High temps - did I screw up?

Agent Orange · 09-13-2004, 09:54 AM

not many ppl reply to my other thread, so I thought I'd post here for the WC guys.

here's the other thread for reference:
http://www.bigfootcomputers.com/cgi-...d=casemods;act ion=display;num=1085772374;start=75

Ok, anyway, I just installed my WC system after leak testing, and my temps are reporting pretty high for my tastes. I'm getting 28 on the NB, but 50 on the CPU isn't really acceptable for me.

My system is as follows:
DD RBX
DD Maze 4 chipset
DD maze 4 GPU
Swiftech MCP600 Rev2
Criticool waterplant
BIX2
2 Panaflo High 120mm
Athlon 64 3200+
MSI K8N Neo Platinum.

I have the loop running:
Rad->pump->CPU->NB/GPU in parallel->Y-connect->Reservoir->Rad

Someone over at bit-tech suggested (and called me a noob) that it's because of the parallel blocks. anyone else agree with that?

I thought I put on too much AS5, but I've reseated, cleaned and pasted it twice, and the temp's pretty much the same.

Another wierd thing is when I start the comp the temps are around 60, then they drop to 50-52.... this could just be the "cool n quiet" on the CPU, though...

Any ideas are appreciated.

Ruiner · 09-13-2004, 10:56 AM

What are your water temps?
Assuming the flow resistance of the gpu and NB are different, it will probably cause the cpu block to flow not as intended.

From what I've gathered, the consensus on this board is that watercooling NB's isn't worthwhile. Try taking it out of the loop and see what you get. Use a large passive sink on the NB.

nikhsub1 · 09-13-2004, 11:01 AM

And ambient temps? This has less to do with temps but I would put the res right BEFORE the pump... Also, most boards don't give a good real temp reading anyway, what were your temps on air? Do you know if the board reads on die?

Ruiner · 09-13-2004, 11:05 AM

Oh, and which way are the rad fans pointed? They should be 'sucking' (not blowing) and should be shrouded.

Chew_Toy · 09-13-2004, 12:06 PM

According to my MB my temps dropped 10~12°c over what I had with my sp94 and tornado and my is setup almost the same as yours is. I dont have a Y tho I run each of the chipset and VGA block to seperate barbs on my res. I feel these are decent temps for my setup and limited radiator power. I dont think it is because of your VGA/chipset blocks in parallel. My water temps runs 10~12°f over ambient.

Agent Orange · 09-13-2004, 11:00 PM

Looks like it was just the mobo reading the temps wrong. I picked up a CM musketeer, and it reads my temps at around 30 Idle ( from the heatspreader). Even the guys at danger den said it was most likely the diode.

ruiner, when you say the should be sucking, which way do you mean? I have the rad mounted to the top of the case, with the fans mounted to the bottom of it, and they blow theair out the top of the case. as far as a shroud, I was under the impression that a BIX2 didn't need a shroud...

Ruiner · 09-14-2004, 06:57 AM

Axial fans don't generate much pressure blowing into resistance like a radiator. You want them exhausting air from the radiator, not blowing into it.

How deep is the space between the fans and the radiator fins on that radiator? An inch or so is the norm.

Try to find your water temp at load. It will tell you how your radiator is working. Oh, idle temps are near useless btw.

bobkoure · 09-14-2004, 08:29 AM

The BI rads all have shrouds built in, but they have almost no plenum so the area under the fan motor is obstructed. This is more of an issue on the "push" side than on the "pull" side.
There is a "coolshroud" designed to add plenum. I've just used old 120mm fans, with the mechanism removed, to add plenum, but there's the possibility that this might reduce flow (as compared to the coolshroud) due to venturi (fan bodies have a "throat"). I would guess that this effect is minimal, particularly as the air coming off the fan is not a column but a torus - at least not that close to the fan.
You could also just use longer screws, with possibly nuts to hold the fans away from the BI built in shroud and just wrap with some kind of tape. You can get aluminum tape at the hw store that might work best, but if it's a temporary test you could use anything, bearing in mind that duct tape adhesive is hard to remove

All that said, your coolant temps are going to be relative to the temp of the air going through the radiator (well, duh), so if your inside-case air temps are a few degrees higher than room temp, then that's your "baseline". Not anything earth-shattering, just something to keep in mind when evaluating temps (and laying out your next case

) - and you might try reversing fan direction (even though it's against thermosyphon) just to see what that does... Oh, and those few degrees might what's standing between you and that overclock you want - or maybe not.

lordneo · 09-14-2004, 06:51 PM

that msi mobo incorrectly reads temps somewhere i read, they are usually 10-15 less the whats its reading....
i dont have that board, let me find it.

* found it *
is this the board u are using ? and is the bios ver u have ?
LAST LINE
K8N Neo-FSR/Platinum (MS-7030) v. 1.4 305 kb AMD Award BIOS 8/27/2004
1. This is AWARD BIOS release
2. This BIOS fixes the following problems of the previous version:
- Support FSB up to 450MHz.
- Fixes BIOS reporting incorrect CPU temperature.

09-13-2004, 09:54 AM	#1
Agent Orange Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada Posts: 4	High temps - did I screw up? not many ppl reply to my other thread, so I thought I'd post here for the WC guys. here's the other thread for reference: http://www.bigfootcomputers.com/cgi-...d=casemods;act ion=display;num=1085772374;start=75 Ok, anyway, I just installed my WC system after leak testing, and my temps are reporting pretty high for my tastes. I'm getting 28 on the NB, but 50 on the CPU isn't really acceptable for me. My system is as follows: DD RBX DD Maze 4 chipset DD maze 4 GPU Swiftech MCP600 Rev2 Criticool waterplant BIX2 2 Panaflo High 120mm Athlon 64 3200+ MSI K8N Neo Platinum. I have the loop running: Rad->pump->CPU->NB/GPU in parallel->Y-connect->Reservoir->Rad Someone over at bit-tech suggested (and called me a noob) that it's because of the parallel blocks. anyone else agree with that? I thought I put on too much AS5, but I've reseated, cleaned and pasted it twice, and the temp's pretty much the same. Another wierd thing is when I start the comp the temps are around 60, then they drop to 50-52.... this could just be the "cool n quiet" on the CPU, though... Any ideas are appreciated.

09-13-2004, 11:01 AM	#3
nikhsub1 c00ling p00n Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: L.A. Posts: 758	And ambient temps? This has less to do with temps but I would put the res right BEFORE the pump... Also, most boards don't give a good real temp reading anyway, what were your temps on air? Do you know if the board reads on die? __________________ :-.,_,.-:'``':-.,_,.-:'``':-.,_,.-:'``':-.,_,.-:'``':-.,_,.-: E6700 @ 3.65Ghz / P5W DH Deluxe / 2GB 667 TeamGroup / 1900XTX PC Power & Cooling Turbo 510 Deluxe Mountain Mods U2-UFO Cube Storm G5 --> MP-01 --> PA 120.3 --> 2x DDC Ultras in Series --> Custom Clear Res "Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity." 1,223,460+ Ghz Folding@Home aNonForums :-.,_,.-:'``':-.,_,.-:'``':-.,_,.-:'``':-.,_,.-:'``':-.,_,.-:

09-13-2004, 11:05 AM	#4
Ruiner Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2003 Location: New Smyrna, FL Posts: 258	Oh, and which way are the rad fans pointed? They should be 'sucking' (not blowing) and should be shrouded. Last edited by Ruiner; 09-13-2004 at 11:25 AM.

09-13-2004, 10:56 AM	#2
Ruiner Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2003 Location: New Smyrna, FL Posts: 258	What are your water temps? Assuming the flow resistance of the gpu and NB are different, it will probably cause the cpu block to flow not as intended. From what I've gathered, the consensus on this board is that watercooling NB's isn't worthwhile. Try taking it out of the loop and see what you get. Use a large passive sink on the NB.

09-13-2004, 12:06 PM	#5
Chew_Toy Cooling Savant Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 120	According to my MB my temps dropped 10~12°c over what I had with my sp94 and tornado and my is setup almost the same as yours is. I dont have a Y tho I run each of the chipset and VGA block to seperate barbs on my res. I feel these are decent temps for my setup and limited radiator power. I dont think it is because of your VGA/chipset blocks in parallel. My water temps runs 10~12°f over ambient.

09-13-2004, 11:00 PM	#6
Agent Orange Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada Posts: 4	Looks like it was just the mobo reading the temps wrong. I picked up a CM musketeer, and it reads my temps at around 30 Idle ( from the heatspreader). Even the guys at danger den said it was most likely the diode. ruiner, when you say the should be sucking, which way do you mean? I have the rad mounted to the top of the case, with the fans mounted to the bottom of it, and they blow theair out the top of the case. as far as a shroud, I was under the impression that a BIX2 didn't need a shroud...

09-14-2004, 06:57 AM	#7
Ruiner Cooling Savant Join Date: May 2003 Location: New Smyrna, FL Posts: 258	Axial fans don't generate much pressure blowing into resistance like a radiator. You want them exhausting air from the radiator, not blowing into it. How deep is the space between the fans and the radiator fins on that radiator? An inch or so is the norm. Try to find your water temp at load. It will tell you how your radiator is working. Oh, idle temps are near useless btw.

09-14-2004, 08:29 AM	#8
bobkoure Cooling Savant Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: USA - Boston area Posts: 798	The BI rads all have shrouds built in, but they have almost no plenum so the area under the fan motor is obstructed. This is more of an issue on the "push" side than on the "pull" side. There is a "coolshroud" designed to add plenum. I've just used old 120mm fans, with the mechanism removed, to add plenum, but there's the possibility that this might reduce flow (as compared to the coolshroud) due to venturi (fan bodies have a "throat"). I would guess that this effect is minimal, particularly as the air coming off the fan is not a column but a torus - at least not that close to the fan. You could also just use longer screws, with possibly nuts to hold the fans away from the BI built in shroud and just wrap with some kind of tape. You can get aluminum tape at the hw store that might work best, but if it's a temporary test you could use anything, bearing in mind that duct tape adhesive is hard to remove All that said, your coolant temps are going to be relative to the temp of the air going through the radiator (well, duh), so if your inside-case air temps are a few degrees higher than room temp, then that's your "baseline". Not anything earth-shattering, just something to keep in mind when evaluating temps (and laying out your next case ) - and you might try reversing fan direction (even though it's against thermosyphon) just to see what that does... Oh, and those few degrees might what's standing between you and that overclock you want - or maybe not.

09-14-2004, 06:51 PM	#9
lordneo Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: VA, USA Posts: 2	that msi mobo incorrectly reads temps somewhere i read, they are usually 10-15 less the whats its reading.... i dont have that board, let me find it. * found it * is this the board u are using ? and is the bios ver u have ? LAST LINE K8N Neo-FSR/Platinum (MS-7030) v. 1.4 305 kb AMD Award BIOS 8/27/2004 1. This is AWARD BIOS release 2. This BIOS fixes the following problems of the previous version: - Support FSB up to 450MHz. - Fixes BIOS reporting incorrect CPU temperature.

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