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With the copper pipe I'd squash it completly flat in a vice then cut of the crimped bit with a hacksaw so you only have the smoothly curving bit. If you know what I mean ...
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Unread 05-03-2003, 02:40 AM   #145
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i will give that a go.

the posty just deliverd 2 new akasa bases and the 1/2 silicon tube it's a shame i am going away this weekend.
just need the thermaltake bases and the socket a stuff and i can make a start.
I also have some alu sheet so i can make the shroud.
only thing i cant find is a 1/2 equal y so i might try making one.

have a good weekend all is there a holiday on monday over the pond too?
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Unread 05-03-2003, 05:56 AM   #146
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadDogMe
I've shot off a pmail ...

I've actualy gotten the NF7s stable at 200 FSB at the moment but with lowish mem timings, my Twinmoss3200 will do it's stated 2.5cas at 4:4:7 and no more!, I brought it for a 166 bus which it ran at 2:2:2:5. I'm surprised there's still a nice performance boost, I was'nt expecting one for 33mhz of FSB considering the timing changes,. If I had some 3700 Twinmoss I'd get low latency timings out of it, and it's SO cheap!, cheaper than generic stuff!!, just with ZERO headroom ...

I've been pretty wrapped up in this mobo, I'm quite surprised you've done that block already!, or how many days have I lost? ...

PS, that pin base is a damn good GPU solution...
It could be your mobo which cant handle low timings at high FSB:s. My twinmos pc 3200 2*256MB(not winbond) have ran at 220MHz DC with timings set to 2-2-2-5 on my A7N8X dlx, fsb and mem were synced ofcourse.
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Unread 05-09-2003, 03:15 PM   #147
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well after 2 long days i have a version 3 of the block made form the same base as i am still waiting for the thermaltake base but will make a second version of this to test for the gap is the center.



here you can see the inlet squashed at the end to make a jet.



inside you get a better vie of the jet.




the base is 2.5mm thick with 4mm fins and 1mm channles cut between them leaving 1.5mm above the cpu core.
It took over 3 hours on a belt sander to take off 1mm of the base

i am waiting for a new power supply for a test rig i have put together and i will test this block againt a maze 3 i have thanks to maddogme.

it wil also fit amd boards and will soon have a amd mobo to test it again with the maze 3.

maddogme hope everything is ok. I made a p4 hold down for the maze 3 should work very well. I also have a set of danger den springs on the way.

BE this is made with the top you sent me i cant thank you enough.

what a shame billa is not testing any more i was going to send one of these to him once i am happy i cant improve on it. oh well

congrats on the job billa

Lee
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Unread 05-10-2003, 01:56 AM   #148
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Yep, I've had a hectic week though ...

Did you leave enought room between the barbs to get the tubing on?...
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Unread 05-10-2003, 02:20 AM   #149
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leejsmith

I am also doing a similar heatsink conversion. That polycarb is great stuff, isn't it? BE sent me some of it too. What are you using to hollow out the top with? I am using one of these Dremel cutters, but I it always makes the polycarb opaque. How did you manage to keep yours so clear? Did you sand if afterwards? If so, with what?

BTW, I managed to find a good price on Lexan sheets here.
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Unread 05-10-2003, 02:55 AM   #150
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadDogMe
Yep, I've had a hectic week though ...

Did you leave enought room between the barbs to get the tubing on?...
i panic when you not around and i think it's because my block leaked water all over you nf2 board. i dont mind testing my stuff on my own boards but when it's some one else's i would hate some thing to happen even though i am %100 confident of the block not leaking.

i glued the barbs in and didnt give the tube a single thought but i was lucky this time but it was very close.

as i have made the base thinner the original hold down that comes with the akasa base doesnt hold down with as much force so i might have to use the amd holes with my danger den hold down thingy i made.


Quote:
KOSLOV I am also doing a similar heatsink conversion. That polycarb is great stuff, isn't it? BE sent me some of it too. What are you using to hollow out the top with? I am using one of these Dremel cutters, but I it always makes the polycarb opaque. How did you manage to keep yours so clear? Did you sand if afterwards? If so, with what?
hi koslov,
i use a dremel with the router bench




and cutting bits

dremel cutting bit 115

then i sand with 240 / 600 / 1200 but only a little as water will make it look clear anyway.

and that is a good price on the lexan i wonder if they would ship it to the uk.
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