BI Pro radiator sufficient for a complete Waterchill system?

mange_ · 04-19-2005, 01:53 PM

I have my eyes fixed on a system with waterchill products with the cpu, gpu and nb cooled by waterchill 10mm OD waterblocks.
Space wise I would love to run them all on a single Black Ice Pro radiator but I'm having doubts about its cooling capacity.
The components are an AMD64(754), a fairly new gpu (probably nv5900 or a ati9800) and an nforce3 nb.
Case ventilation is good and I'll probably go with the L30 pump.
I will be using a 90cfm fan spaced 25mm from the radiator.

Is the 10mm OD tubes big enough to accomodate the system, will the rad be able to keep the cpu under 50c full load and the other two components on good temps?

I'd would be great if you guys could give me some input on this.

Thanks,
Mange

nexxo · 04-19-2005, 02:01 PM

I would be inclined to think so --if you place the rad and fan correctly. A Panaflo L1A pulling cold air in would be sufficient.

I have a dual Opteron 250 and Radeon 9800 on a single BIX with a Panaflo L1A, and both CPUs are nicely below 46C under load.

mange_ · 04-19-2005, 02:05 PM

What about the tubing? Is 10mm OD going to be enough?

nexxo · 04-19-2005, 03:12 PM

Asetek makes good kit --if they include it, it must be OK. German systems cool very efficiently on less --only 6mm ID.

Risky · 04-20-2005, 02:21 AM

Its good kit, particularly if you have the antartica block. 10mm OD tube works fine and it pretty standard with a lot of German* systems. You can also use components from other manufacturers if you stick to 10mm pushfits (and preferably 1/4 or greater thread).

My system evolved form an early WaterChill kit and now has components from about six different Manufacturers.

You can also buy the same kit with 1/2" OD tubing in some shops, but it's harder to find attional fittings for these in Europe and would probably be most relevant if you were mixing components with swiftech who use 1/2" pushfits.

You'll find a few suppliers in this list I have three for Sweden, but many of the european shops will deliver anywhere with EU.

*(Yes, I know Asetek are Danish but the competitors are mostly German)

bobkoure · 04-20-2005, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mange_

... gpu and nb cooled...single Black Ice Pro radiator but I'm having doubts about its cooling capacity.

How hot are you willing to let things get? Radiators become more efficient as the differential between coolant temp and air temp becomes greater. The numbers BI quotes (or at least used to quote - they may have taken 'em down out of embarrasment) are with probably a 20 to 30C differential and with a huge airflow (think 50+dB fan). Oh - and how loud are you willing to let things get?
If the answers are "yes" and "yes", then sure a BIP will work fine - but why bother with water cooling?

Hard to suggest which direction to go in as I don't know what you're looking to get out of water cooling - except that I would be very surprised if w/c ing a nb is worthwhile (just not that much heat generated there).
I'd also sugest you browse No competition, why only HWlabs

pHaestus · 04-20-2005, 10:03 AM

It's really going to depend on what motherboard you use (CPU temps vary pretty widely depending upon mobo model and even BIOS), the temperature of the air going into the rad (if it's cooled via exhausting case air then it could be 5C warmer than the room easily). I'd say it's probably possible because my S939 A64 stays below 50C with stock cooling, and it's overclocked a good bit (2.5GHz) and overvolted a good bit (1.65V).

The 10mm id tubing isn't that big a deal as long as you are using only the push in fittings to connect everything up. If you are using hosebarbs though then they will be closer to 7mm id and will be a pretty big restriction.

I don't care for the L30 too much; mine started a rattling (like it had gravel in it) about 2 months after I installed it. The L30 isn't a particularly high pressure pump and so it will be negatively-affected from using smaller ID tubing somewhat more than some of the newer pumps (the 50Z, MCP350, or MCP650). It should work though.

I would expect the Asetek antarctica to perform similarly to the DTek WW or the Dangerden RBX: Relatively big improvements for increasing flow rate from 0.25 to 1GPM or so and then diminishing returns. You'll want to get "above that knee" and then it doesn't matter much.

mange_ · 04-20-2005, 10:30 AM

Thank you for all the answers, I'm replanning my aproach.
I can get the waterchill 10mm OD blocks cheap, thats the only reason for not going with DTek or DD.
The fan will ventilate air out of the case through the radiator, the reason beeing astethic because of the case construction.
I might be able to fit a dtek procore instead of the BIP, and seeing that the Waterchill blocks have 1/4" threads (right?) I could just change all the fittings to bigger ones and use 3/8 or 1/2 tubing throughout the system, would that be an improvement?

pHaestus what would you suggest instead of the L30? I can get a good deal on the CSP750M2 but I get the feeling from this forum that it's little more then pure shit..?

pHaestus · 04-20-2005, 10:37 AM

I would actually suggest that you stick with the BI Pro and mount it outside the back of the case with the Swiftech rad box instead of going to the ProCore. You'll get some improvement with a 90CFM fan and the Procore vs the BI Pro, but I don't personally think it'll overcome the improvement from using cool air. What case are you using?

I've never personally handled a CSP750M2, but keep in mind that the comments you get on the internet are going to mostly be from people with problems. I know lots of people used Rios and the cheapo pumps that Becooling sold and were happy even though my opinion was that they were shoddy.

It sounds like you aren't too concerned about noise if you have a 90 CFM fan. So why cool the nb with water? It'll lower performance of the other wbs, yield minimal to no performance boost, and there's no way you'll be able to hear a stock fan over the 120mm you're using. For AMD64 the mem controller isnt even on NB so I can't imagine it being too big a deal to air cool...

mange_ · 04-20-2005, 10:46 AM

I'm going to use a <25dB fan so I guess it will be something like 40-50cfm, can't understand where I got 90cfm from..

The case is an Arctic Cooling Silentium T1 and the reason for the rad-placement is that I want to replace the 2x80mm top fans with the single 120mm fan and the rad. Case design.

What you pHaestus and bobkoure are saying makes good sence so I guess I'm ditching the nb-wb.

Thanks,
mange_

pHaestus · 04-20-2005, 11:17 AM

Looking at that case design and airflow, I don't see any reason why you couldn't put cool air from outside through the radiator at the rear. Or even better make a duct from the top of case to the rear and make a vent on the top for air to come into the BI Pro. Turbokeu had a really nice example of that in his PC-70.

04-19-2005, 01:53 PM	#1
mange_ Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Linkoping, Sweden Posts: 13	BI Pro radiator sufficient for a complete Waterchill system? I have my eyes fixed on a system with waterchill products with the cpu, gpu and nb cooled by waterchill 10mm OD waterblocks. Space wise I would love to run them all on a single Black Ice Pro radiator but I'm having doubts about its cooling capacity. The components are an AMD64(754), a fairly new gpu (probably nv5900 or a ati9800) and an nforce3 nb. Case ventilation is good and I'll probably go with the L30 pump. I will be using a 90cfm fan spaced 25mm from the radiator. Is the 10mm OD tubes big enough to accomodate the system, will the rad be able to keep the cpu under 50c full load and the other two components on good temps? I'd would be great if you guys could give me some input on this. Thanks, Mange

04-19-2005, 02:01 PM	#2
nexxo Cooling Savant Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Brimingham, UK Posts: 385	I would be inclined to think so --if you place the rad and fan correctly. A Panaflo L1A pulling cold air in would be sufficient. I have a dual Opteron 250 and Radeon 9800 on a single BIX with a Panaflo L1A, and both CPUs are nicely below 46C under load. __________________ "There is a thin line between magic and madness"

04-19-2005, 03:12 PM	#4
nexxo Cooling Savant Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Brimingham, UK Posts: 385	Asetek makes good kit --if they include it, it must be OK. German systems cool very efficiently on less --only 6mm ID. __________________ "There is a thin line between magic and madness"

04-20-2005, 02:21 AM	#5
Risky Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: London Posts: 96	Its good kit, particularly if you have the antartica block. 10mm OD tube works fine and it pretty standard with a lot of German* systems. You can also use components from other manufacturers if you stick to 10mm pushfits (and preferably 1/4 or greater thread). My system evolved form an early WaterChill kit and now has components from about six different Manufacturers. You can also buy the same kit with 1/2" OD tubing in some shops, but it's harder to find attional fittings for these in Europe and would probably be most relevant if you were mixing components with swiftech who use 1/2" pushfits. You'll find a few suppliers in this list I have three for Sweden, but many of the european shops will deliver anywhere with EU. (Yes, I know Asetek are Danish but the competitors are mostly German) Last edited by Risky; 04-20-2005 at 02:38 AM.*

04-20-2005, 10:03 AM	#7
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	It's really going to depend on what motherboard you use (CPU temps vary pretty widely depending upon mobo model and even BIOS), the temperature of the air going into the rad (if it's cooled via exhausting case air then it could be 5C warmer than the room easily). I'd say it's probably possible because my S939 A64 stays below 50C with stock cooling, and it's overclocked a good bit (2.5GHz) and overvolted a good bit (1.65V). The 10mm id tubing isn't that big a deal as long as you are using only the push in fittings to connect everything up. If you are using hosebarbs though then they will be closer to 7mm id and will be a pretty big restriction. I don't care for the L30 too much; mine started a rattling (like it had gravel in it) about 2 months after I installed it. The L30 isn't a particularly high pressure pump and so it will be negatively-affected from using smaller ID tubing somewhat more than some of the newer pumps (the 50Z, MCP350, or MCP650). It should work though. I would expect the Asetek antarctica to perform similarly to the DTek WW or the Dangerden RBX: Relatively big improvements for increasing flow rate from 0.25 to 1GPM or so and then diminishing returns. You'll want to get "above that knee" and then it doesn't matter much. __________________ Getting paid like a biker with the best crank... -MF DOOM

04-19-2005, 02:05 PM	#3
mange_ Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Linkoping, Sweden Posts: 13	What about the tubing? Is 10mm OD going to be enough?

04-20-2005, 10:30 AM	#8
mange_ Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Linkoping, Sweden Posts: 13	Thank you for all the answers, I'm replanning my aproach. I can get the waterchill 10mm OD blocks cheap, thats the only reason for not going with DTek or DD. The fan will ventilate air out of the case through the radiator, the reason beeing astethic because of the case construction. I might be able to fit a dtek procore instead of the BIP, and seeing that the Waterchill blocks have 1/4" threads (right?) I could just change all the fittings to bigger ones and use 3/8 or 1/2 tubing throughout the system, would that be an improvement? pHaestus what would you suggest instead of the L30? I can get a good deal on the CSP750M2 but I get the feeling from this forum that it's little more then pure shit..?

04-20-2005, 10:37 AM	#9
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	I would actually suggest that you stick with the BI Pro and mount it outside the back of the case with the Swiftech rad box instead of going to the ProCore. You'll get some improvement with a 90CFM fan and the Procore vs the BI Pro, but I don't personally think it'll overcome the improvement from using cool air. What case are you using? I've never personally handled a CSP750M2, but keep in mind that the comments you get on the internet are going to mostly be from people with problems. I know lots of people used Rios and the cheapo pumps that Becooling sold and were happy even though my opinion was that they were shoddy. It sounds like you aren't too concerned about noise if you have a 90 CFM fan. So why cool the nb with water? It'll lower performance of the other wbs, yield minimal to no performance boost, and there's no way you'll be able to hear a stock fan over the 120mm you're using. For AMD64 the mem controller isnt even on NB so I can't imagine it being too big a deal to air cool... __________________ Getting paid like a biker with the best crank... -MF DOOM

04-20-2005, 10:46 AM	#10
mange_ Cooling Neophyte Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Linkoping, Sweden Posts: 13	I'm going to use a <25dB fan so I guess it will be something like 40-50cfm, can't understand where I got 90cfm from.. The case is an Arctic Cooling Silentium T1 and the reason for the rad-placement is that I want to replace the 2x80mm top fans with the single 120mm fan and the rad. Case design. What you pHaestus and bobkoure are saying makes good sence so I guess I'm ditching the nb-wb. Thanks, mange_

04-20-2005, 11:17 AM	#11
pHaestus Big Player Making Big Money Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: irc.lostgeek.com #procooling.com Posts: 4,782	Looking at that case design and airflow, I don't see any reason why you couldn't put cool air from outside through the radiator at the rear. Or even better make a duct from the top of case to the rear and make a vent on the top for air to come into the BI Pro. Turbokeu had a really nice example of that in his PC-70. __________________ Getting paid like a biker with the best crank... -MF DOOM

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)